Post fade aux sends can work on a dedicated monitor mixer as long as the initial gain is set and left alone. I'm pretty sure the MG24 has a pfl switch though on every pair of aux sends. It's been a while since I eyeballed one so I could be mistaken.

My constant eyeballing of various 32 channel mixers led me to a picture of an MG, it seems to have PFL switches on 1/2, 3/4 and aux 5/6 are set as PFL, but the pots are switchable to control the efx sends instead. On a per channel basis.

That's a possibility then, thanks.

From what I'm seeing, Aux 1-2 & Aux 3-4 are assignable as pre or post -fader (on a channel by channel basis - which is handy) only Aux 5 & 6 are permanently wired post-fader. This set-up would be ideal to run 4 (pre-fader) monitor mixes and 2 (post-fader) effects sends. How many monitor mixes do you need?

Professional musicians, wouldn't like their monitors fluctuating with FOH mix adjustments, but honestly amateur singers & musicians probably won't know the difference if you don't make any radical adjustments.

"PFL" is a different topic than a pre-fader button on the Auxes. PFL (Pre Fader Listen) allows you to basically eavesdrop on or "Solo" that specific channel or aux through your headphones - regardless of fader position. It gives you a way to discretely isolate and identify noises, hiss, hum, who's singing off-key, whatever. Plus you can use your headphones to listen to the Aux mixes you're sending to the stage.

You're absolutely right! Apparently I had been up too long yesterday at that point and wasn't paying attention to myself. No one else does either....

I know you know better Jack, I'm just trying to avoid having a confused monkey on our hands.

lol - I don't want CM confused! With those Plan 9 From Outer Space glasses he might shoot a ray gun at me or something...

No, it's fine. I know the difference - although like yourself I'd typed PFL.
PFsend PFlisten PFsend PFlisten PFsend PFlisten.

A codemonkey with a raygun? :shock:

Currently we have two wedges on separate mixes, one for the multitude of vocalists and one for the drummer. I would like to have another wedge at least to cover the pianist or guitarist although a separate mix would be ideal.
I don't think that 2 more mixes would be fantastic although needs can change in a heartbeat.

Normally I don't slam faders a lot (the less heavy-handed I am the better it seems to sound), but we don't soundcheck. The first song of the service is where I set that day's levels, everything else is carried over from the rehearsal. Not great, I know.

You could always use one board as a monitor board. You'd need a splitter then.

The MG will be a nice upgrade for your system, CM. They are probably the best bang for the buck. I have used a few of the different models. I wasn't impressed with the 32-channel because the outputs seemed to clip faster than the 24-channel model (church setting). I suspect that was the result of both boards having the same power supply and the 32 just taxed it more. That was certainly true of the Mackie SR24.4 vs the SR32.4.
Be aware that the Community stuff is now Chinese-built, I don't know where the Dynacord is made-Germany still? If so, they probably use better components. Dynacord is kind of analagous to Yorkville over here.
Not bad, reasonably robust gear.
I've had to use post-fade auxes for stage mixes before. Usually as a backline mix for sidefills, not the perfect solution, but certainly useable.
Glad to see you expanding your kit!

"Glad to see you expanding your kit!"
Me too - well, I hope so. mixer might be pushing it - the MG, necessary amp, and probably a bigger table to put it on, and the extra wedge or two to make it worthwhile - it adds up. Plus, we don't really need loads more channels or buses, although it would be nice to have more than we need, again.

The post-fader mixes would be if we kept our current board - 2 proper auxes, 2 effect sends (1 of which is used for the induction loop).

Thanks.

One of your post-fader sends would be dandy for the induction loop/assitive listening feed. It would more closely mirror the FOH mix.

That's what we're using currently. It would work the same with the Yamaha, the loop only gets fed the mic at the lectern, and the radio mic - neither of these go through the monitors.

Anyway I spoke to a guy at the company & the minister so it's up to them to see what cash is going spare.
At £100 a wedge (and with an amp sitting idle), I'm hopeful.

New question:
(I believe they're called banana plugs; the red and black 2-pole affair?)
We have an amp with 2 banana plug outputs. These are wired with 1/4" TS jacks on the other end. The wedges we might get have speakons.

What are the implications of changing the current connectors to be speakons? Does this cause any fire hazard or leave cables floating?

Also I've seen amps wired with speakon adapters hanging off the back. Would this be a better solution, getting two longer speakon-speakon cables to extend from them, rather than having two long speakon-banana cables?

Just wire it right is all. Speakon pushes in and twists so it doesn't pull apart easily at gigs which is a plus. Get a magnifying glass and bright light to read the 1+ 1- 2+ 2- scribing.

There's nothing wrong with binding post / banana plug connections. You just have to be very tidy with every single strand of wire.

Speakon would be considerably more durable and actually safer than a 1/4" pigtail. They have more surface area to the contacts and can handle more power with more fidelity - easily taking up to 11AWG wire. Not only does a Speakon lock in place, but the positive and negative are encased and connect "ground first / positive last" as they lock in place - which is good if you're hotpatching a speaker. There's no such thing as a male Speakon cable end, so you'll either need a panelmount male or one of the couplers. (gender is very confusing on these things) The cable ends are easily assembled and repaired, if needed, without soldering. If you get the screw-terminal version of the panelmount all you need is just a phillipshead screwdriver and wirecutters/strippers.

These rock!

http://www.redco.com/shopexd.asp?id=227

These feedthroughs are cool too.

http://www.redco.com/shopexd.asp?id=1289

The amp sits on a shelf, not rackmounted (I'd like to do that but wooden cases are surprisingly expensive).

The company are having a sale on wires too, so I should be able to get some longer speakon-speakon wires, then maybe have them add short adapters to it. I don't trust myself with a soldering iron on anything amplified.

Redco looks well stocked, too bad about the $30 shipping charge to here.

On many speakers/monitors the jack plate can be changed out to speakon.

Codemonkey wrote: I don't trust myself with a soldering iron on anything amplified..

What? Your never going to get any confidence unless you try. Believe me, its really not that hard to do, and your going to become a great engineer by knowing how to fix that cord when one of the nervous musicians breaks it just before a live performance.

Man, I really like saving the money and making my own cables for my patches. I think you may change your mind about it Code if you give it a good try, heck go work at a repair shop somewhere, you'll learn while your getting paid!

TheJackAttack - the speakers are speakon (current ones are 1/4" although none have ever fallen out during a show), and the amp has banana plugs. I take it amps can't be changed easily?

jammster that's inspiring - about time I got a job :lol: I'd still prefer to start with 1/4" cables (we have a few dead ones of those...) but I'm still planning to pick up a few in this sale (at roughly $2 a pop, gimme 4).

Glad to hear that Code, we'll make you an ace engineer yet! :P

Edit: Oh, forgot to mention that you need a simple ohm meter, works as a continuity tester also. All you have to do when making 1/4" cords is know that your audio is on the tip and the shield is on the sleeve. Inserts are a little more complicated. You use tip for send, ring for return and sleeve for ground(shield).

You then of course split the shield in two, sending one to the send and one to the return along with the consecutive audio wires( one send tip, sleeve / one return tip / sleeve)

Of course you end up having to use quite a bit of shrink wrap over the Y split where you separate the shield in two and splice in the send and return,
try using different colored cable for the send and return so you will always know easily when fumbling through your maze of analog wizardry.

Well. Not easily. But can be done on many amps if you are into using tin snips, a dremel tool, and you are quite good. Don't forget to unplug the amp first.....

My first thought was "I'm halfway there, I reckon"

But on reflection, I reckon it's you guys that are halfway there. I brought the curiousity, RO brought it all together.

Short term goals:
- get a budget
- get soldering
- hopefully get wedges, rewire the amp.

Jammster I've been pushing him to invest in a meter and soldering iron for months. He seems reluctant (read = lazy) to take the next logical step.

A Greenlee Knockout punch is the only beautiful way to retro-fit panelmount jacks 3/4" or larger. (not for the frugal) Some 2-space amps can't spare the room inside. I'd buy the panelmount Speakons and mount them in a standard electrical box, with 12AWG leads to the binding posts. You'd be done in 10 minutes and it would be as durable as anything.

The Redco links are more for visual reference, Neutrik is headquartered in Europe (Liechtenstein) with a branch on the Isle of Wight, so you should have an abundance of their connectors at your disposal. I'm sure there's a UK equivalent of Redco.

Rock on brother monkey!

Love the Greenlee. Great for custom panels of all kinds. Didn't figure CM could spare quid for both a soldering iron, solder, and punches ;-)

CM: It is very helpful to have a pro grade wire strippers that have the ability to trim 6-32, 8-32 etc screws (or UK equivalent). It makes custom length panel screws easy.

+1 on a Greenlee kit.

Unibits can do a good job, but only if they're in a drill press. Otherwise you get the wobble wallow's on the edges of the hole.

There's not any logical excuse not to have at least;
DVM, Wiggie, #1-#3 Phillips, jewelers Phillips set, 35 watt soldering iron, solder sucker, solder wick, S,M, and L wire cutters, fine point needle nose, allen wrenches, 2 pr of adjustable wrenches and two pair of wire strippers w/ crimpers.

There's a whole host of other stuff to carry in a tech box... but that's another thread...

Eventful service today.

The power decided to fart loudly during the sermon, which inevitably causes a gigantic spike through every speaker, the induction loop, and also takes out both computers (for the projector and recording).

The advantage of living at home - my dad has a load of stuff (he's handy/techy). Wire strippers, etc.

I acquired a cheap soldering iron ages ago, I've used it a total of: once. I'll go dig up other threads and see what I need (solder in noun form?), since I have no sermon to process I need something to take up my afternoon.

Code, I found this video today and thought you would appreciate it!

[youtube:1af024dbf0]http://www.youtube…]

Oh, fantastic. Thanks!

I laughed for the first few times he said "sodder", I really need to get used to certain accents.

It says use alcohol to clean afterwards; does that mean I should pour vodka over my circuitboards?
Or could/should I use an electronic cleaning solvent?

Good video and great resource jammster. Thanks!

Codemonkey and anyone looking to learn to solder should watch it a few times and practice on a cheap pre-drilled project board just like in the video. A pack of resistors and a project board cost next to nothing and will be good practice to get your skills honed. You could/should practice soldering some light gauge stranded wire into the board too.

It just takes some practice. Again, thanks jammster.

Your always welcome.

There are huge differences in accents from the U.S. to Scotland. I would love to be able to visit europe again soon, just need to save those $$. I have a friend in Norway that wants me to come visit. That cost big $$, not sure when I can do that.

Yes! Vodka is great for cleaning! LOL!

Most alcohol cleaners in the states are unsafe to drink.

Actually, I had been thinking about those DIY Mic Pres again and found this Video, just thought its very well put together and explains things well.

A nice Scotch malt should do nicely.

For you, me, or the solder?

All 3