Look great ! At 4k, this isn't a toy ! ;)

thats real purdy...

employs a Chinese-made capsule ........

Kurt Foster, post: 464853, member: 7836 wrote: employs a Chinese-made capsule ........

Are you our community Chinese Cheerleader or ?

actually no .... but i think it's only fair to point out that many of the mics made today are procuring their capsules from 747 and other Chinese manufactures. i don't feel it's fair to rag on one company while praising another that does exactly the same thing.

Kurt Foster, post: 464855, member: 7836 wrote: actually no .... but i think it's only fair to point out that many of the mics made today are procuring their capsules from 747 and other Chinese manufactures. i don't feel it's fair to rag on one company while praising another that does exactly the same thing.

Here we go again. You are Comparing cheap $200 Chinese Diy mic kits, praising warm audio claiming they are cloning a 251 for thousands less and then feel the need to use this thread to pull a “just to be fair” card here to prove a point again.
I’ll never understand your thirst to run down high end while supporting the cheapest products at times.

I am a big fan of Mojave, owning a matched pair MA100SP. Designed and QA done by David Royer, so they can be trusted to perform as advertised.

If I had the funds, I would not hesitate to purchase any of their designs. They get top marks from many serious engineers.

The new colour scheme is a very nice look, imo.

to be clear, i am not advocating for any DIY kits.

if i build a product and charge 5 times as much as a competitor who is building the same thing, does the price alone make mine better? if my competitor can build the same thing for 5 times less, does that make theirs worse? that is pure marketing reminiscent of what Klipsch did in the 70's with what they called fair pricing. if they caught a dealer discounting their products they would cut them off saying they were "cheapening the product". i learned about that when i was working as a stage hand for Shubert's.

i would venture a guess that it's the exact same capsule in the Warm 251 clone that's in the Mojave. i suspect that Mojave is more meticulous with their construction and therefore produce a finer rendition but a 2.7k difference? that's fine for someone who actually earns income with their tools.

Warm is doing exactly the same thing that Mojave is doing but aiming at the home studio market, buying caps from China, building the boards using high quality components and American made transformers. perhaps one could think the Warm mic might be even better because they are using Cinmag transformers ..? i believe the reason Warm gear cost less is because they are making a bazillion of the things. admittedly this has created some reports of poor quality control, much of it due to shipping damage but on the upside Warm is reported to have excellent customer support available on the phone anytime and they will replace any defective product.

it's hard for any company to compete with economy of scale. don't assume just because they don't cost as much Warm mics are no good. are Mojave mics better? for 3k, i would hope so. and Warm has never claimed their products are as good as the vintage gear the have cloned. but it does deliver the same "thing".

there's hundreds of testimonials from very respected people on the net praising Warm products and i have yet to find anything negative said about them except from you. who should i listen to? Sylvia Massy, Warren Huart, Blackbird Studios and a plethora of other pros who make records or Audiokid ?.... hmmm, let me think. 800 bucks compared to 4k. what does that extra $3200 buy?

audiokid, post: 464857, member: 1 wrote: I’ll never understand your thirst to run down high end.

that ship sailed long ago. back in 2000 i fought that fight mostly alone i must say and was vilified for it. since then we have seen the demise of all the mid level studios in favor of home production sans large format consoles, with rack crap and computers. the promise was itb was just as good if not better than a console. LIE!

not only have we lost the hi fidelity of yesteryear but also the congregation of great players all in one room at the same time and the skills of engineers and producers who do it everyday for a living rather than as a hobby. all the recordings coming out these days suffer for it. there is nothing being produced these days that will have the shelf life of STAX or MOTOWN or what was happening in LA with the Wrecking Crew and i am not ok with that. but what can one person do? if you can't beat them, join them. since it all sounds like sh*t, why spend 4k? bragging rights?

Dusty from Mojave Audio here.
Respectfully - Wow!

Kurt Foster, post: 464860, member: 7836 wrote: "i would venture a guess that it's the exact same capsule in the Warm 251 clone that's in the Mojave"

You guessed wrong- we do not use the same 797 capsule as Warm in the MA-1000. The MA-1000 is made specifically for Mojave Audio and costs approx. 10x as much as a 797 capsule.

Kurt Foster, post: 464860, member: 7836 wrote: "perhaps the Warm mic might be even better because they are using Cinmag transformers"

Perhaps not. We use a custom-made toroidal transformer built to David Royer's specifications by Coast Magnetics here in LA. It's bigger than anything Cinemag makes. We considered the less-expensive Cinemag transformers for our other mics but found the Jensen Transformers we use to be superior.

Kurt Foster, post: 464860, member: 7836 wrote: "Warm is doing exactly the same thing that Mojave is doing"

Not exactly. All Mojave's - including the MA-1000 - are original designs by David Royer. We don't do clones or knock-offs.

Kurt Foster, post: 464860, member: 7836 wrote: "800 bucks compared to 4k .... most likely the same thing."

Not the same thing. Point taken, though. The direct competition for the MA-1000 are the Telefunken USA 251 ($9495.00) and the Bock 251 ($5995.00) At $2995, we think that we are offering the value.

Dustywake,
thank you for the info. it helps to clear the water. please note i did not say it was fact. i was wondering out loud. this helps. my intention is not to dis Mojave or David Royer. i have the utmost respect for the gentleman and i know his products all are the highest quality.

my intention is to point out that China bashing is futile. everyone is doing business with them (even you guys) and if China fell off the face of the planet tomorrow those manufacturing jobs are never going to return Stateside. if they do open new plants in the US, all the assembly will be automated. those jobs are never coming back. it's about this gaslight rhetoric. it's unfortunate you were drug into this. the root of the discussion has a history and is more political than about the actual mics.

Dustywake, post: 464867, member: 39315 wrote: All Mojave's - including the MA-1000 - are original designs by David Royer. We don't do clones or knock-offs.

one of the things i appreciate is that Warm is doing clones. i like that i know what it is.

Dustywake, post: 464867, member: 39315 wrote: The MA-1000 is made specifically for Mojave Audio and costs approx. 10x as much as a 797 capsule.

are you sure Warm is using a standard 747 capsule? i believe they have custom made capsules too.

All Brass Capsule
The WA-12-B-60V is an all-brass, edge-terminated capsule that captures all the smoothness, rich top end, and warm vintage sonics of the original CK12 capsule. The WA-12-B-60V uses a variant CEK-12 back plate as a basis, which overcomes manufacturing limitations of the original CK12 capsule. The o-ring and housing of the WA-12-B-60V are all made from brass (no teflon parts), and the diaphragm is 24k gold sputtered 6 micron, NOS PET film (mylar). The end result is a very consistent, reliable capsule which matches the frequency response and tonality of the classic 1970's classic capsule.

The link will take you to a video of a visit to Mojave Audio by Sweetwater. Lots of good company and product info, including watching David Royer personally doing the final QA checks he performs on each mic they push out the door.

Dustywake, post: 464867, member: 39315 wrote: Dusty from Mojave Audio here

Right on, thanks for chiming in, Dusty.

ronmac, post: 464869, member: 24337 wrote:

The link will take you to a video of a visit to Mojave Audio by Sweetwater. Lots of good company and product info, including watching David Royer personally doing the final QA checks he performs on each mic they push out the door.

.

+1
I’ve watch this a few times. Very informative and fun.

Not trying to inflame the argument,but having seen the constant and rapid manufacturing improvements coming from China in the last 20 years of electronics, I find it hard to keep this concept alive. I wish North America had the electronics manufacturing capabilities China has today, but we just don't.

Kurt Foster, post: 464868, member: 7836 wrote: Dustywake,
thank you for the info. it helps to clear the water. please note i did not say it was fact. i was wondering out loud. this helps. my intention is not to dis Mojave or David Royer. i have the utmost respect for the gentleman and i know his products all are the highest quality.

my intention is to point out that China bashing is futile. everyone is doing business with them (even you guys) and if China fell off the face of the planet tomorrow those manufacturing jobs are never going to return Stateside. if they do open new plants in the US, all the assembly will be automated. those jobs are never coming back. it's about this gaslight rhetoric. it's unfortunate you were drug into this. the root of the discussion has a history and is more political than about the actual mics.

one of the things i appreciate is that Warm is doing clones. i like that i know what it is.

are you sure Warm is using a standard 747 capsule? i believe they have custom made capsules too.

All Brass Capsule
The WA-12-B-60V is an all-brass, edge-terminated capsule that captures all the smoothness, rich top end, and warm vintage sonics of the original CK12 capsule. The WA-12-B-60V uses a variant CEK-12 back plate as a basis, which overcomes manufacturing limitations of the original CK12 capsule. The o-ring and housing of the WA-12-B-60V are all made from brass (no teflon parts), and the diaphragm is 24k gold sputtered 6 micron, NOS PET film (mylar). The end result is a very consistent, reliable capsule which matches the frequency response and tonality of the classic 1970's classic capsule.

Please help me understand the basics of a microphone.
If I was just starting out in this business (newbie) and asked this question, what I get from you, Kurt...

Anyone that installs this capsule and tube should have a microphone that sounds like an $9000 251? Noted Warm Audio does this so from what you have posted above, from a newbie POV then, there would be no point buying anything other than Warm Audio mic’s?

audiokid, post: 464873, member: 1 wrote: Please help me understand the basics of a microphone.
If I was just starting out in this business and asked this question, what I get from you, Kurt...

Anyone that installs this capsule and tube Will sound like an $9000 251? Warm Audio does this so there is no point buying anything other than Warm Audio mic’s?

where did i ever say that? please don't put words in my mouth. i did not mention WARM at all in this thread until you did.

Kurt Foster, post: 464853, member: 7836 wrote: employs a Chinese-made capsule ........

audiokid, post: 464857, member: 1 wrote: Here we go again. You are Comparing cheap $200 Chinese Diy mic kits, praising warm audio claiming they are cloning a 251 for thousands less and then feel the need to use this thread to pull a “just to be fair” card here to prove a point again.
I’ll never understand your thirst to run down high end while supporting the cheapest products at times.

well to put it in your words, "just to be fair here", why is it ok for one company who you support to use Chinese parts but not others? you haven't responded to that question.

you have been China bashing for years, casting blame on them for American capitalists actions. this is over simplistic thought aimed at base human instinct to blame others for our own failures / misdeeds. right wing fascism has always used enemy's / the "other", to keep voters focus off of their own incompetence and misdeeds. don't you find it curious that fascist always have enemies and are corrupt /incompetent? WWII Germany and Italy are both prime examples. can't get a handle on a pandemic? call it Kung-Flu. blame" those dirty little yellow bastards". "pay no attention to the man behind the curtain."

it was Republican business interests and Nixon who opened China and it has been very successful for them. Reagan told us we were going to become a service economy and now that they got it their way, they blame China and "liberals "for what they did. i think you are too young to even remember when that happened.

i don't care much for China either but for different reasons like their use of forced labor and how they treat their workers. but it's really almost impossible to purchase anything now that isn't in some way connected to China. you bash not just Warm but anything from or that has parts from there. now all of a sudden China parts are ok with you in a Mojave mic? wtf Chris?

anyway, here's my answer. i just know what i can hear. i try not to pay any attention to sales hype any longer. there is no magic bullet for recording at this point in time, especially in hobby studios (imo). most recordings i've heard sound pretty much like crap to me compared to what has preceded. i don't see the point in spending top dollar for mics or any gear for hobby applications when it's being recorded (in most cases) in crap rooms, through crap converters, mixed itb with plugs in crap control rooms and monitored with crap monitoring systems.

in that scenario i feel many of the less expensive alternatives suffice. find what works for you at the best price. i am hearing recordings done on TASCAM 24's that knock the socks off of a lot of stuff on the net. unless you have several hundred thousand bucks to throw down on a building, another 500k to invest in gear and very deep pockets to keep the lights on as well as the knowledge to make a record, i say save your money and go to a REAL studio with REAL engineers and musicians. that will get you a great recording (if your songs don't suck) and go a lot further to preserving the industry than all this nonsense like ...."this piece will make your hobby studio recordings sound as good as the big boys" lies.

if you're interested in helping manufacturers of the high end survive, getting recording back into the hands of pros in pro settings will go a lot further than the hobby studio movement. sooner or later people will catch on that all this self recording is a load of sh*t and then everybody is fu*#ed.

Omg Kurt, I’m going to ban you again if you don’t stop this bs.

You mistake my words regarding Chinese.

Your thirst for warm audio is not denied.
however.. I have had Warm Audio here and the product I used was total crap in my books. So I call that cheap offshore crap.

without going on there...
you also went on a rant where warm Audio makes these amazing clones that use the same capsule and tranny that Mojave uses.
In my questioning you from a newbies POV.. , you go off again and take my words and spin them Towards your narratives .
We could go in circles for years .

In so many threads like this... you complain about how USA sucks and how today’s music sucks and how the USA will never be great and on and on.. then we go off the rails and start talking fucking politics again.
Now you are here in this thread doing it again. For fuck sake, Kurt... Mojave just changed the colour of their MA-1000 and I said "well done!".
Now you call me a hypocrite.

I asked you a last question regarding your statements on capsules as if I was a newbie.
I can’t make sense of you half the time. You sound pissed off at the world for becoming digital ....

Being said,

I don’t support cheap products that are stealing patents and using China (or anyone for that matter) to mass produce them by piggy back a brand or name.

I don’t have a problem with Chinese people, I respect anyone deserving.
I do however have a problem with people who bitch and bitch about North America... who can’t figure out why they aren’t working yet buy off shore. But after I say this... to respond to your rhetoric...you turn topics into politics.

please stop turning threads in political rants.
Likely everything I own has something made in China. I hope that changes in some ways. Why? Because I would like to see more things made here again. It makes me smile when I see: made in the USA.

This is your last warning here. I’m going to ban you forever if you do this again.

peace and happiness.