I have an isoraxx and it is great! I have it stuffed with all kinds of noisemakers and I can track in the same room no problem. Not real cheap though.

Never heard or seen the other unit you mentioned, so can't compare.

I think those pre-fab silence cases are grossly overpriced. build on yourself out of mdf and save some cash. Also, the quietest sff pc's are still way too loud for recording (I think the latest one on anadtech was around 38db). You can also go a great distance in quieting what's coming out of your computer. Check out the products at quietpc.com if haven't already...

If you care about looks and value your time, forget about building one. It will always look like, well, home-made ... (OK, unless you are a carpenter or similar by trade). If money is tight and it's not going to be very visible go ahead and build it. But keep in mind that you need adequate air flow, otherwise you will not have much fun with it. This basically entails zig-zagging the air through ducts out of the box, which is a pain to build. Still, you need (quiet) fans to move the air.

I am not trying to be negative - I have been in exactly the same spot. I have decided to quiet down my PC's and fight the noise at the source.

You need a
1. quiet CPU fan (Zalman has some great ones)
2. a quiet power supply (e.g. Enermax with adjustable fan speed
3. quiet hard disks or HD enclosures.

All in all this should not exceed $100 per PC, not counting the HD's or enclosures. Is it perfect silence ? No, but it's pretty close.

Also search for "quiet PC" and "Iso-Rack". There have been a number of threads before on this topic.

Hope this helps,

MisterBlue.

It should be noted also that the air intake and exhaust baffling on the Silence Case would not be a simple thing to build. I have a Silence Case and I think it works very well. Absolutely money well spent and worth every dime. I have a very quiet room to work in now and the difference in fatigue factor is astounding!

Thanks for all the replies guys! I can't get this kind of educated input anywhere else.

I think those pre-fab silence cases are grossly overpriced. build on yourself out of mdf and save some cash.

I looked into this - I was thinking of using an apropriately size kitchen cabinet or Ikea cabinet as a frame. However, as Kurt mentioned, the baffles would be tricky to build. I had some ideas, but nothing that would save me enough of the $500 investment to be worth my time over a silence case.

Also, the quietest sff pc's are still way too loud for recording (I think the latest one on anadtech was around 38db). You can also go a great distance in quieting what's coming out of your computer. Check out the products at quietpc.com if haven't already...

I won't be recording in here, just tracking and mixing - this is the control room, so a little noise, while undesirable, isn't going to be the end of the world.

Also, some small form factor pcs are completley fanless, apart from the hard drives. They are rather underpowered, but even the slowest modern cpu should be able to play back a few tracks of audio and an avi file (for animation/film overdubs I am working on these days) and record a couple of tracks of audio at the same time. Isn't progress wonderful? :>

Failing that, a laptop stuffed in a set of drawers is almost silent. Enough strategically placed holes in the top and bottom, and you won't be able to tell if it's on or not (I've done this for a couple of machines in my 'day job' studio, that were bothering me. While more expensive, it would mean I'd have a laptop too, for live gigs.

I am not trying to be negative - I have been in exactly the same spot. I have decided to quiet down my PC's and fight the noise at the source.

Yes. I'm thinking of that too, and have checked out the quietpc stuff. However, I have enough trouble keeping my cpu cool as it is, using 'noisy' aftermarket fans. The other problem is that I'm not talking about 1 or 2 pcs at this point. At a certain point, I'm going to have to shove my old, difficult-to-quieten pcs, but, for the meantime, Steinberg system link technology is allowing them to keep fighting for all they are worth. I repeat myself, isn't progress wonderful? :>

It should be noted also that the air intake and exhaust baffling on the Silence Case would not be a simple thing to build. I have a Silence Case and I think it works very well. Absolutely money well spent and worth every dime. I have a very quiet room to work in now and the difference in fatigue factor is astounding!

Totally.

They were a pain in the ass to find, so links to all the searching I've done so far::
(Dead Link Removed)
Lots of great information in the threads.

Also, for to keep y'all from having to duplicate my research:

You must check this review site out:
[list]

I've thought about getting a Silence case but I'm not sure just how quiet it is. It does contain fans so I assume it must make some noise. Does anyone know if he has a return policy?

John,
The silence case has a four speed fan, and it attenuates my very noisy computer enough that I can record vocals and acoustic guitar with a U87 and a compressor while sitting right next to it. Works like a charm.

I just (last week) finished building a silent PC for recording, and want to back up the claims regarding Zalman CPU fans and Enermax power supplies. I built my box with a 350W Enermax power supply ($45) and a combination copper/aluminum Zalman CPU fan ($27), both of which I ordered from http://www.directron.com. Don't mean to promote anyone here, but this was the only place I found Zalman's products. When building, I fired up the mobo with the CPU fan and power supply, no HD, just to see how quiet it was, and it literally was as close to inaudible as possible with my head practically stuck inside the case. Now I'm beginning to obsess about my HD's. So if we're talking about all PC's here, I'd say take a serious look at solving the noise problem at the source: power supplies and CPU fans. I'm glad I made this consideration in building the computer itself, and I'm only jumping in on this thread because of recent experience.

350 watts isn't enoght to power my dual 1800+ Anthlon. I needed at least 450 watts. Very noisy. The Silence Case does the trick for me. If you want a lot of eq's, effects and comps plugs and to still be able to sum without degredation, a very powerful PC is a must. The 350 quiet power supplies don't cut it for these apps..

I must agree with Kurt on this.
If you have a pro facility you can't rely on a modified "noiseless" pc.
I've tried the Zalman + some other coolers, cabinet coolers and Water Cooling.

Zalman cools ok, but as cabinet temp raises(when you're using a lot of plugins) the Zalman raises in temp too... and compromises perfomance! very bad!!

Water Cooling with a peltier is the most quiet and best performance cooler ever! but needs a lot of maintance.

I'm running a Tibook now(very low noise), but when I'm getting a pc again to run the pyramix system I will put the pc in a nother room so it can "noise-out" there, then can sit absolutely quiet in my CR.

Regards

Thanks guys. Always lots of things to consider. All I can say is that so far everything's working GREAT for me. I haven't worked on anything highly CPU intensive yet with this new setup, but maybe in the future I'll need to step it up.

Originally posted by Kurt Foster:
I needed at least 450 watts. Very noisy. The Silence Case does the trick for me. If you want a lot of eq's, effects and comps plugs and to still be able to sum without degredation, a very powerful PC is a must. The 350 quiet power supplies don't cut it for these apps..

Wait a second here...are you saying the math is different if you have a less powerful computer? That's a crock! If anything you wouldn't be able to run as many plugins, or mixdown would take longer, but the summing would not change because you have a less powerful power supply....that logic isn't worth the keyboard it was typed on.

Also, if you searched out the proper power supply you would find there are VERY quiet ones even in the 400-500w range, although why you need that much juice is beyond me...

ok gonna make this a 2 parter...

Alright, some more myth dispelling here...what do you need 450 watts for? How many hard drives are in there? What's sucking that much juice?

For what it's worth, I have a P4 2GB machine - with a 300 watt power supply. That's right, 300 watts. And because it's an audio box I don't have tons of cards and crap that would suck up the extra power. One video card, one audio card. And I've never had a problem with low power or overheating.

Here's the guts:
Asus P4PE mobo with onboard LAN
Intel P4 2Ghz Chip
512MB RAM
2x Seagate Baracuda IV 40GB drives
Matrox 450 dual monitor video card
RME PCI card for Digiface

Silencing parts:
Zalman CPU flower cooler (6000 AlCu)
2x Panaflo 80mm 'L' fans(intake and over zalman cooler)
120mm Panaflo 'L' for exhaust.

For what it's worth I have been building and silencing studio/audio computers privately for well over a year now. I've tried many different materials/methods and manufacturers and for PC's i've got it down to a formula(Macs are alot harder...)

1. Panaflo 'L' model 120 or 80 mm fan.
Use these for all case fans. Replace the Zalman fan that comes with the flower cooler with an 80mm fan. Get the ones without tails and wire them to the 5v power supply. If you run them off the 12v supply with resistors you are wasting power and generating more heat. If you wanna get fancy get a switchplate for the front to allow you to turn fans on and off.

2. 300w/400w Silenx power supply http://www.silenx.com/mainIndex.asp
Simply the quietest there is. I've tried them all and these are the best.

3. Zalman flower cooler
So maybe you can't run it passively but with a 5v Panaflo over it you'd be hard pressed to know the difference.

That's it! Of course I line the case to cut down on mechanical vibrations and mount the hard drives on rubber grommets, but you don't need a special case or anything else. Mine is some $30 case I got from a local shop. Hell, my computer sits right beside me, with the CD tray nice and handy...pretty well noiseless. I've taken it to many other studios and had it sitting in the room doing acoustic recordings or in dead silent control rooms and people have commented on how quiet it is.

Read through SilentPCreview very well - lots of good information and comparisons there.

Originally posted by Henrik Ammitsboel:
If you have a pro facility you can't rely on a modified "noiseless" pc.

This statement isn't true - of course with "noiseless" in quotes it sounds like you didn't have much luck implementing noiseless techniques and components. My computer is much quieter than a 480l is...although those can be modified too...

Zalman cools ok, but as cabinet temp raises(when you're using a lot of plugins) the Zalman raises in temp too... and compromises perfomance! very bad!!

This is only if you run them passively, which is not how they are meant to be run with faster CPU's. I've installed over 20 flower coolers on various studio, business and personal computers and never had a problem. My studio PC sits at a CPU temp of 38C and an internal case temp of 30C. When i'm tracking maxed out(24 tracks at 24bit/44.1) I can run this for hours and never go above 55C for a CPU temp. No performance is compromised.

You want truly silent? Build the PC with these parts and line the case to stop mechanical vibrations, THEN put it in a silent case/isoraxx.

Hi Eric!

You should start up a firm ;)
But I guess you've allready done that?

Regards

Originally posted by Henrik Ammitsboel:
I must agree with Kurt on this.
If you have a pro facility you can't rely on a modified "noiseless" pc.

I can understand your reasoning. However, the
reliability of home built systems has come a long way, without much ground being made by 'pro' manufacturers - especially the 'custom audio pc' guys. I've seen more than one 'custom audio' specialists turning out sub-par pcs in return for lower costs (Tricks such as pairing P4s with PC133 memory etc.)

I'd be more inclined to say that a pro facility can no longer rely on any kind of pcs without someone on hand who knows how to take them completely apart and take care of them.

It's not that they are unreliable, it's just that they are now such an integral part of the process, and being used in such complex ways.

just (last week) finished building a silent PC for recording, and want to back up the claims regarding Zalman CPU fans and Enermax power supplies. I built my box with a 350W Enermax power supply ($45) and a combination copper/aluminum Zalman CPU fan ($27), both of which I ordered from http://www.directron.com.

It sounds like everyone gives the Zalmans top marks. I think I'm buying mine today.

BTW - quietpc has them too.

Hey Jonathon - For power supplies I'd skip the fortron/seasonic/nexus/zalman and go right to the top - the silenx series. I've had all of them and these blow them out of the water. With all my other case fans off I can have my ear right to it and barely hear it.... Some of the other ones also use auto fan controls/temp sensors to speed up and slow down the fan - not good as they will get noisy as you draw more power. The Silenx ones have HUGE heatsinks inside, I haven't been happier with a power supply before....

Eric, I can't find anyone who carries the Zalman CPUF that you recommend so I'm thinking of going with a Nexus. I was trying to find one company who had all these parts but it's been difficult. I have a GA7DX+ Gigabyte board with a 1800+ chip. I'm a little bit worried about removing the current heatsink on the CPU and the other one on the motherboard. It has one of those little fans that tends to be noisy. I want to replace it with just a Zalman heatsink. Have you had much experience with changing out parts on a pre-built board. Is it hard to get the CPU clean enough to add a new heatsink? I built the computer myself and it just has the stock CPU heatsink with the peel off paper instead of thermal grease. I'm hoping to get some lower temps by using Artic Silver thermal grease this time. I have the board slightly overclocked and it's been working fine for over a year with no problems. I think I'll have to remove the motherboard to change out one of the heatsinks. :confused:

Hey John;

I've never had to use the peel off paper but I've removed lots of heatsinks from CPU's...usually those tiny fans make the most fan noise in your computer. I've never had a problem getting them off, just be gentle. I don't really like doing it as it feels sometimes like stuff is going to break...can't believe the pressure those clips have sometime! But after you get it off, try and clean the chip off as good as possible, you could even try a razor blade on the chip but a bit of Arctic Silver and your Zalman will bolt right on there. And for real quietness, dont' use the stock 92mm Zalman fan or the resistor/fan speed cable that comes with it - search silentpcreview or one of the other boards and wire up a Panaflo 'L' 80mm to the 5v bus and yer off to the races. As long as their is adequate exhaust on your case this will keep the temps fine. If
you are worried about it for $10-15 you can get one of those switch setups for the front of your computer to allow you to switch or ramp up/down the fan speed.

I'm in Canada and I thought it was a bitch trying to find silencing parts here, but once again check silentpcreview.com forums(geez i should get kickbacks for all this plugging or something) - they are all over the vendors for best prices and availablity of this stuff-here or in the US. I know quietpc.com stocks the stuff down there but it isn't the cheapest...

Originally posted by John Grimm (Vintage Studios):
I can't find anyone who carries the Zalman CPUF that you recommend so I'm thinking of going with a Nexus. I was trying to find one company who had all these parts but it's been difficult. I have a GA7DX+ Gigabyte board with a 1800+ chip. I'm a little bit worried about removing the current heatsink on the CPU and the other one on the motherboard. It has one of those little fans that tends to be noisy. I want to replace it with just a Zalman heatsink. Have you had much experience with changing out parts on a pre-built board. Is it hard to get the CPU clean enough to add a new heatsink? I built the computer myself and it just has the stock CPU heatsink with the peel off paper instead of thermal grease. I'm hoping to get some lower temps by using Artic Silver thermal grease this time. I have the board slightly overclocked and it's been working fine for over a year with no problems. I think I'll have to remove the motherboard to change out one of the heatsinks. :confused:

Quietpc.com has the Zalman copper/aluminum and all copper cpu block. So does silenx.com. Has anyone installed the all copper cpu cooler? Is it as sketchy as quietpc makes it sound? Is it worth the extra hassle? I was thinking of getting one and laying the pc on it's side, so the weight is directly down on the motherboard, instead of pulling to one side, as a vertical mount does.

Just be very clean and careful when you remove or ad the goop to your cpu - if your fastidious, you can do any harm. BE EXTRA CAREFUL to make sure you don't get an heat goop on the pins on the bottom side of the cpu.

I'm also overclocking a gigabyte board. By some twist of logic, I can get it to run cooler (ie lower fan speed) by overclocking it and raising the voltage a tad, than by running it at the regular speed and having the cpu workload go up. Strange.

I don't know anything about quiet PC's, but in many cases you are going to be using a slew of other gear that might also be noisy - external drives, other things that have fans, etc.

Even if they are all individually fairly quiet, the sum total of their noise could get intrusive. So I think there is merit to trying to isolate them acoustically from your tracking and mixing space.

I think it is almost as important to keep the noise floor down in the mix room as it is in the tracking room. White/Pink noise from various pieces of gear can mask one's ability to hear certain details in the mix, unless you want to mix constantly with your monitors cranked - which is also not the greatest idea.

I've decided to try to tackle the noise at the source so I'll keep you posted on how well it goes. The SLK-800A CPU heatsink seems to be a bit better than the Zalman so I've ordered it along with some Panaflo L1A fans. One for it and an extra for the case. Most have noted a 10 degree C. cooling improvement from the heatsink and it has tons of rave reviews. I'm going to use a Zalman passive heatsink for the Northbridge to replace the noisy 40 mm fan that's on there now. My current powersupply seems pretty quiet but I'll take it apart and replace the fans if I need to, or buy another.

Good start John - As for power supply mods there are lots that can be done...a couple easy ones:

If you have the punched out style fan grill(not the round wire ones that are attached with the fan screws) then use tin snips or a dremel to cut these out and put a wire one on - turbulence noise due to the fan grill and the proximity of the fan to the inside parts are a big part of PS noise. Replacing the PS fan with a Panaflo L1A 80mm and running it at 12v will probably have a drastic influence(uh, good drastic!), but depends on the wattage of your PS really...no guarantees. A good power supply simply shuts off if it's overheating...a bad one goes south.

Anyways, another trick I used on my home computer to make it's PS quieter(it's a cheapo) was to dissasemble the PS, cut out the stamped fan grill and put the fan on the OUTSIDE of the PS. So it's sticking out of the back of your case. This gives it another inch or so away from the internals and improves suction and cuts down on turbulence noise. before you mount the PS back in your case put a bit of thin adhesive foam(the stuff for weatherproofing your house)around the back inside of your computer case where the supply will be touching it. And if you put rubber O-ring washers on the screws connecting it to the case you will have significantly reduced any sympathetic vibrations the case might cause.

So moving this discussion past power supplies and CPU fans. I've read about numerous techniques for mounting and enclosing IDE hard drives for maximum isolation, but at the root, who makes the quietest IDE drives out there? I have 2 Seagates and one Maxtor, all 7200 RPM's, and I've noticed that the Maxtor is significantly louder than the Seagates. What are others' experiences with hard drives?

Originally posted by Eric Warren:

If you have the punched out style fan grill(not the round wire ones that are attached with the fan screws) then use tin snips or a dremel to cut these out and put a wire one on - turbulence noise due to the fan grill and the proximity of the fan to the inside parts are a big part of PS noise. Replacing the PS fan with a Panaflo L1A 80mm and running it at 12v will probably have a drastic influence(uh, good drastic!), but depends on the wattage of your PS really...no guarantees. A good power supply simply shuts off if it's overheating...a bad one goes south.

Anyways, another trick I used on my home computer to make it's PS quieter(it's a cheapo) was to dissasemble the PS, cut out the stamped fan grill and put the fan on the OUTSIDE of the PS. So it's sticking out of the back of your case. This gives it another inch or so away from the internals and improves suction and cuts down on turbulence noise. before you mount the PS back in your case put a bit of thin adhesive foam(the stuff for weatherproofing your house)around the back inside of your computer case where the supply will be touching it. And if you put rubber O-ring washers on the screws connecting it to the case you will have significantly reduced any sympathetic vibrations the case might cause.

My power supply has the wire grill already so that won't be neccessary in my case. I read with interest about the fan on the outside. I may try that if I end up replacing them. Do you know the recommended max heat for a 1800+ chip? My bios has an alarm that can be set as an extra precaution against overheating.

Originally posted by Jamie Smith:
So moving this discussion past power supplies and CPU fans. I've read about numerous techniques for mounting and enclosing IDE hard drives for maximum isolation, but at the root, who makes the quietest IDE drives out there? I have 2 Seagates and one Maxtor, all 7200 RPM's, and I've noticed that the Maxtor is significantly louder than the Seagates. What are others' experiences with hard drives?

Definitely Seagate Baracuda IV's. And if you get a smaller(40GB) instead of a larger(120GB) drive it will have less platens/heads/mechanics and even less noise.

It's hard to find the 'cuda IV's these days. The V's are pretty scarce as well, but from what I've read they are pretty much the same as the newer 7200.7's (but the new ones have a few cost-cutting corners implemented). Be sure to spring for the 8mb cache versions:

http://www.newegg.com/app/ViewProduct.asp?submit=manufactory&catalog=14&manufactory=1305&DEPA=1&sortby=14&order=1

The seagates aren't the fastest around, but they are *vey* quiet.

FWIW,

Finally, my SilenceCase arrived this evening - I'll try it out tomorrow, and post findings.

Cool you guys are building your own - I agree with the post(er) earlier: my efforts to put one together would be a hack job. The Silence case looks pro: I am desperate to believe something will slience my hoover G4 :)

oops, dbl post!

[ October 24, 2003, 09:51 PM: Message edited by: PlugHead ]

Plug-in, Please plug it in before you put your computer in it and give it a listen in a dead quiet room and report back to us. I'm curious how loud it is by itself since it contains fans. To me the biggest benefit of the Silence case is that it could be used for any computer that you may buy in the future. Once I get my parts in I'll install them and report back here as well.

Well,

The silence case still makes noise: about 1/2 what my G4 makes, and with the doors shut, I don't hear anything but the case fans. I have a very small CR, so any fans are noticable - my AD8000 and DA7 both have fans, and they are out in the open - the silence case makes about the same amount of noise as these 2 together, and they both are fairly quiet, tho the AD8000 is louder than the DA7. Elias said to put an egg crate on the back if it is close to, or against a wall (which mine is) to avoid vibration/rattle, so I'll try that tomorrow...

IMNSHO, it a better option than fan replacement for the computer - this case will have a longer life in a studio than any computer: one thing I didn't know was how deep the unit is - it sticks out 6 inches past my desk :(

cheers,

In my long years of experience, Seagate HD's are the way to go for a quiet PC. They are by far the quietest I have seen. WD are also OK, but a tad more noisy. Forget the rest.

You can order HD enclosures but they are a bit of a pain to install (it's a long story, just believe me). Nevertheless, the certainly help if you don't want to replace your HD's. But then again, HD's are almost cheaper these days than the HD enclosures.

Once again, I got my systems very quiet with
1. Enermax power supply with dual fans
2. Zalman CPU cooler
3. Seagate HD's

I can track vocals right next to the mixing desk now - that's all the silence I need.

And again (as mentioned before), http://www.directron.com is a good and reliable source of all of the necessary things.

Good luck,

MisterBlue.

Originally posted by PlugHead:
Well,

The silence case still makes noise: about 1/2 what my G4 makes, and with the doors shut, I don't hear anything but the case fans. I have a very small CR, so any fans are noticable - my AD8000 and DA7 both have fans, and they are out in the open - the silence case makes about the same amount of noise as these 2 together, and they both are fairly quiet, tho the AD8000 is louder than the DA7. Elias said to put an egg crate on the back if it is close to, or against a wall (which mine is) to avoid vibration/rattle, so I'll try that tomorrow...

IMNSHO, it a better option than fan replacement for the computer - this case will have a longer life in a studio than any computer: one thing I didn't know was how deep the unit is - it sticks out 6 inches past my desk :(

cheers,

I think a lot depends on the individual here. I think anyone who is building a new computer should face the noise problem from the start of their project by choosing parts that are as low noise as possible such as fans, heatsinks, hard drives and power supplies and using decoupling techniques. Where there's a will, there's a way as they say. A computer already has one box and built properly it shouldn't have to require two. Obviously a G4 is not build with low noise considerations. I would be more excited about the silence case if it was dead silent. My thought is that with 100.00 (or less) worth of parts one should be able to silence a computer pretty much to the same degree as the more expensive Silence Case. I may very well be wrong. I just received my parts yesterday so I'll let you all know the results. I like to experiment, research and tinker with stuff. If you are not like minded then the Silence Case might be the way to go.

My Isoraxx is not "dead" quiet. You can hear the fan as a very soft whirrr, and by the way, the fan speed is adjustable to minimize even that.

I think the issue is not just self-noise of these racks, but what type of noise they make, compared to what kind of noise they are preventing.

I know my UltraSCSI recording drive, my G4 itself, and back-up firewire drives can put out a lot of fan noise, but the biggest problem is when actually recording a quite obnoxious grinding and clicking is added to the usual noise floor from the SCSI drive. The Isoraxx completely eliminates the "unacceptble" drive noises. The little bit of fan noise it gives in return is much easier to deal with (if even necessary) with noise reduction software. But I almost never find it is audible on my recorded tracks.

You could always add some additional baffling to the rear fan vent too, if you want to really get dead quiet. I haven't found it necessary.