1. no.... but it only has 32 tracks....

2. no.... cubase can read and write almost anything..... but if you record a track and take it to a mac based protools studio i suggest gluing all audio together starting from bar 1 and using only 24bit files not 32bit float.... (they're also a waste of disk space imo)

3. i like the m-audio stuff.....

4. cubase is a geat tool for composing better than pt in that field.... but pt wins every time when it comes to tracking vocals or editing and mixing.... so it depends....

but if you go with cubase (sx3 i presume) why not equip the onyx with the firewire option.... you cannot get a shorter signal path.....

hope this helps

If you are just recording drums, I would assume that you're recordings are going to be taken to other studios so that the other instruments can be recorded. The decision would be easier to make if you knew what sort of system those other studios are using so that you can be sure to be compatible with them.

Cubase and ProTools are compatible, sort of. But all of the kinks have not been completely worked out. Generally I just transfer the audio files between the programs. I don't use the OMF exports because they have never worked quite right.

Since your mostly just recording drums, the track limit of 32 shouldn't be a problem at all.

I would recommend ProTools just for the portability of your tracks. It's probably used more widely throughout professional studios.

iznogood wrote:
2. no.... cubase can read and write almost anything..... but if you record a track and take it to a mac based protools studio i suggest gluing all audio together starting from bar 1 and using only 24bit files not 32bit float.... (they're also a waste of disk space imo)

Actually all you'll need to do is select all tracks and select Bounce Selected Files. Instant Stems in no time at all. This is one of the very cool features that Pro Tools doesn't have yet. It takes a lot of time to bounce individual files out of pro tools.

iznogood wrote: but pt wins every time when it comes to tracking vocals or editing and mixing.... so it depends....

Really?!!! I find Cubase or Nuendo to be more mixing friendly than PT is...you can insert effects and Group channels in real time.Editing is a breeze in Cubase or Nuendo. I guess it's preference in the long run but I can't say that PT wins hands down though...just my opinion

In the long run it's really down to what ever application suits you the best. I've said it before...I'll say one thing..someone else says another. Trust your judgement over others as one persons work ethics will be different than yours.

Opus :D

sirfunksalot wrote: I should also mention I'm running a dual processor 2.8Gig AMD MP system with dual 160GB HDDs for recording and separate system drive with XP Home.

XP Home does not support dual CPU systems.. so you're only using one now. You should really consider upgrading to XP pro.

Opus2000 wrote: [quote=iznogood]
2. no.... cubase can read and write almost anything..... but if you record a track and take it to a mac based protools studio i suggest gluing all audio together starting from bar 1 and using only 24bit files not 32bit float.... (they're also a waste of disk space imo)

Actually all you'll need to do is select all tracks and select Bounce Selected Files. Instant Stems in no time at all. This is one of the very cool features that Pro Tools doesn't have yet. It takes a lot of time to bounce individual files out of pro tools.

nice to know about that funtion.... i only had sx2 for a while.... and nuendo at work.... we tried it out but the editing was to poor.... it's difficult to edit eg. 8tracks at once with waveform display.... (asked my cubase friend to show me)....

in protools you have the ability to route the out of one track into the in of another.... that means you have the ability to bounce all tracks at once (hd).... or 16tracks (le)..... and btw i don't like non-realtime bouncing.... did a test once and it didn't null out... and what's worse... i doesn't sound as good...

iznogood wrote: but pt wins every time when it comes to tracking vocals or editing and mixing.... so it depends....

Really?!!! I find Cubase or Nuendo to be more mixing friendly than PT is...you can insert effects and Group channels in real time.Editing is a breeze in Cubase or Nuendo. I guess it's preference in the long run but I can't say that PT wins hands down though...just my opinion

as you said it's a matter of taste.... i think the way cubase/nuendo presents your takes clutters the wiev..... and the total freedom to build you mixer as you like in pt is really nice to.... and n uendo has too many windows..... most of my work is done in one window in pt (plus only on plugin window).... mixing and mastering.... also i don't like the fact that in cubase/nuendo and logic you're almost forced to setup your keyboard shortcuts.... i can use any pt system in the world.... they're all the same...

and most important of all..... when i hit the cpu limit pt stops!!.... that means i exactly know when i "hit the roof".... cubase/nuendo just starts behaving strangely.....making noises and so..... and after a 16hour session you don't need the doubt it gives... you're never really sure when it starts cracking up.....

In the long run it's really down to what ever application suits you the best. I've said it before...I'll say one thing..someone else says another. Trust your judgement over others as one persons work ethics will be different than yours.

Opus :D

Thanks for the advice guys - so, to confirm:

1. I will not have any problems at all matching up the Mackie via firewire card with Cubase?

I didn't mention it before, but I have an Mbox already but clearly need to upgrade if I want to multitrack all of my drums. I had planned to sell it (along with ProTools LE of course), but may at this point hang on to it so I can play with shooting things back and forth between Cubase and ProTools. Which leads me to:

2. Will I have issues if I install both Cubase and Protools on the same machine? How about having both interfaces physically connected at one time? Can I dare to dream that I may actually run both programs simultaneously? (computer specs are in my original posting, forgot to mention 1GB RAM)

Thanks again

solution 1: you could just exchange your mbox for a digi002... the onyx firewire option doesn't work with protools

solution 2: run the onyx into cubase and sell the mbox

but if you're taking your recordings to a big buck studio they'll almost certainly have protools.... pt has become almost a defacto standard in audio production.... nuendo is catching up.... but mostly in composing and a few mastering studios

Opus2000 wrote:
Actually all you'll need to do is select all tracks and select Bounce Selected Files. Instant Stems in no time at all. This is one of the very cool features that Pro Tools doesn't have yet. It takes a lot of time to bounce individual files out of pro tools.

ProTools handles this just fine. You need to use the "Consolidate Regions" command, not bounce to disk.

Yes, you can install both programs on one machine. I have it like that right now and if you have two sound cards...PT box and another(like the Mackie) you can run both at the same time...CPU would be used quite extensively but it can be done.

Nuendo and Cubase now can route to other tracks as well now...

When you do a bounce function it consolidates the tracks. Very fast! No waiting long period of time like PT does. The mathematical function in PT is a lot different than the Steinberg one.

Cubase and Nuendo do real time mixdown. You have to select it when you choose Export Audio...Works just fine.

I edit multiple tracks at once with ease. Just select the tracks and cut, paste, create regions, etc etc etc....

Pro Tools has always been the mainstream application..not like it suddenly became the defacto. It's nowadays that more and more people are using Nuendo or Cubase or Logic and studios are using both.

Opus :D

Opus2000 wrote: Yes, you can install both programs on one machine. I have it like that right now and if you have two sound cards...PT box and another(like the Mackie) you can run both at the same time...CPU would be used quite extensively but it can be done.

Nuendo and Cubase now can route to other tracks as well now...how.... just talked to a steinberg supporter.... he would like to know how.... (eg. to take 10 tracks and route them internally to ten new tracks and record these track in realtime

When you do a bounce function it consolidates the tracks. Very fast! No waiting long period of time like PT does. consolidating a track takes less than one second on my laptop.... this is consolidating.... not bouncing with plugsThe mathematical function in PT is a lot different than the Steinberg one. :roll: are you saying that nuendo is somehow mathematically superior to protools?? weren't we being nice here and learning a bit about the different programs?

Cubase and Nuendo do real time mixdown. You have to select it when you choose Export Audio...Works just fine yes i know...

I edit multiple tracks at once with ease. Just select the tracks and cut, paste, create regions, etc etc etc.... yes i know... but the main difference here is that when i group tracks in protools i can do the editing on one track and at the same time edit the others.... i don't have to do alot of selecting.... in cubase i would put the audio events in a part and edit in the part editor..... and then edit the part.... but i would not be able to see the waveform of all the tracks on a sample basis....

what's also nice about pt is that i doesn't have to use more windows as it can do almost everything in one window..... and the fact that automation is right on the waveform.... not below it..... cubase can show more than one controller at a time..... wich is really nice

Pro Tools has always been the mainstream application..not like it suddenly became the defacto.yes it has been around for a while..... not as long as cubase though! It's nowadays that more and more people are using Nuendo or Cubase or Logic and studios are using both. yes...the trend shifts back and forth

Opus :D

:-) iz

personally i would buy the M-Audio 18/14 get Cubase
and buy the PT le that goes with the M-Audio.

this was you get a killer product (Cubase)

and you still have PT for those still anal retentive (and there is many)
People who will require PT files from you.
this also takes care of any "artist" who thinks thier stuff has to be done on PT

Scott
ADK

anal retentive??

Man, are you NEVER going to find a job in pro audio that pays worth a damn. Protools (especialy) TDM is far superior to Cubase, not to say Cubase is not a good system, but PT is the industry standard for a reason. It offers more editing options is more compatible with mastering houses and other studios and has a broader range of QUALITY plugs than any of it's counterparts. Can Cubase plug into a movie editing sweet? NO. Dose Cubase use the industry standard hi-res file types like SDII? NO. Can Cubase go 100 layers deep and redraw a clipped file? NO. Can Cubase be used for ADRFoley applications NO, it's not compatible. Does Cubase offer TRUE REALTIME 5.1 mixing and mastering NO, it doesnt even bounce using the floating points in you CPU, it consolidates. Pro Tools LE may only offer 32 tracks (Like your actually going to need more than that unless your recording an orchestra or just need to dub everything you do because your a bad musician.) is a FAR superior packege it's more compatible, has more editing features, and supports more of everthing than Cubase, sorry man but some of us have to create music in the real world and work with other industry professionals and when I'm working on a project I like the peace of mind I get when I know I can walk in any studio in the world and load it right up.

66

P.S. sorry if I offended any cubase users I just get tired of being called stupid and anal for using a professional product. Cubase is a fine for home recording applications.

Re: anal retentive??

:roll: :roll::roll: :roll::roll: :roll: after reading your post i'm not entirely sure you know what you're taliking about.....

and before you jump to the wrong conclusion you should know that i have thousands of hours of protools experience.....

mr_sixty_six wrote: Man, are you NEVER going to find a job in pro audio that pays worth a damn. that's anarrogant way to look at things imo Protools (especialy) TDM is far superior to Cubase, not to say Cubase is not a good system, but PT is the industry standard for a reason. It offers more editing options is more compatible with mastering houses and other studios and has a broader range of QUALITY plugs than any of it's counterparts. vst was the first plugin standard..... and widely supported.... i personally would miss bombfactory plugs.... but ALOT of good plugs are avaiable for cubase/nuendo.... especially on pc Can Cubase plug into a movie editing sweet? NO. Dose Cubase use the industry standard hi-res file types like SDII? NO. sd2 is actually the only file format that CANNOT go beyond 48kHz..... do some reading... cubase supports most file formats.... and anything can use wavCan Cubase go 100 layers deep and redraw a clipped file? NO. cubase has an INFINITE undo history!!!! protools has max. 32 undos Can Cubase be used for ADRFoley applications NO, it's not compatible. Does Cubase offer TRUE REALTIME 5.1 mixing and mastering NO,of course it has.... are you on crack?? and nuendo supports formats up to 10.2 !!! it doesnt even bounce using the floating points in you CPU, it consolidates. cubase has three methods of "bouncing".... bouncing wich cosolidates regions..... export in realtime and non-realtime that includes all effects Pro Tools LE may only offer 32 tracks (Like your actually going to need more than that unless your recording an orchestra or just need to dub everything you do because your a bad musician.) again you show to have no clue..... do you work professionally with music.... i've done tracks/songs (on the old protools mix) that had three sessions with more than sixty track in each..... did some work for a band called auqa once and they had 60 tracks of background vocals!!!... dubbing has existed since the ABBA days...is a FAR superior packege it's more compatible, has more editing features, and supports more of everthing than Cubase, sorry man but some of us have to create music in the real world your world doesn't seem real to me....and work with other industry professionals and when I'm working on a project I like the peace of mind I get when I know I can walk in any studio in the world and load it right up.

66

P.S. sorry if I offended any cubase users I just get tired of being called stupid and analwho did? for using a professional product. Cubase is a fine for home recording applications.

don't doubt the fact that i prefer protools..... but to bash some software without even knowing ANYTHING about how it works it downright stupid.... sorry if i offend you :roll:

Thanks everyone, I've ordered up the Mackie Onyx 1620 with firewire option, Cubase SX 3.0, and I'm a-keepin' my Mbox, so I can have the option of working in ProTools LE as well. This works better for me than simply upgrading to the digi 002 rack, as the mic preamps will be more numerous (I need 8 to mic the drums, which the 1620 has), and of higher quality from what I've been reading, not to mention the fact that I'll have the control surface, and a perfectly good 16 track stand alone board for about half the price of the digi 002 rack.

I'll be sure to come back and check out your more detailed comments on this posting once I've got all my gear set up. It looks like it's a good thing this is a web discussion forum instead of a group that meets in person, I'd expect bloodshed if it was :shock:

gnarr, thanks for the word on XP Home vs Professional, I think I'll take your advice on that as I did make the investment in having dual processors for a reason.

Once everything arrives and I set it all up, I'll post all of my DAW system deets in the appropriate topic in this forum for those of you interested in taking a look. By the way, all my stuff is coming from Northern Sound & Light in PA, mind you I haven't received my intact shipment yet, but they slaughtered everyone on the price. You'll have to play email tag with them for pricing, though, as everything is below the mfg's MAP. Shipping to US only.

http://www.northernsound.net

Cheers,
Sirfunksalot