I have worked up several layouts....trying to fit into space we have which is L-shaped....trying to maximize use of space....wanting big enough control room to be both comfortable & inviting while still be acoustically as great as possible....we are doing DIY....build at least or most of....we have a very creative architect with experience in a few studio spaces including Red Bull Music Academy in NYC....but still trying to do as much as can in planning layout
What are the main uses for the studio? Live band tracking? Cutting just basics live? Singer/songwriter? Mostly mixing and overdubs?
How much isolation is needed?
With a "tricky" space like an L shaped outer shell the designed will have to be based on what's the most important intended use, and provisions made for the less likely uses.
The one with the yellow treatment depicted and the rectangular control room shell is the best layout of all the ones pictured.
The "sayer's" influenced one is decent but requires sophisticated software and an experienced user to predict the modal behavior. Also with sliding glass doors in the direct reflection zones there could be erratic behavior in mids and highs, despite having angled walls.
And a booth that small will require treatment on the glass doors to be useful.
Sliding glass doors are notoriously difficult to seal, it's not just mass that's a concern. So these will be a limiting factor on isolation. Which may or may not be an issue depending on the needs to define.
A studio is a custom design and needs to have well defined needs and priorities established before a design can be critiqued in any meaningful way.
kmetal, agree with all you said....including sliding glass doors....BUT there are advantages to having as well....such as improved visibility and access....as for the one you liked that doesn't work as not enough space for console (cannot use top left corner)....
We will be tracking live off the floor....in many genres (my personal fav is roots of all kinds)....plus mixing (mostly iITB)....we have considerable amount of vintage gear....are setting up hybrid studio....a small boutique studio with cool vibe....welcoming and creative space....
As for complicated using corner control room being specific design I agree....control room being small I don't....it is over 200 sq. ft....fits our 40 ch. console with wings
Is is possible to modify the rectangular CR version so the console fits?
With your needs an open live room makes sense. In the sayer's style iteration, I would consider making what is the booth, a storage/amp closet. Then make the vocal booth at the top right.
This would give you some options. You could have 2 amps isolated, bass DI, and drums, for tracking live with enough isolation to overdub. Best of live tracking and overdubs. Scratch vocals could be in the CR.
Alternatively you could have the singer in the top booth with clear sightlines to the main room, and CR.
I think the small booth would be fine for storage and an amp can, in general, with the larger vocal booth more comfortable and better sightlines. It leaves more since for HVAC and treatments. 6-12" treatments in the small booth would make it quite little and not comfortable.
Ive achieved very good results in a 1000 sqft studio that has a live room, 3 booths, control room and hall. Whether the amps go in the booth or all in a the control room, it's great to have versatility. Given the shape of yours I think the 2 booths could work well overall.
Considering the suggestions made but not able to fit console into upper left....only 11.5 ft after wall assembled,,,.so I have redone some older layouts and made simpler:
The second one looks like it could work pretty well all around.
You will need software that can do BEM/FEM in order to predict the modal behavior of a non rectangular structal walls, particularly for the CR this is important. One also needs experience interpreting the models into reality where the walls are not infinitely thick and massive.
The design does trade off the larger sized live room which is better suited to live performance ensembles, sightlines, and natural ambience.
Its not necessarily good or bad, just about preference. There's compromise in any design.
I want to thank everybody for their suggestions....we have our studio layout finally....it is not really like anything I posted of my own....however I'm not able to share it on this or any other forum, as have been asked not to....actually I'd rather show the real deal next time I post here so in the future I will be posting as we get into the actual build....including photos if you like....
Looking forward hearing about the progress (the wiring, acoustics, future projects etc). Many of us have done this as well and it would be super fun hearing your journey as you continue building it all. Very exciting!
I have been gone awhile....about a year....maybe even said a few things that I now regret having said....but I'm happy my account was reactivated....looking forward to taking part in solid positive discussion from here on....
We have had to change plans a few times regarding the studio....unfortunately the two storey garage we had hoped to originally build in was caught up in an unresolved dispute between the landlord and his brother (who had used the garage as his private unpaid storage and refused to move his stuff)....before that though we had come up with a design that seemed it would work well for that space:
But as stated that build fell through....so we looked at several other spaces....for lease or sale....but always found something not quite right....subway running underneath....cost of retrofit....environmental cleanup involved....we looked at warehouse spaces....churches....and everything in between....here are some of the potential layouts:
Obviously our plans have greatly changed....definitely increased in size by quite a bit....but fortunately we have partners and investors with deep pockets to make this a reality....the emphasis of the studio will be on the production of immersive music
Still waiting on deal on property to close....learning patience lol....but gave time to rethink layout.....to maximize space.....looking at two FIX immersive consoles in A & C (64 ch. and 48 ch. respectively....although may go with an API 2448 32 ch. with automation (has recall) in C), a 8 ch. FIX stereo in B joined with Slate Raven Core Station, then possibly a Rupert Neve Designs 5088 with Swiftmix automation (no recall) in E and an SSL ORIGIN 32 ch. in D.
This provides a strong immersive emphasis....plus great tracking/mixing options in stereo for C & E....with SSL as an educational/training workshop console as well as tracking small bands....B is a singer/songwriter space but also connected into C live room space.
On top of these have amazing collection of mis and outboard gear including vintage gear....as well as two tape machines....so best of old and new.....
After several false starts, whether looking at retrofitting an old church or updating an old studio, even considering a large build from the ground up, to trying to include too many others as partners, my partner & I decided to go it with just ourselves....just the two of us....in a small project production studio.....first retrofitting his home studio into more of a hybrid space complete with an API 2448 console (24 ch, still small enough for a home studio/small project studio)....utilizing every possible space available (the kitchen is now a drum room as well as bass....vocals and guitars in living room.....bathroom is an iso booth.....an upright piano in bedroom)....using an open room approach....a la Daniel Lanois or Sylvia Massy.....with everything pretty much permanently mic'd. (similar to Butch Walker's studio workflow).....
The console is set up in this fashion:
Eventually we intend to also build a more formal recording studio....using the garage we had originally considered (as it is now available again):
Adding Trident 68/78/88 to considerations....preference of those would be Trident 88....punchy sound similar to modern APIs....but considerably less....
Audient ASP 8024 HE is a possibility as very well thought out but is too clean a sound, lacks colour. IMO
We have decided to go with the K.I.S.S principle....Keep It Simple Stupid....in our approach to building up the studio(s).....we are seriously thinking of going with a Trident 88.....in a custom desk with pullout shelf for keyboard....that will fit nicely in 59 inch space in home studio:
Comments
I have worked up several…
I have worked up several layouts....trying to fit into space we have which is L-shaped....trying to maximize use of space....wanting big enough control room to be both comfortable & inviting while still be acoustically as great as possible....we are doing DIY....build at least or most of....we have a very creative architect with experience in a few studio spaces including Red Bull Music Academy in NYC....but still trying to do as much as can in planning layout
Another is
Another is
In reply to Another is by Studio Jiimaan
Then I looked at using a…
Then I looked at using a John Sayers corner control room....
We cannot build control room…
We cannot build control room in upper left (as shown in design b) as too small for console....
Awesome post! I’ll be…
Welcome to RO.
I can’t help you on this one but looking forward to comments.
What are the main uses for…
What are the main uses for the studio? Live band tracking? Cutting just basics live? Singer/songwriter? Mostly mixing and overdubs?
How much isolation is needed?
With a "tricky" space like an L shaped outer shell the designed will have to be based on what's the most important intended use, and provisions made for the less likely uses.
The one with the yellow treatment depicted and the rectangular control room shell is the best layout of all the ones pictured.
The "sayer's" influenced one is decent but requires sophisticated software and an experienced user to predict the modal behavior. Also with sliding glass doors in the direct reflection zones there could be erratic behavior in mids and highs, despite having angled walls.
And a booth that small will require treatment on the glass doors to be useful.
Sliding glass doors are notoriously difficult to seal, it's not just mass that's a concern. So these will be a limiting factor on isolation. Which may or may not be an issue depending on the needs to define.
A studio is a custom design and needs to have well defined needs and priorities established before a design can be critiqued in any meaningful way.
In reply to What are the main uses for… by kmetal
kmetal, agree with all you…
kmetal, agree with all you said....including sliding glass doors....BUT there are advantages to having as well....such as improved visibility and access....as for the one you liked that doesn't work as not enough space for console (cannot use top left corner)....
We will be tracking live off the floor....in many genres (my personal fav is roots of all kinds)....plus mixing (mostly iITB)....we have considerable amount of vintage gear....are setting up hybrid studio....a small boutique studio with cool vibe....welcoming and creative space....
As for complicated using corner control room being specific design I agree....control room being small I don't....it is over 200 sq. ft....fits our 40 ch. console with wings
CR approx. 242 sq. ftLR …
APPROX. TOTAL STUDIO AREA: 780 SQ. FT
CR approx. 350 sq. ft
LR approx. 400 sq. ft.
BOOTH approx. 30 sq. ft.
Is is possible to modify the…
Is is possible to modify the rectangular CR version so the console fits?
With your needs an open live room makes sense. In the sayer's style iteration, I would consider making what is the booth, a storage/amp closet. Then make the vocal booth at the top right.
This would give you some options. You could have 2 amps isolated, bass DI, and drums, for tracking live with enough isolation to overdub. Best of live tracking and overdubs. Scratch vocals could be in the CR.
Alternatively you could have the singer in the top booth with clear sightlines to the main room, and CR.
I think the small booth would be fine for storage and an amp can, in general, with the larger vocal booth more comfortable and better sightlines. It leaves more since for HVAC and treatments. 6-12" treatments in the small booth would make it quite little and not comfortable.
Ive achieved very good results in a 1000 sqft studio that has a live room, 3 booths, control room and hall. Whether the amps go in the booth or all in a the control room, it's great to have versatility. Given the shape of yours I think the 2 booths could work well overall.
Considering the suggestions…
Considering the suggestions made but not able to fit console into upper left....only 11.5 ft after wall assembled,,,.so I have redone some older layouts and made simpler:
(No subject)
The second one looks like it…
The second one looks like it could work pretty well all around.
You will need software that can do BEM/FEM in order to predict the modal behavior of a non rectangular structal walls, particularly for the CR this is important. One also needs experience interpreting the models into reality where the walls are not infinitely thick and massive.
The design does trade off the larger sized live room which is better suited to live performance ensembles, sightlines, and natural ambience.
Its not necessarily good or bad, just about preference. There's compromise in any design.
I want to thank everybody…
I want to thank everybody for their suggestions....we have our studio layout finally....it is not really like anything I posted of my own....however I'm not able to share it on this or any other forum, as have been asked not to....actually I'd rather show the real deal next time I post here so in the future I will be posting as we get into the actual build....including photos if you like....
But thank you all so much for your feedback....
Great best of luck!!!
Great best of luck!!!
Looking forward hearing…
Looking forward hearing about the progress (the wiring, acoustics, future projects etc). Many of us have done this as well and it would be super fun hearing your journey as you continue building it all. Very exciting!
You are welcome to add your studio to our new directory https://recording.o….
Cheers!
In reply to Looking forward hearing… by audiokid
new studio
Think we should wait until built....give us until end of summer....
In reply to Looking forward hearing… by audiokid
Will once built later this…
Will once built later this summer
Been Gone Awhile....Many Changes
I have been gone awhile....about a year....maybe even said a few things that I now regret having said....but I'm happy my account was reactivated....looking forward to taking part in solid positive discussion from here on....
We have had to change plans a few times regarding the studio....unfortunately the two storey garage we had hoped to originally build in was caught up in an unresolved dispute between the landlord and his brother (who had used the garage as his private unpaid storage and refused to move his stuff)....before that though we had come up with a design that seemed it would work well for that space:
Been Gone Awhile....Many Changes Part 2
But as stated that build fell through....so we looked at several other spaces....for lease or sale....but always found something not quite right....subway running underneath....cost of retrofit....environmental cleanup involved....we looked at warehouse spaces....churches....and everything in between....here are some of the potential layouts:
Been Gone Awhile....Many Changes continued
Been Gone Awhile....Decided Finally To Build From Ground Up
Emphasis
Obviously our plans have greatly changed....definitely increased in size by quite a bit....but fortunately we have partners and investors with deep pockets to make this a reality....the emphasis of the studio will be on the production of immersive music
Great to have you back! Love…
Great to have you back! Love this stuff :) The build looks like its going to be amazing. Please keep us updated.
Been Gone Awhile....Many Changes
Been Gone Awhile....Many Changes
Still waiting on deal on property to close....learning patience lol....but gave time to rethink layout.....to maximize space.....looking at two FIX immersive consoles in A & C (64 ch. and 48 ch. respectively....although may go with an API 2448 32 ch. with automation (has recall) in C), a 8 ch. FIX stereo in B joined with Slate Raven Core Station, then possibly a Rupert Neve Designs 5088 with Swiftmix automation (no recall) in E and an SSL ORIGIN 32 ch. in D.
This provides a strong immersive emphasis....plus great tracking/mixing options in stereo for C & E....with SSL as an educational/training workshop console as well as tracking small bands....B is a singer/songwriter space but also connected into C live room space.
On top of these have amazing collection of mis and outboard gear including vintage gear....as well as two tape machines....so best of old and new.....
How's the new studio going?
How's the new studio going?
After several false starts,…
After several false starts, whether looking at retrofitting an old church or updating an old studio, even considering a large build from the ground up, to trying to include too many others as partners, my partner & I decided to go it with just ourselves....just the two of us....in a small project production studio.....first retrofitting his home studio into more of a hybrid space complete with an API 2448 console (24 ch, still small enough for a home studio/small project studio)....utilizing every possible space available (the kitchen is now a drum room as well as bass....vocals and guitars in living room.....bathroom is an iso booth.....an upright piano in bedroom)....using an open room approach....a la Daniel Lanois or Sylvia Massy.....with everything pretty much permanently mic'd. (similar to Butch Walker's studio workflow).....
The console is set up in this fashion:
Eventually we intend to also build a more formal recording studio....using the garage we had originally considered (as it is now available again):
We're in uncertain times so…
We're in uncertain times so it sounds like you are carefully thinking through things. Less people involved is probably a much wiser approach.
I'd love to have an API 2448 console. Looking forward to hearing how it all goes. Thanks for the update.
We have been offered an…
We have been offered an opportunity on a Wunder console....anyone with insight into? Seems like a great console from what have heard....
Photos Of Home Studio Space
Adding Trident 68/78/88 to…
Adding Trident 68/78/88 to considerations....preference of those would be Trident 88....punchy sound similar to modern APIs....but considerably less....
Audient ASP 8024 HE is a possibility as very well thought out but is too clean a sound, lacks colour. IMO
(No subject)
(No subject)
We have decided to go with…
We have decided to go with the K.I.S.S principle....Keep It Simple Stupid....in our approach to building up the studio(s).....we are seriously thinking of going with a Trident 88.....in a custom desk with pullout shelf for keyboard....that will fit nicely in 59 inch space in home studio:
Good enough for Daniel Lanois should be good enough for us lol:
We have booked time in a…
We have booked time in a studio with a Trident 88 so can finalize decision before ordering. To be sure of choice.
Exciting, looking forward to…
Exciting, looking forward to hearing about it!
Redesigned desk:
Redesigned desk:
Love that including having a…
Love that including having a keyboard midi controller below. You have some fun decisions.
So the next stage is…
So the next stage is beginning....but need to decide on the best layout for the build: