Just about any large diaphragm will give you "air" frequencies, as long as you have good placement and a decent pre. What mic are you using now, and can you be a bit more specific than "preferably not wildly pricey"?

Actually most frequencies perceived as 'air' are lacking in most large membrane designs... it's why we mod mikes ;) The stuff you're looking for is in the 12-15kHz area...

Also, in any diaphragm thicker than 3 microns, though you can find this area boosted, especially with dig systems it can be perceived as harsh, another reason I started using 3 micron gauge mylar in big capsule mikes in the first place.

Lastly, to be perceived not only as air, but openness, the phase response needs to be very linear.

While our 87 mod, for instance may be perceived as 'wildy pricey' it really isn't given what you get.

So, unfortunately, like everything else, you get what you pay for.

Stephen, when you say "lacking in most large membrane designs", what exactly do you mean? I ask that because in my experience with LDC mics (admittedy quite shamefully limited compared to your own), even tho the membrane itself may be a POS, it is highly unlikely for any manufacturer to let the mic go without "correcting" the response electronically in the guts (intestinal track) of the mic. In fact, I am hard pressed to find many currently manufactured LDC's that drop below 0dB before 15kHz. What I do find is the vast majority of them cranking up around 10kHz, which is a whole other problem which needs to be addressed as well. (Is this a by product of corrective eq in the mic? Or resonance of the diaphragm itself? Or are they putting it there on purpose to trick us into thinking the mic has a good hi freq response? Hmm.. this may be good topic for another thread?) Is any of this stuff actually happening, or am I totally off base? (Wouldn't be the first time. )

I totally agree with you on the issue of openness and linearity, but I am assuming Owen doesn't have $3000 burning a hole in his pocket, and 3 microns or less is probably totally out of the question at this point.

Owen, I'd check out the Brauner mics. I have a Valvet and post about my love of it whenever I have a chance. Good luck!
Mike

Stephen, heres where i get confused, arent the 251 capsules substantialy thicker than 3 micron and are they not prized for there "air". is the quality of the top end proportional to the thickness(or "thinness") of the diaphram.
Thanks, Rick

I always found the 250/251's to have a VERY
"Silky" midrange. and not quite as much top (compared to a C12).
I think this is due solely to the transformer being employed.
:w:

Originally posted by Stephen Paul:
Actually most frequencies perceived as 'air' are lacking in most large membrane designs... it's why we mod mikes ;) The stuff you're looking for is in the 12-15kHz area...

While our 87 mod, for instance may be perceived as 'wildy pricey' it really isn't given what you get...

Can the humble TLM103 be 'modded'?

Is this service available?

Is it 'worth it'?

Thanks,

Originally posted by owen muir:

i am just wondering what i should check out for mics [vocal, mostly] that have mad air on the top end...

Brauner Valvet
Soundelux U99
Manley Reference Cardioid

Originally posted by owen muir:
sorry for another "what mic is best" post, but:

Owen,

The most hyped mics in the high end frequencies that are pretty reasonably priced are the BLUE Mouse and the BLUE Blueberry. Serious air in the 12-15k range on both and a hot output. The Blueberry has more upper mids while the Mouse seems to start it's shelving a little higher. I think the Mouse is overall more versatile for what you are describing.

For higher priced mics the Brauner Valvet and the Soundelux ELUX are very sweet. Good luck with your search.

I'll agree about the Blue Mouse. I bought one unheard and untested at what I thought was an "offer one couldn't refuse" price. I find the high end not to my taste, so I only end up using it on the dullest of male vocalists who need all the hype they can get. Which isn't often. But if you really need extra "air", this might be just the thing.

Cheap air mic = Russian Octava series, the silver one that looks like a (tacky Russian version of a) Neumann U87 - has air a plenty!

Forget the model number MC012 ?? is that it?

now its build quality is close to Zero, the mic stand bracket is crappy and I wouldnt shake it if I were you, but it DOES have air a plenty. Don't expect to much kudos for it amongst some of the world class experts dropping in on this thread!

:)

Originally posted by Julian Standen:
Cheap air mic = Russian Octava series, the silver one that looks like a (tacky Russian version of a) Neumann U87 - has air a plenty!

:)

Julian, you forgot to warn that the manufacturing quality is so inconsistent, you had better be prepared to try about a dozen before you find one that doesn't sound like ass!