Has anyone checked out the API 512c? I've heard a lot of good things about them. I think those go for about $1,000 with the Lunchbox.

I haven't tried it out myself, but I am curious to know opinions on those (what you've used them for, etc.)

Are you only in need of a single mic pre?
Are you looking for "color" or transparency?
What other gear do you have? (Specifically mics and A/D conversion)

If I had $1000 to spend on a *single* mic pre, I certainly wouldn't consider either the Focusrite or the Joemeek. If I had $100, I probably would avoid them still!

So to answer my own questions above - assuming that there's a quality mic and a quality AD and a quality source, and I had to choose only 1 mic pre for the money:

"Colored" -
Summit 2BA-221

"Transparent" -
Grace 101

In response to the API...yes, they are VERY nice pres. Well built - very solid and quite good sounding. I wouldn't call it strongly colored nor would I call it transparent (though I would consider it to fall more on the transparent side of things with perhaps a slight *emphasis* on tight bass)

The lunchbox idea might not be a bad one. I would check with Nathan at Atlas and see what a rackmounted API style lunchbox would cost with a unit in it. He's got several different modules to choose from including Buzz, Purple, OSA and others. Not to mention, there are pres available from API, Brent Averil, Shadow Hills and others that fit the same frame.

Good luck and keep us posted.

J.

"Transparent" "Very Slightly colored"

True-Systems P-Solo

I am getting (in the proses of buying every thing) an fire wire Mbox II into my mac. i am getting an AT4040, perhaps an NT1 and some rode NT5s.

thats for the recording set up at least. my set up is going to be more for MIDI and editing then any thing els. but i still want to be able to do some decent sounding overdubs.

Its going to be a simple set up, so all i want is a single or duel channel preamp with a compressor (if possible). i would prefer a transparent preamp, but if one happens to colour every thing real nicely i would not be apposed to considering it

I would honestly suggest you *not* go with a preamp with a built in compressor given the price range. Very few good pres and compressors exist within the same box and I honestly don't know of any within that price range and know of even fewer which have compressors which are what I would consider to be "universal."

I would stick with a good pre and use a compressor plug in for the time being. Then, save up for a good versatile unit such as a Drawmer or a good dBX.

Cheers-

J.

PS -
TVPS - I recently tried a friends P8 again after years of bashing and I must admit, it didn't leave me cold like my last experiences with my own previous P8. Perhaps it was a function of the Schoeps ext bodies, certain cables and the precision 8 together which didn't jive. In fact, I actually found that I preferred the P8 to the DAV which I have used extensively for the past 2 years.

well that grace has really grabbed my attention. i cant find any bad words about it, and the price is right thats for sure.
depending on how cheap i can find one i may pick up two of them. my ears are still open though.

thanks for the advice.

Cucco wrote:

PS -
TVPS - I recently tried a friends P8 again after years of bashing and I must admit, it didn't leave me cold like my last experiences with my own previous P8. Perhaps it was a function of the Schoeps ext bodies, certain cables and the precision 8 together which didn't jive. In fact, I actually found that I preferred the P8 to the DAV which I have used extensively for the past 2 years.

Good to see ya comin to yer senses Jeremy. :wink:

Theres a certain something about the True Systems stuff that goes beyond the specs. I LOVE the P2 Analog pre.

Those in the know, and I'm not one them, note that the P2 sounds different than the P8. My limited experience with the P2 was that is was real good, but not really my cup of tea or of real bragging rights yet miles ahead of Focusrite and Meek. I likely pick the Grace over the P2.

i think the grace is in the lead right now
i just need to see if my dealer can order me one

Fraz,

The Grace is by far the cleanest most transparent pre I have ever heard.
I had one, but needed to step up to more pres, and the Grace 801 was out of my budget, the next choice was True-systems P8.
I just like to give Cucco a friendly nudge!!!!
The Grace might also be a little TOO transparent for some peoples tatses.

One note you should be aware of, the Grace 101 is an economy model compared to their 801, a wall wart power supply, and a lower quality gain knob, and a lower output section.

The True-Systems P-Solo is identical to their P8.

Here's why I have a fondness for the True, I had a scratchy pot after 6 months of non stop use, I spoke directly with Tim Spencer at TS about getting it fixed under warranty. I sent it in, Tim personally replaced ALL 8 gain pots the day it arrived, I would have had it the next day if Tim didnt insist on scoping out the whole unit, and doing a 48 hour burn-in.
8-)

I hear great things about FMR's stereo pre. If it's in the same vein as the comp/limiters it should be the best pre under $2000. I'd heard it compares well with the Grace 101. Anyone here tried the RNP?

Having used both the Gale 101 and the P-solo, which one is the better preamp?

They are in the same league. Like most things in audio in that same league, one is not clearly better than the other as much as one is different than the other. Many variables as well as subjective opinion, are the usual things that make one thing better than another.

well thanks allot for the advice, my mind is set on the p solo right now
i think it takes the cake for value, as it is a single channel version of a professional preamp. plus from what i have read the grace seems to be a bit to transparent and bright.

i have to say, thanks allot for all the advice. it been truly helpful.

I would say that the Grace is anything but bright! It has a very "liquid" smooth sound on the top. The other reason I love the Grace is the detented switches. It's REAL easy to reset the gain knob where you had it before.

I've used the 101,201, and 801 and while I did find a *slight* difference between the 101 and the others, it was slight.
Sorry to confuse matters...

no confusion, i am glad to hear others experiences with preamps. my only experiences are with the ones in my schools studios, and they are not exactly affordable.

i will most likely get the Psolos first, but i have another channel that could use a preamp so i may get the grace when i get more money. have both of them. best of bother worlds.

Cucco is right, the Grace is not bright, it's just very accurate, and transparent.

What some might be referring to, is that the Grace is revealing, if you plug an economy mic like the NT1-A, yes it will be too bright. Plug a Neumann in it and its "liquid"!!

i can't afford a Neumann yet, but i will start with an AT4040. i prefer it over the nt1a. will it preform well with truly revealing preamp?
i plan on getting better gear when i can afford it, but i am just in school right now, and i want the recordings i do at home to be at the same quality as the study, or as close as i can reasonably get it.

The 4040 is an excellent mic. As are ALL the Audio Technicas. For my money if you're looking for a 'one-mic' operation, it would have to be the 4050 due to the patterns as well as the increase in 'attitude' in the mic sound . The 4040 is kinda bland. Not in a bad way as it does reproduce its source accurately, it just doesnt do it with flair.

I'll kind of agree all around with the last few posts. The 4040 is a great "neutral" mic. It's unlikely to blow wind up anyone's skirt in any one direction. That being said, any mic that has a trait which makes someone happy - that trait is likely to make someone else unhappy.

I think of the 4040 as the Cheerios of the microphone world. No one really *hates* Cheerios. I think of something like the u87 as the Cap'n Crunch of the microhpone world. A lot of people love Capn Crunch and couldn't live without it. There are those few people though who just don't care for it...

Anyway - back to the preamps. I wouldn't really suggest getting both the Grace and the True Systems if you're looking for the "Best of Both Worlds." Perhaps the True Systems and the Summit or something along that lines. The Grace and the True are great transparent boxes. To get the best of both worlds, you'd want one transparent and one really colorful. The reason I really like the Summit is that it can run the gamut from pretty clean and transparent to all out grungy and everything in between. That and it works VERY well with ribbons and there is so much gain available it's not even funny (with 3 different gain stages!)

Cheers!

J.

The 4040 is just the start of my mic collection. it has been my favorite "use it for every thing" mic so far. so i am going to get it first, since i know what i like about it. I am thinking of getting a pair of NT5s and a SM7b when i get money to spend again. so i want a large dio condenser that preforms well with vocals, both signing and dialog (very important), as well as a decent acoustic guitar mic (untill i get the NT5s), and finally the SM7b for guitar amps and vocals (i love they way it brings out the gravel in my voice).

But as far as getting a coloured preamp. what would you say are some good options? and what type of coloring should i be looking for?

I just sold off a pair of The Brick preamps to get a Summit 2BA-211 and am glad that I did that. The 2BA lends a slight "softness" to the transients of many sources, and a "fullness" to the midrange. And when I push the gain, the harmonics that are boosted are like the difference between a crappy little Crate amp and my 49 Fender Deluxe. More musical-sounding.
How's that for vagueness? It just is. And flexible. I can plug a P-Bass into the DI input and mic the amp with a 421, mixing both at the same time with the 2BA. Very cool.
This is a perfect "Ying" to the "Yang" of my pair of 101's. Like everyone else already stated, very clean and transparent. By the way, I have a P2 that I sold a Langevin Dual Vocal Combo to buy for a special project. I really miss the DVC....

Thanks for the heads up. Its a reasonably priced tube pre.
what are some other comparable in quality and price coloured pres?

Man...I go away for a few hours and there's a flurry of conversation...

I perhaps I should clarify a little regarding my remarks on the 4040. I don't mean in any way to suggest that they are bad or not usable. In fact, while I LOVE the entire 40 series of microphones, the 4040s are in fact the only AT 40 series that I personally own at the moment. In fact, I own two. I like them for a myriad of things - background vocals, toms, overheads, kick drum, spot mics on brass or woodwinds, piano (they're friggin awesome piano mics, especially for the money! I'd take them over a pair of 414s on piano almost any day of the week!)

Moon -

I hear you on the equipment changes! I absolutely think the Summit is one of those rare gems and while I think the Brick is a great value, the Summit is simply a great pre (no "for the money" or " great value" statements).

I too had a Langevin DVC and sold it (along with my SoundElux U195) and have been kicking myself ever since. Don't get me wrong, I got a few more pairs of Schoeps out of the deal, but the DVC is (IMO) one of the best pres and perhaps one of the most overlooked pres on the market! Selling the SoundElux was just retarded, but hey...I got rid of my commercial location since I was tired of the clientelle I was getting and until I build a better facility, I'm going to focus on location-only recording. The DVC had to go (a little big and heavy for only 2 channels to take on the road... :( )

Anyway -
To answer the final question -
what are some other comparable in quality and price coloured pres?
None. Not in that price range. For a bit more...ADL600, maybe some Shadow Hills or UA stuff.

My personal feeling - I personally would not get a tube pre that did not have an input gain stage AND an output gain stage. I know there are plenty of good tube pres out there without these different stages, but I would lean towards the option of both. I like being able to tell the pre just how much tube stage I want.

This is of no particular help but simply a shout out to my buds.....

Moon and Jeremy....There was a time a few years ago when I was going to open shop again and record Mom and Dads' little rock stars....I didnt...at least to this point and I stopped buying gear at that time. For my projects I can rent or borrow....

Anywho...there was a time that I swore that I'd only have RED gear in the rack!

Lets see.....that would kinda limit it to.....uh.....True Systems, Focusrite, Langevin, and some little known company called DW Fearn.

Well it WAS a good idea at the time............ :!:

When I do make a high-end purchase again, it will be the DVC. No doubt one of the best and understated at that.

These are an interesting option for you, and its made here in the USA.
This 4 channel mic pre been around for about 15 years or so...maybe someone here can comment who has one.

Check it out..
http://www.sytek-audio-systems.com/products/preamps/mpx4/

TheFraz wrote: i am setting up a DAW right now, and i need to get my hands on a nice mic pre.
I have been looking at Focusrite TWIN-TRAK-PRO. also i have looked into both the Joemeek twinQ Dual Channel and the Joemeek OneQ.

any advice on any of these would be great. or if there is something killer sounding in this price range that i am unaware of, feel free to inform.

They're GREAT! (Imagine Tony the Tiger saying it, it's more effective.)

I've only had the opportunity to use one once about a year ago and I was quite delighted. As a matter of fact, it's on my short list! (It will probably be the next preamp I buy - especially if the Grace m801 is out of my price range at the time.)

two channels to many.
but thanks for the heads up

oh i should ask, for a single preamp would i need a power conditioner or am i alright with just using a normal outlet?

I wouldn't knock it out of contention that quickly. Sure it's a 4 channel pre instead of 2 (isn't that a bargain though??)

If you go with the Burr Brown option on channel 3 and 4, you get 2 channels of very big, full sounding preamp and 2 channels of very realistic, clear sounding preamp. Granted the BB channels aren't as big and full as say a Summit or an ADL, but they sure are a bit different than the "super clean" transparent channels 1 & 2.

I can't believe I didn't mention them myself...

so i ended up getting my self a summit audio. mainly because i could not find a grace in time. but i am rather happy that i got it. the extra features are well worth the extra cost.

though i just got my hands on it, and it showed up before my mbox and mics. so i cant really test her out yet. but first chance i get i am going to bring it to a friends place and try her out, if my other gear takes much longer.