Gentlemen, gentlemen,gentlemen, why is always left up to me, MODerAtoR Man, to correct you guys in situations such as this? Have I not been patient ,ne: over-the-top accepting of your little jibes and antics?
Why oh why do you put me in this position?
EVERYONE knows the Violet Line Super Stereo Dalliator is the FINEST machine that money can buy.
The VLSSD has the crappiest stereo imagining I've ever heard. Also everthing above 14k sounds tinny and high pitched. Not to mention that if you engage the HPF at 400Hz, it just sucks the low end right out of everything.
It's hard as hell to find a Telson in decent working order is the only problem with it. Can't even find much mention of it on google.
You guys are something.
OK guy, here are some buzzwords:
Neve, API, Manley, Universal Audio, John Hardy, Groove Tubes, GML, Avalon, Great River, um um, running out of ideas here, but any of these would be recommended.
well i like the variable impedance and as you upgrade your studio you will find them goo d for secondary things like scratch tracks and if a drums has like 90 toms, they are good to have around, trust me get the tps. the blue tube i have owned and wasnt too thrilled with it
Ok I'll quit jackin around for a minute and address this as simply as I can.
The preamp is only a 'part' of the recording chain.
A chain will typically include a mic, a pre,and perhaps some type of process or control device and something that records the signal.
The VERY most important part of your chain is the source.
If it doesnt sound good to begin with, theres no possible way ANY gear is going to resolve the bad sound.
Matching the mic to the singer is another important part that gets very little attention.
A GREAT singer...ie: one who has control, tone, and knowledge of mic technique will sound good on virtually ANY signal chain.
Those that need help need to address the basics before making gear decisions.
Theres a common thread running through todays information highway on a lot of these BB's that seems to indicate that one needs to have a tube something to make vocals sound 'good'...While this may or may not be true, the environment the vocals is tracked in has as much if not more to do with the sound than the advent of a tube in the chain.
See kids.....dadogg is 'old skool'....sh*t in=sh*t out....
So...search for a mic that you can learn to use and sounds 'right' for your purpose. Find a mic pre that compliments the mics' 'signature'..This may include a tube but more than likely a simple voltage in =voltage out situation without too many artifacts will get you closer to what you're looking for than a fruitless search for that silver bullet piece of gear. Look at your environment you are recording in. Learn about sound control. For vocals you dont have to have a huge area, but you have to have control of its tones and standing waves,reflections and flutters. The human voice contains so many overtones and paying attention to the physics of capturing these is free money.....
McCheese wrote: The VLSSD has the crappiest stereo imagining I've ever heard. Also everthing above 14k sounds tinny and high pitched. Not to mention that if you engage the HPF at 400Hz, it just sucks the low end right out of everything.
This is SOOOOOO true. Stupid VLSSD has absolutely no low end above 14k. Annoys me no end. It's a toy, Ddog. a TOY. Ya hear me??
Cheese: have you ever tried using the LPF at 400Hz? 8)
trojanso9 wrote: see, i am new to all of this i dont understand what the purpose is of having two preamps? do you use both at once or do they have different purposes?
i am looking for way to get a good vocal sound
You only need one preamp, can't plug a mic into two preamps at the same time, can ya? NO! And if you score a Telson you WILL get a good vocal sound.
Before this turns into another 31 page post, let me help you out as I know that I always appreciate some decent advice from my posts.
The first question is, what kind of music are you recording and what kind of sound are you going for (ie clean, vintage, etc)?
Next, are you only trying to capture vocals or are you planning on recording instruments as well? I can answer this one right away, if you're going to be tracking instruments, you'll probably want a >2 channel pre.
What kind of mics do you have?
The fact is, there's no one perfect preamp for any given situation, but there ARE good suggestions for different applications. (See Davedog and Reggie's posts above and just forget about the "Telson")
hi, i am looking for a very clean sound. i am recording mainly pop-punk, alternative/indie type music so there will be instruments as well. the mics i recently purchased were the MXL 990 and 991, and i use the 990 for vocals. i know it isnt the best mic in the world but it was what i could afford at the time. i am looking for a good preamp at a reasonable price.
i started looking at an ART TPS II, i dont know if i should go with it though.
TMA-1...TMA-2 if you wanted a 2-ch. model for almost twice the cash. Those are the tube varieties. If you felt like you were in a solid state kinda mood you could go with a MA1000 or MA2000.
They're not very inventive with their model numbers.
Buy what you can afford with the features you desire that will get the job done for you. You sound a little green to start worrying about preamp colors just yet. Go trudging through the posts already in the "Budget" forum and see what cheap pres are hot (or at least not cold). Use the cheap junk while saving up your money and by the time you have figured out what your tastes are, you might have enough money to get something good.
Ŧ∑∟§Θ∩™ for life.
i wil use the tps for sratch vocals, i use a vox tone lab II for guitar scracth, that has a high impedance out put so does not need to be preampliefied
I've never analysed the pros and cons of the various forms of 1176
trafo input or op-amp input
I suspect the mic loadings will be different
AND
a normal mic-pre is likely to load the mic more that either of the 1176's
side note
An LA2a also has the gain to be a mic-pre and people have used the circuit as a starting point for a fully fledged mic-pre
Obviously with a line level device like the 1176 you don't get phantom or phase ...
which could be an issue as if it is drums you are recording ... snare upper and lower etc.
:roll:
is this of any interest or am I talking to myself and that last comment from TheRealShotgun was just rhetorical ... and just for fun.
I've never analysed the pros and cons of the various forms of 1176
trafo input or op-amp input
I suspect the mic loadings will be different
AND
a normal mic-pre is likely to load the mic more that either of the 1176's
side note
An LA2a also has the gain to be a mic-pre and people have used the circuit as a starting point for a fully fledged mic-pre
Obviously with a line level device like the 1176 you don't get phantom or phase ...
which could be an issue as if it is drums you are recording ... snare upper and lower etc.
:roll:
is this of any interest or am I talking to myself and that last comment from TheRealShotgun was just rhetorical ... and just for fun.
shut up Kev
Hell man, I can't even SPELL rhetorical!
It's interesting I suppose. I probably won't be using said compressors as pres anytime soon, but it's interesting that one can. I suppose I wouldn't have thought of trying it, unless I was desperate I reckon. There's me thinkin inside that box again. I do know a place I used to frequent used to use an LA3 as a vocal processor with little to no compression, but just to get the sound of the circuit on the track, but I'm pretty sure it was downstream from some proper preamp of some type.
I have both the Art and the PreSonus. They both kinda suck. But if you plug into the PreSonus and plug that into the Art, you can really approach the Digitech VTP-1 level of sound. Be creative and trust your ears!
Start off with an ART TubePAC. They are $100, they have a built-in compressor, and you can get a reasonably wide variety of sounds out of it, depending on how hard you push the gain. You won't find anything as versatile for the money.
If you get one, learn to use it with the compressor OFF (ie, the threshold control fully clockwise), get good sounds, then sneak in the compression to smooth things out a bit.
For a cheap preamp, these are actually quite useable.
This preamp is unique because it runs in class B or class C..... AND...if you jam the knob just right it runs in class B and C which gives it and extra dimension of clarity.
I recently picked up a new ART TPS-II after reading about it's build, basic circuit layout and some recommendations from some folks I respect in the industry. Indeed I must say I was pleasantly surprised. Surprised it was as dead quiet for a preamp incorporating 12AX7A's. When you get the gain structure set up properly ( a must which more often than not is messed up by folks less learned in the art of setting up gain levels in a circuit). It affords far more flexibility of adjustment than any other preamp under $500 to be sure. It warms things up considerably and allows for tonal variations and matches with every mic out there due to it's ability to dial in the impedance. It is balanced in and out so hum is a non issue. It is solidly built for products far more expensive. All in all it's hard NOT to use one for it's meager price of $179 (Sweetwater). I couldn't recommend it more highly. Great to DI a electric guitar and makes a cheap dynamic mic sound like a $700 studio mic (which really blew me away). I'd say get one!
Comments
Member for
24 years 4 monthsI don't know about everyone else, but my go-to is a Telson TMA-1
I don't know about everyone else, but my go-to is a Telson TMA-1.
Member for
19 years 10 monthsI like the Apeve 5173. It sounds much better than the Napi 1012
I like the Apeve 5173.
It sounds much better than the Napi 1012.
Try to get one with a Decepticon transformer, or a G-Obot if you're low on funds.
Member for
23 years 1 monthGentlemen, gentlemen,gentlemen, why is always left up to me, MOD
Gentlemen, gentlemen,gentlemen, why is always left up to me, MODerAtoR Man, to correct you guys in situations such as this? Have I not been patient ,ne: over-the-top accepting of your little jibes and antics?
Why oh why do you put me in this position?
EVERYONE knows the Violet Line Super Stereo Dalliator is the FINEST machine that money can buy.
So get it RIGHT ya Heebs....
(yer friend, dogg)
Member for
24 years 4 monthswhat are some good tube mic preamps for a reasonable price
what are some good tube mic preamps for a reasonable price
Member for
19 years 10 monthsThe VLSSD has the crappiest stereo imagining I've ever heard. Al
The VLSSD has the crappiest stereo imagining I've ever heard. Also everthing above 14k sounds tinny and high pitched. Not to mention that if you engage the HPF at 400Hz, it just sucks the low end right out of everything.
Member for
24 years 4 monthsi have these vintech x73i daking 5227 i think that is the model
i have these
vintech x73i
daking 5227 i think that is the model
universal la 610
buzz audio dual channel preamp
and some art tps
Member for
23 years 1 monthYa see what I have to deal with here children? And its everyday!
Ya see what I have to deal with here children? And its everyday!
I got my VLSSD with the 809 mod and it sounds great. Well worth the extra $462.78...IMHO.
Member for
24 years 4 monthsdave can you send me alink to the premapo you are talking about,
dave can you send me alink to the premapo you are talking about, i am always up to see something new!!!
Member for
19 years 10 monthsYeah Dave, post a link. :twisted:
Yeah Dave, post a link. :twisted:
Member for
24 years 4 monthswhat does everyone think of the ART TPS II or the PREsonus B
what does everyone think of the
ART TPS II
or the
PREsonus BlueTube
Member for
23 years 1 monthCheesy Mayor, I was actually looking into the Apeve and the Napi
Cheesy Mayor, I was actually looking into the Apeve and the Napi models you were toutin.....sport.
Member for
20 years 1 monthOMGPMP! :lol: It's hard as hell to find a Telson in decent wo
OMGPMP! :lol:
It's hard as hell to find a Telson in decent working order is the only problem with it. Can't even find much mention of it on google.
You guys are something.
OK guy, here are some buzzwords:
Neve, API, Manley, Universal Audio, John Hardy, Groove Tubes, GML, Avalon, Great River, um um, running out of ideas here, but any of these would be recommended.
Member for
24 years 4 monthsi have 2 tps way better than the blue tube i have owned both
i have 2 tps way better than the blue tube i have owned both
Member for
24 years 4 monthssee, i am new to all of this i dont understand what the purpose
see, i am new to all of this i dont understand what the purpose is of having two preamps? do you use both at once or do they have different purposes?
i am looking for way to get a good vocal sound
Member for
24 years 4 monthswell i like the variable impedance and as you upgrade your studi
well i like the variable impedance and as you upgrade your studio you will find them goo d for secondary things like scratch tracks and if a drums has like 90 toms, they are good to have around, trust me get the tps. the blue tube i have owned and wasnt too thrilled with it
Member for
23 years 1 monthOk I'll quit jackin around for a minute and address this as simp
Ok I'll quit jackin around for a minute and address this as simply as I can.
The preamp is only a 'part' of the recording chain.
A chain will typically include a mic, a pre,and perhaps some type of process or control device and something that records the signal.
The VERY most important part of your chain is the source.
If it doesnt sound good to begin with, theres no possible way ANY gear is going to resolve the bad sound.
Matching the mic to the singer is another important part that gets very little attention.
A GREAT singer...ie: one who has control, tone, and knowledge of mic technique will sound good on virtually ANY signal chain.
Those that need help need to address the basics before making gear decisions.
Theres a common thread running through todays information highway on a lot of these BB's that seems to indicate that one needs to have a tube something to make vocals sound 'good'...While this may or may not be true, the environment the vocals is tracked in has as much if not more to do with the sound than the advent of a tube in the chain.
See kids.....dadogg is 'old skool'....sh*t in=sh*t out....
So...search for a mic that you can learn to use and sounds 'right' for your purpose. Find a mic pre that compliments the mics' 'signature'..This may include a tube but more than likely a simple voltage in =voltage out situation without too many artifacts will get you closer to what you're looking for than a fruitless search for that silver bullet piece of gear. Look at your environment you are recording in. Learn about sound control. For vocals you dont have to have a huge area, but you have to have control of its tones and standing waves,reflections and flutters. The human voice contains so many overtones and paying attention to the physics of capturing these is free money.....
nuff said....
Member for
24 years 4 monthsso so eightson. in order to do scratch tracks you need another
so
so eightson. in order to do scratch tracks you need another pre amp?
Member for
24 years 4 monthsMcCheese wrote: The VLSSD has the crappiest stereo imagining I'v
This is SOOOOOO true. Stupid VLSSD has absolutely no low end above 14k. Annoys me no end. It's a toy, Ddog. a TOY. Ya hear me??
Cheese: have you ever tried using the LPF at 400Hz? 8)
Member for
24 years 4 monthstrojanso9 wrote: see, i am new to all of this i dont understand
You only need one preamp, can't plug a mic into two preamps at the same time, can ya? NO! And if you score a Telson you WILL get a good vocal sound.
Member for
24 years 4 monthswhat telson models are good?
what telson models are good?
Member for
24 years 4 monthsBefore this turns into another 31 page post, let me help you out
Before this turns into another 31 page post, let me help you out as I know that I always appreciate some decent advice from my posts.
The first question is, what kind of music are you recording and what kind of sound are you going for (ie clean, vintage, etc)?
Next, are you only trying to capture vocals or are you planning on recording instruments as well? I can answer this one right away, if you're going to be tracking instruments, you'll probably want a >2 channel pre.
What kind of mics do you have?
The fact is, there's no one perfect preamp for any given situation, but there ARE good suggestions for different applications. (See Davedog and Reggie's posts above and just forget about the "Telson")
Member for
24 years 4 monthshi, i am looking for a very clean sound. i am recording mainly p
hi, i am looking for a very clean sound. i am recording mainly pop-punk, alternative/indie type music so there will be instruments as well. the mics i recently purchased were the MXL 990 and 991, and i use the 990 for vocals. i know it isnt the best mic in the world but it was what i could afford at the time. i am looking for a good preamp at a reasonable price.
i started looking at an ART TPS II, i dont know if i should go with it though.
Member for
24 years 4 monthstrojanso9 wrote: what telson models are good? TMA-1...TMA-2 if
TMA-1...TMA-2 if you wanted a 2-ch. model for almost twice the cash. Those are the tube varieties. If you felt like you were in a solid state kinda mood you could go with a MA1000 or MA2000.
They're not very inventive with their model numbers.
Can't beat the sound, though.
~S
Member for
24 years 4 monthsHERE
HERE
Member for
24 years 4 monthsthe link did not work. it said no search results . i cant find a
the link did not work. it said no search results . i cant find anything about telson anywhere
Member for
24 years 4 monthsexactly... :shock:
exactly... :shock:
Member for
24 years 4 monthsha. so what do you recomend i buy?
ha. so what do you recomend i buy?
Member for
20 years 1 monthBuy what you can afford with the features you desire that will g
Buy what you can afford with the features you desire that will get the job done for you. You sound a little green to start worrying about preamp colors just yet. Go trudging through the posts already in the "Budget" forum and see what cheap pres are hot (or at least not cold). Use the cheap junk while saving up your money and by the time you have figured out what your tastes are, you might have enough money to get something good.
Ŧ∑∟§Θ∩™ for life.
Member for
24 years 4 monthsi wil use the tps for sratch vocals, i use a vox tone lab II for
i wil use the tps for sratch vocals, i use a vox tone lab II for guitar scracth, that has a high impedance out put so does not need to be preampliefied
Member for
19 yearsIt all depends what your doing but the two Ive been most impress
It all depends what your doing but the two Ive been most impressed with is the Urei 1176LN and the Trident S40
Member for
24 years 4 monthsGraham_Waller wrote: the Urei 1176LN A preamp you say?
A preamp you say?
Member for
23 years 2 monthsyeah if you have a hot mic or a really hot signal ... or both A
yeah
if you have a hot mic or a really hot signal ... or both
A mic straight to 1176 can compress and still make it to line level.
Member for
24 years 4 monthsKev wrote: yeah if you have a hot mic or a really hot signal ...
Well I'll be damned, never tried that.
Member for
23 years 2 monthsyep I've never analysed the pros and cons of the various forms
yep
I've never analysed the pros and cons of the various forms of 1176
trafo input or op-amp input
I suspect the mic loadings will be different
AND
a normal mic-pre is likely to load the mic more that either of the 1176's
side note
An LA2a also has the gain to be a mic-pre and people have used the circuit as a starting point for a fully fledged mic-pre
Obviously with a line level device like the 1176 you don't get phantom or phase ...
which could be an issue as if it is drums you are recording ... snare upper and lower etc.
:roll:
is this of any interest or am I talking to myself and that last comment from TheRealShotgun was just rhetorical ... and just for fun.
shut up Kev
Member for
24 years 4 monthsKev wrote: yep I've never analysed the pros and cons of the var
Hell man, I can't even SPELL rhetorical!
It's interesting I suppose. I probably won't be using said compressors as pres anytime soon, but it's interesting that one can. I suppose I wouldn't have thought of trying it, unless I was desperate I reckon. There's me thinkin inside that box again. I do know a place I used to frequent used to use an LA3 as a vocal processor with little to no compression, but just to get the sound of the circuit on the track, but I'm pretty sure it was downstream from some proper preamp of some type.
~S
Member for
24 years 4 monthsI have both the Art and the PreSonus. They both kinda suck. Bu
I have both the Art and the PreSonus. They both kinda suck. But if you plug into the PreSonus and plug that into the Art, you can really approach the Digitech VTP-1 level of sound. Be creative and trust your ears!
-olops
Member for
18 years 11 monthsStart off with an ART TubePAC. They are $100, they have a built-
Start off with an ART TubePAC. They are $100, they have a built-in compressor, and you can get a reasonably wide variety of sounds out of it, depending on how hard you push the gain. You won't find anything as versatile for the money.
If you get one, learn to use it with the compressor OFF (ie, the threshold control fully clockwise), get good sounds, then sneak in the compression to smooth things out a bit.
For a cheap preamp, these are actually quite useable.
Member for
24 years 4 monthsAt Home: Grace 201 and 4 Rnc for compression At Work: Amek, Focu
At Home: Grace 201 and 4 Rnc for compression
At Work: Amek, Focusrite, Manley, and Tube Tech, Urei, Empherical Labs for compression.
Member for
23 years 5 monthsMy favorite preamp is the Clarity Plus: This preamp is uniq
My favorite preamp is the Clarity Plus:
This preamp is unique because it runs in class B or class C..... AND...if you jam the knob just right it runs in class B and C which gives it and extra dimension of clarity.
Good luck on your choice
Member for
24 years 4 monthsI recently picked up a new ART TPS-II after reading about it's b
I recently picked up a new ART TPS-II after reading about it's build, basic circuit layout and some recommendations from some folks I respect in the industry. Indeed I must say I was pleasantly surprised. Surprised it was as dead quiet for a preamp incorporating 12AX7A's. When you get the gain structure set up properly ( a must which more often than not is messed up by folks less learned in the art of setting up gain levels in a circuit). It affords far more flexibility of adjustment than any other preamp under $500 to be sure. It warms things up considerably and allows for tonal variations and matches with every mic out there due to it's ability to dial in the impedance. It is balanced in and out so hum is a non issue. It is solidly built for products far more expensive. All in all it's hard NOT to use one for it's meager price of $179 (Sweetwater). I couldn't recommend it more highly. Great to DI a electric guitar and makes a cheap dynamic mic sound like a $700 studio mic (which really blew me away). I'd say get one!