Just so we are clear, are the mics that you have listed mics that you DO NOT HAVE.
A few other things will help;
1) What do you want to use the mics for (Vocals, all around, drums etc..)
2) What budget are you trying to stay within

Groove Tube MD1

I've got a Groove Tube MD1a (I think that's it). Great tube mic! I've used it on vocals, acoustic guitar, distant micing a guitar cab, as a drum overhead, and as a kick drum mic (put it about 1 foot in front of the drum...sounds nice). It does all of these things very well I think. I do think the high end sounds a little bit "mechanical" or "cold" on certain voices, but for everything that it does well, this is a minor quible which could probably be compensated for. My friend who uses one of these put an old Telefunken tube in it and this seemed to improve the high end sound. To me (being a drummer) they really stand out as a drum overhead. Seems to make the kit sound real and natural, while imparting a smoothness and fullness to the drums. It will obviously color the sound of the drums, but to me, it does it in such a nice way. It just makes a good sounding kit sound great!

goldcut wrote: hi all!
im gonna buy a couple of microphone and wanted your advice about my list, if some of you have own or use those mic, or have any suggestion on good mic to replace some on my list!

ok heres it goes :

BeyerDynamic Opus 65 : for both kick and bass cab
ElectroVoice N/D 868 : kick
Neumann U87 : vocal
Neumann TLM 103 : all around mic, vocal.
Royer R-121 : mainly on guitare amp
Audix D2 : tom
Oktava Mk012 : overhead and other use
GrooveTube Ditto

thx!

those are mic i want to buy on next move ill made. I was wonder what you think about those, any advice on it? My budget is around 4000$ us.

Thanks all!

you might also want to have a look at the rode K2. Great mic. Also some Audio technica stuff like the 4033 or 4047/sv. Just for some variation.

But hey can go wrong with the U87. Id use it on everything :)

All good choices. The TLM 103 I wonder about a bit. Have you used one? I'm not a fan though they do exhibit some of that Neumann character, just not enough to warrant the price. At around the same retail, the Peluso 22 47 is a much better sounding and more complete mic. The Soundelux U195 is also a better choice especially in versatility. The U87 is a great mic, though for a primary vocal mic, I would want to try it on my voice before deciding on it exclusively. Some voices just dont sound all that great on em....on the other hand it will work very very well on ANY source. As you listed the TLM as the all-around mic, I would think of the 87 as the all arounder and look for something with character for the primary vocal mic. The peluso, and the Soundelux are just that. The K2, as mentioned, is also a character mic, as would be an ADK TT or some similar tube based mic. I like the fet mics for about everything and always seek a good tube for a primary voice.

I also like that EV mic on kick. Its a bit 'brittle' in its highs but sometimes thats what you need to get that clik out in front for that kick sound. It also has that nice smak to it. The ATM25 has tighter low-end and is cheaper(not the 'Pro' series), and I also like the Shure Beta 52.

The Octavas are fine for what you list their uses. At that price and level, there are several that do the job equally and it becomes a matter of tonal choice at that point.

The Royer is an amazing mic. nuff said!

The Audix D2 is one of my go-to mics and I use em on a LOT of things ...I also like the D4. The D6 kick mic is probably the most 'automatic' kick drum mic made. Their small diaphram condensers are incredible...you should try em out.

Good luck with your purchases.

hmmmmm

The Oktava seems like it does not fit - they are harsh on a lot of sources esp HH imho. I had some once. I never thought of a U87 as a primary vocal mic either. Its a good general purpose mic but you can do a lot better for the money. for example, for the same money you could get a soundelux iFet7 which is both a u87 and a u47fet. Finally, The TLM 103 seems to be a mic that is treated like an elder statesman with bad breath. It gets guarded respect, but never true love. I've used them and I feel that way. Good mic, but it will never rock my world. The r84, on the other hand, has made my jaw drop several times - like the time the dobro player asked me to turn on his headphones - and they WERE on.

As far as a mic for guitar cabs, I have a kel HM1 and an AEA r84 and on guitar cabs the HM1 is just as good (or really, really good too) for 1 tenth the price. I find the ribbon to be outstanding on stuff like dobro, mando, and anything with a nasty high end to tame and beautiful midrange transients to showcase. t

Hey, every studio shoud have an U87. there is a reason they have the reputation they have- its not hype at all. The sm57 and the U87 are probaly the 2 best known mics in the world and they have a rep because they have performed over and over millions of times and gotten great results- now there are people who prefer other mics- nothing wrong with that- but the sheen and the luster that the u87 gives to certain lead vox is woth the price of admission IMHO. I no longer have access to 87's- I used to have a recording buddy who owened 2 old ones in top shape and I loved them! I do miss them- I bought a pair of K2 tube mics that I use a lot for many things and I am very happy with- male vox, female vox, percussion, etc. but I still do miss those 87's.... one of these days am gonna get me one!

Well thanks everyone for your input it is greatly appreciated!

I know theres is those who really love the U87 and they are those who think it is a overrated mic, and same thing about the TLM103. Well the U87 i really liked it, the TLM103 i didnt try it. I will before ill buy it. Wich of those 2 are the best bang for the buck?

Im checking about the AEA r84 to replace the Royer, thanks for the clue! Is it the same quality of microphone? I've heard about Kel microphone too, at 99$us i will surely try one of those!

I dont wanna buy Rode or Audio Technica, they are making great microphone but still, i feel like i wanna buy the real thing.

Modification to my list then :

U87 as all around
Soundelux U195 as main vocal microphone.

What do you think about it?
im still thinking about other options too...

one more thing

As I look at the thread you seem very concerned with getting the right Large Condensers, with out too much dialog about or attention to the small condensers. I could not let go without saying this:

The sdc's are workhorses. They are inherantly flatter than ldc's, more flexible in terms of placement, easy to make xy pairs with etc.
Also, looks like most of your kit is cardioid...but the joys of omni are many. Many sdc's come with capsule sets that will make it cheap to have pattern options. (Has anyone tried the THE sdc or the M series Gefell sdc?, I've read glowing reports on both).

You might consider getting either a 195 or U87 (not both) and dropping some serious bucks on a great sdc pair instead of two similar sdc's. You won't be sorry. Some people use SDC's for vocals. Get some that have multiple capsules, rolloff, pad etc, and they WILL save you ass someday.

When somebody walks in with an accordian or a bagpipe, or an irish drum and you want to try phase experiments with matched mics, or try an omni capsule to capture that big zone, or whatever - you'll turn to your sdc's and be happy you bought good ones.

goldcut wrote: I dont wanna buy Rode or Audio Technica, they are making great microphone but still, i feel like i wanna buy the real thing

I don't think you are doing yourself any favours by discounting these brands.

I love my U87, and I think it is one of the best purchases I've ever made. However I think the AT4060 is one serious mic. So it doesn't come from Neumann or one of the 'exclusive' manufacturers, but it is the real thing, and in spite of being cardioid only, it is extremely versatile.

Whatever you decide to get, good luck with it.

John Stafford

Thanks for taking time to watch my list and give me advice.

Heres a revised list...

Im searching for a Great Vocal mic that will also work on many other source as well, a all-around/vocal mic. I've got 3 options (and im open for other too) :
- Neumann U87
- Soundelux U195
- Neumann TLM 103 (the last in the list)

I love ribbon mic so i wanna buy at least one, as i dont have any right now. I've see 2 options out theres :
- Royer R-121, seem brighter and accurate, i'll use it mostly for guitar cab, ambiance of the room and anything else it gonna work with!
- AEA R84, seem more melow and dark, mostly also for guitar cab, but this mic seem to work on more type of source than the Royer.

I would like to have both but i think im not gonna be able to afford it.

I dont have GOOD small condensator mic, i've bought the Oktava MK012 mostly for overhead on drum, ill see if im happy with it on other source. Any suggestion for those mic? I would pay not more than 1000$ for a pair.

Then for kick and bass amp, i would buy those 2 mic :
- EV 868
- Beyerdynamic Opus 65

For drum and all around dynamic, those 2 mic :
- Audix D2
- KEL HM1

Plus ill buy a Groove Tube Ditto DI.

i already have sm57, sm58, 421, at3035 in my locker, + akg414 and akg 535 that i borrow some time, but i dont own.

Thanks for watching my post!
Mathieu

FYI: The Groove Tubes Ditto is a terrible mic.

:lol: Sorry, couldn't resist.

Buy your 87 used. Look for an older purple badged one. Make sure its been serviced recently.You'll save a little coin this way.The retail on these is way over the value at this time.

OR...forget the U195 and the 87 and do as was suggested and spend the rent on a Soundelux iFET47......you will NOT be disappointed in any way.

At a grand for small d. mics, you might as well look into the KM184/185 series. The Shoeps and the Gefell also. The Earthworks are very incredible mics. The difference in these and the cheaper sdc's is striking. The Shure SM81 is still a very good mic...neutral and sensitive... Audio Technica 4041 is an excellent mic. And their Pro37 is an incredible buy. To think that these are not 'the real deal' shows you havent experienced their quality. The 40 series are all very good mics and the bang-for-the-buck ratings are high.
The 4033 can be found in even the most sofisticated mic locker.

If you are serious about mics, then do yourself a favor and get a Beyer 201 for the snare. They are almost automatic in the placement and will save you much consternation and headaches along the way. These are also mics that will tame the most unsofisticated sources. ie:Hurdy-Gurdy...accordian...out-of-tune banjolins....etc.

well well well
thanks again folks!

if you had to pick up 2 mic on those 4, what would be your choices?

-Neumann U87
-Soundelux IFET7
-Soundelux U195
-Gefell M930

then i think ill go for both royer r-121 and aea r84 ribbon mic, they seem to be really different.

still thinking about those sdc...

and about the boyer 201, you would put it under or on top of the snare? this is a condensator.

thanks dave

Davedog wrote: Buy your 87 used. Look for an older purple badged one. Make sure its been serviced recently.You'll save a little coin this way.The retail on these is way over the value at this time

What's the difference between the purple and blue badged versions? According to Neumann, blue label is digital, which of course is not the case with the U87. Just curious.

Thanks
John

Can the U87 and get a Microtek Geffel Um70 same capsule great sounding 1/2 the price !!! there is also the new Um75 that is a reissue .

Later
Buzz

buzz wrote: Can the U87 and get a Microtek Geffel Um70 same capsule great sounding 1/2 the price !!! there is also the new Um75 that is a reissue

The capsule in the Microtech Gefell is an M7 like the early U47 and M49. This is not the same as the capsule in the U87, which is like the one from the U67. The M7 and the K67/K870 are very different capsules.

John

Another thing is that MG make these capsules by hand. Everything's done in the old Neumann way, and given that German labour is rather expensive, the prices they charge are ridiculously low. I don't suppose these prices will last forever.

John

Okay...The Beyer is a dynamic mic not a condenser. Its applications are endless. I use them on snare top and bottom depending on the sound needed. I have never had one sound bad on any source. Like I said, they are basically instant placement kinda mics. I would rate it as a studio standard along with the SM57,U87,and the AT4033. Most major studios have one or more in their locker....for a good reason. Best hihat mic I've ever used.

In choosing one of the four on your list, with the choice of a Soundelux iFET47 you no longer will need a U87 as the Soundelux has the circuitry of the 87 as well as the circuitry of a 47fet. It displays the sound of both by use of a switch. The Gefell I have not heard but people whos recordings I admire really love these mics so I would recommend it based on this. Its just another thing I personally have gotta get for myself! I have heard the UM70 and they are killer.

As for the Neumann badging.....I simply like the purple badged mics better. They have a greater low-end than the newer ones and the highs, while both are there and present, seem to be silkier and smoother with the older mics.I'm no historian as when these different colors were released and what significance they have as far as design, I just know what I liked. Again a moot point with the purchase of a Soundelx iFET47.

I LOVE ribbon mics. I owned a Beyer 500 at one time(stupid stupid stupid!!!! sold it ........ah well) I dont think you can have too many ribbons. They are all very different so use em all. The Royer is a great mic and a hardier one than some ribbons so they are easier to use and less likely to be put into a damage situation.

Thanks Dave.

I was searching for info on Soundelux iFet47, i just found the iFet7. Have you done an error with the name?

Then im a bit confused about Gefell company. Is there is 2 company who use this name? Neumann-Gefell and Microtehc Gefell are they the same? Then what about the Telefunken ? Is it affiliated or a division of Neumann?

Thanks
Mathieu

John I stand corrected Thank you it is the M7 capsule ( mic really sounds good tho !!! ) I paid $700 for mine best purchase of a mic for me.

Microtek Geffell is the East German version of Nuemann-geffel , there is an explaination here http://www.microtechgefell.com/eng/home.htm

Later
Buzz

Mathieu...It is the iFet7...my typing haste!

buzz wrote: John I stand corrected Thank you it is the M7 capsule ( mic really sounds good tho !!! ) I paid $700 for mine best purchase of a mic for me.

Buzz
It's quite amazing that a company that makes the M7 properly sells them so cheaply. Just think of how much you'd have to pay for a vintage Neumann with an M7! The latest addition to my lust-list is the MG UM-900.

John