Too many broken arrows on that field, but no winner.

Budget???

Main board: Intel, Asus, Abit (brand name, less «on the board» things)

Processor: Intel P4, 3.0 or higher, with 1 MB cache memory
RAM: 1 GB minimum (the more the better), with smaller CAS latency

Hard Disc: Get a pair (system and data). WD Raptor (SATA ,74 GB, 10 000 rpm) would be fine.

VGA: ATI Radeon, Nvidia or similar, 128 MB passive

CDR/DVDR: Plextor

Cooler: Zalman (i.e.7000) - very important thing

Power: Zalman, Tagan -ultra important thing

Tower: Big & airy

Something like this could serve to you in next 3-4 years.

Avoid buying the latest technical miracle – too expensive and many things/options you don’t need for the job, and it's not «proved on the road». Jet.

Sound Blaster ??? Pssssst, do not even think about SB on recording.org. Computer is noisy environment so try to find card/system outside the box.

Any Mac will do as long as your Mac is a Mac. The thing is, it should be a Mac. Did I mention it should be a Mac. PC's are fine, though when one compares them to a Mac, they go half as fast, break twice as often, and find their way to the dump in half the time.

I am right now surrounded by 3 PC's, all less than 3 years old, in various states of non functioning uselessness, as I write this on my Mac, which has a date of manufacture of 1994, and which is humming happily, though more slowly these days, along. Everybody who is still running their day to day lives on an 11 year old PC raise their hand...I thought so.

As if the hardware wasn't enough of an issue:

Microsoft: "Hmm, let's upgrade our windows program so it's almost as good, though not as stable, as a Mac-1984, then let's sell more upgrades and versions which are from the same disfunctional family. YAY! Look at us sell programs. Oh, and let's pretend that there will never be a year 2000, so when the time comes we can sell even more stuff. Whoopee, look at that stock go. It's all about 'out with the old, in with the not new but not compatable with the old either!' "

Result: a 1964 beetle with a nice paint job, painted over the rust spots.

Apple: "Hey guys, we already have an OS that can kill Windows whatever. Let's make it even more solid, if that's possible. Hey, let's put our interface, which is the world's best(which is why MS attempted to copy it) and find the most steady, stable OS in the world. Hmmm. The entire internet runs off Unix, that ought to be stable. Hey, let's put our interface on their system. Yeah, OS-X

Result: The body of a sherman tank, the engine from an F18, the firepower of a battleship, the longevity of a Rolls Royce, and an all appointed leather interior. That ought to do it...

Spend the money, buy the best, and only cry once!

Whew, rant done. Sorry dude, you must have hit a nerve. I feel my eye beginnin' ta twitch.

Cheers
Keith

One more thing

viruses

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!

Sound Blaster ??? Pssssst, do not even think about SB on recording.org. Computer is noisy environment so try to find card/system outside the box

:lol:
ok
i am actually going to buy motu 896hd audio interface.

I am right now surrounded by 3 PC's, all less than 3 years old, in various states of non functioning uselessness, as I write this on my Mac, which has a date of manufacture of 1994, and which is humming happily

this is quite impressive, i never happend to use a Mac because, here the market is totally selling intel and Amd products.

and i believe everything you said about windows is true.
What about an Amd

took-the-red-pill wrote: Everybody who is still running their day to day lives on an 11 year old PC raise their hand...I thought so.

........................................
Result: The body of a sherman tank, the engine from an F18, the firepower of a battleship, the longevity of a Rolls Royce, and an all appointed leather interior. That ought to do it...

Cheers
Keith

Whoaaaa, dude. Let's not get carried away. I think a big reason we don't stick with old PC's is because they are cheap to replace. As fast as computers become outdated, I wouldn't care to buy one so expensive that I would have to stick with it for 11 years. Sure the consumer computer "brands" suck (Dell, Compaq, Emachines, etc), but if you get a case and shove it full of quality components yourself, then you can get a real deal. Face it, computer technology changes (improves) fast; it is much more fun to move with it.

Mr. Hassan: the main sticking points on your system are the low RAM, CD burner ((?)Plextor)), the omission of a 2nd hard drive, and possibly your firewire card to be compatible with the MOTU. And don't believe too much from that crazy Mac lover; those guys will say anything to justify their overpriced, quickly outdated machines. :D

If you are building a PC, go with an Antec Sonata (tower) or Overture (desktop) case. They come with very quiet power supplys and are built really well.

Mr. Hassan: the main sticking points on your system are the low RAM, CD burner ((?)Plextor)), the omission of a 2nd hard drive, and possibly your firewire card to be compatible with the MOTU. And don't believe too much from that crazy Mac lover; those guys will say anything to justify their overpriced, quickly outdated machines.

Got it 8-) :lol:

If you are building a PC, go with an Antec Sonata (tower) or Overture (desktop) case. They come with very quiet power supplys and are built really well.

i am going to check that.
thanks for the tips guys.

Red pill's rant pro Mac/anti PC is rather quaint and based on a lot of old, misinformantion. (Sorry dude, we've agreed on many things in the past, but this isn't one of them...)

It's really pointless at this state of the biz to damn one over the other; they both have their good and bad points, and it really comes down to what you're comfortable with using. (I have FIVE PCs here, all merrilly running XP perfectly, been updated the usual way, with no serious problems at all. Not one of them owes me a penny in what they're used for.) To think you'll never have to upgrade or improve a system over time is just fallacy.

Viruses are for stupid people who choose to ignore the safe ways to run computers and any popular system (like Windows) is going to be attacked by people with too much time on their hands or a malicious streak to begin with. Years ago, it was vandalizing pay phones - it's moved to the net now...same mindset, just easier to do... That doesn't make an entire computer platform any less worthy than the vandalizm did to telecommunications. Everyone has since moved to cell phones anyway.

Take your time and find out what software and tools you'll want to get the job done, and choose your platform that way. If you decide it's a mac, GO with a mac. If you decide it's a PC, don't worry, you'll have plenty of company, and it'll do the job for you as well. You can be hip cool, trendy and get a MAC, and if that's working for you, then it's a success. You can play it safe and get a PC (which you'll be able to buy stuff for in just about EVERY store and biz anywhere you go). PC's are cheaper to replace than macs, and it's arguable anyone is going to hear the difference WHAT you used when you make a CD for them.

Go make some music, and ignore the trend-followers.

do i need the 2nd hard drive for backup
and what should be the minimum hardisk requirement, in terms of functionality and space.
i have seen different models of HT pentium 4 3.ghz processor like
p4 3.0c
p43.0
and so on
which processor,mboard should i go for my purpose. considering
p4 3 ghz HT
1gb ram (brand?)

hey, took-the-red-pill...

is that quote at the bottom of your posts from "You Shall Know Our Velocity" by Dave Eggers? I think its from the part where he's signing his travellers checks on the plane. I love that book!

2 hard drives are better than one!

Hassan, you should run your OS on one hard drive, and keep a second, larger one for audio files. This way all of your song files are in one place, easier to locate, and less likely to get fragmented as badly as they would if they were mixed up with everything else. This makes playback more seamless, and faster.

hey red weve had this discution before here and macs are not the end all be all, they do not out perform PCs in any way, the numbers just arnt there. and as far as virusis are conserd why the hell are you surfing the net, or installing sharware, or checking your email on your DAW?

the brand of the CD burner matters little, it can and will braick or become obsoliet in no time. also opt for a dvd burner there prietie cheap now are great for back up. RAM is your friend also get a USP (uninteruptable Power Suply) my friends band was in a protools studio and the engineer had not learnd the hard way why you save constanly, and they lost all the drum tracks when the power went out.
the case does not need to be super huge and a 2.4 pentium should be pleanty for the time being, but you way want to upgrade that in a year or two. what brand is your mobo asus and abit are great but steer clear of msi.

i have my 11 year old mac its a great door stop, oh it turns on but i cant tell if its working or not as i cant find a monitor for it any more. however my 11 year old PC i can plug in my mouse keyboard and monitor that im using now, and wait let me see... ...yep post just fine. come to think of it so does my 6 year old workhorse and my 3 year old (the one im useing now) as well as my year old DAW and my year old Aviator laptop. they all work fine.

when somthing breaks the first thing i look at is the persone using it. nothing is designed to breack, though many seem like it from time to time.

what brand is your mobo asus and abit are great but steer clear of msi.

ok i will consider these brands Asus,Abit,Intel

most probably intel would be my first choice, as their services are most easily available.
i also want to know a compatible firewire card for my audio interface motu 896hd.
Now iam seeing motherboards Intel has two cataories Digital home, Digital office,
which one should i prefer.

took-the-red-pill wrote: Any Mac will do as long as your Mac is a Mac. The thing is, it should be a Mac. Did I mention it should be a Mac. PC's are fine, though when one compares them to a Mac, they go half as fast, break twice as often, and find their way to the dump in half the time.

I am right now surrounded by 3 PC's, all less than 3 years old, in various states of non functioning uselessness, as I write this on my Mac, which has a date of manufacture of 1994, and which is humming happily, though more slowly these days, along. Everybody who is still running their day to day lives on an 11 year old PC raise their hand...I thought so.

As if the hardware wasn't enough of an issue:

Microsoft: "Hmm, let's upgrade our windows program so it's almost as good, though not as stable, as a Mac-1984, then let's sell more upgrades and versions which are from the same disfunctional family. YAY! Look at us sell programs. Oh, and let's pretend that there will never be a year 2000, so when the time comes we can sell even more stuff. Whoopee, look at that stock go. It's all about 'out with the old, in with the not new but not compatable with the old either!' "

Result: a 1964 beetle with a nice paint job, painted over the rust spots.

Apple: "Hey guys, we already have an OS that can kill Windows whatever. Let's make it even more solid, if that's possible. Hey, let's put our interface, which is the world's best(which is why MS attempted to copy it) and find the most steady, stable OS in the world. Hmmm. The entire internet runs off Unix, that ought to be stable. Hey, let's put our interface on their system. Yeah, OS-X

Result: The body of a sherman tank, the engine from an F18, the firepower of a battleship, the longevity of a Rolls Royce, and an all appointed leather interior. That ought to do it...

Spend the money, buy the best, and only cry once!

Whew, rant done. Sorry dude, you must have hit a nerve. I feel my eye beginnin' ta twitch.

Cheers
Keith

Wow, I don't know what's in that Red Pill you Took but I think your trippin! :lol:

Actually your P4 2.4 is fine. Upgrade your RAM to at least 512MB, (1GB if you can), add a larger HDD for audio (SATA if your MOBO supports it) and upgrade your sound card to something 24/96 (with a breakout box preferably).

If you intend to build a new system from scratch then the above suggeations are fine.

Good Luck!

yes i am gonna build the pc from scratch

Wow, I don't know what's in that Red Pill you Took but I think your trippin!

:lol:
iam seeing that maxtor hard drives are quite less in price than the WDigital but they offfer a lot more space size.

iam seeing that maxtor hard drives are quite less in price than the WDigital but they offfer a lot more space size.

Size of hard disc is less important factor. O.K. audio files are big, but point is on the speed and quantity of in/out “flow” of the data. Faster discs (rpm, small average seek time for read/write) with larger buffer (cache) size are better.

In many pro systems, discs are SCSI or Firewire (i.e. Glyph). Better but pretty expensive. SATA/ATA discs with 7200 rpm/4 MB cache are little bit on the edge for projects with more 24/96 tracks.

IMO the best affordable solution (price/performance) for discs now is WD Raptor (74 GB, 8 MB cache, 10 000 rpm). Very close to SCSI performances.

After the long searching and comparisons, I bought two of them, few months ago. I can really feel the speed. Works well and I'm happy.

If you find something faster/better, let us know.

took-the-red-pill wrote: Any Mac will do as long as your Mac is a Mac.

Any Mac? Really? I'm sure an old 233Mhz G3 would make a fantastic DAW.

took-the-red-pill wrote: PC's are fine, though when one compares them to a Mac, they go half as fast.

This statement is so ludacris I wouldn't even know where to begin. When's the last time you left your house? When it comes to raw speed PC rips Mac apart.

took-the-red-pill wrote: I am right now surrounded by 3 PC's, all less than 3 years old, in various states of non functioning uselessness.

Wow you must not have taken very good care of your PC's. Right now I'm typing this on a 8 year old PC that works fine.

took-the-red-pill wrote: Everybody who is still running their day to day lives on an 11 year old PC raise their hand...I thought so.

Is there anyone that is running their day to day lives on an 11 year old computer? If so I feel sorry for them.

took-the-red-pill wrote: As if the hardware wasn't enough of an issue:

Microsoft: "Hmm, let's upgrade our windows program so it's almost as good, though not as stable, as a Mac-1984, then let's sell more upgrades and versions which are from the same disfunctional family. YAY! Look at us sell programs. Oh, and let's pretend that there will never be a year 2000, so when the time comes we can sell even more stuff. Whoopee, look at that stock go. It's all about 'out with the old, in with the not new but not compatable with the old either!' "

I don't know what you problem is with PC's, but nowadays with the release of XP the stability issues with PC's are gone.

And let me say that I'am not a Mac hater. In fact I have a Dual 1.25 G4 that I run PT off of. It's great, rock solid. All I'm really trying to say is that there is no advantage of going with mac over a PC. It comes down to personal preference and what software and hardware you plan on running. If you plan on using Logic, PT, or Digital Performer then you would proably want a Mac. But for anything else I'd probably go with a PC.

Just my 2 Cents.

hey red weve had this discution before here and macs are not the end all be all, they do not out perform PCs in any way, the numbers just arnt there. and as far as viruses are conserd why the hell are you surfing the net, or installing sharware, or checking your email on your DAW?

Don't agree at all w/ the first statement, numbers aren't all that count in floating point computations.

And yes, why the hell would you surf web pages on your DAW anyways?

Actually your P4 2.4 is fine. Upgrade your RAM to at least 512MB, (1GB if you can), add a larger HDD for audio (SATA if your MOBO supports it) and upgrade your sound card to something 24/96 (with a breakout box preferably).

Solid Advice.

Any Mac? Really? I'm sure an old 233Mhz G3 would make a fantastic DAW.

Actually w/ a couple of old ProTools DSP cards it would...For an antiquated system.

When it comes to raw speed PC rips Mac apart.

Speed of what? and for what? Microsoft actually uses Apple, Sun and Cisco hardware for Design, Servers, and Network Routing respectively. So that statement is a joke...Sorry it just is.

Wow, I don't know what's in that Red Pill you Took but I think your trippin!

You really are trippin... Apple does have great design for a couple of workstations ( the G4, and G5 mainly). But there are far superior workstations that could be created for better prices using Intel/AMD based CPU's.

Both Intel and AMD have entered the 64-bit market, but are behind Sun/Apple/IBM in this area. If you want to shell cash out for a sick center piece for a PRO-Studio get one of the following.....

http://www.carillonusa.com/clnweb/index.jsp?country=UK

or

http://www.apple.com/powermac/design.html

Well well well

I stand corrected, in part al least, but not from the flame wars here.

The most interesting part about the links San Diego Sound provided is if you go here:

http://www.carillonusa.com/clnweb/performance.jsp?country=US

They have comparison performance tests, in real world recording situations, and the bang for the buck is higher with the AMD/Pentel stuff on Cubase. Go to the bottom and see how differently the results are for Pro Tools. (Interesting. I'm assuming there isn't some major detail they left out to make their product appear better than it is)

Did Pro Tools design their software for OS-X, is that why it loses out on Cubase and roasts them on Pro Tools?

Seems the results would indicate that if you want a Cubase system, buy the PC. If you are going Pro Tools, get a Mac.

Hmmmmmm. Very interesting.

Also interesting is the concept of buying your whole package at once. Seems like the cost savings are pretty substantial over putting it together yourself in pieces. I saw one there with the computer, Cubase SX, an 8 in-out sound card, and emulator for $2300 bones. Seems it would cost more than that to buy it all seperately.

The only thing is they still haven't convinced me to take a chance on having Windows as the operating system. It's still got bad memories of all those "Whoops, and here we thought we had it right this time. Oh well, we'll have another one to sell you sooner than you'd think" programs that have come out of the 'Land of Gates.'

Cheers
Keith

pc's are faster than mac's, not the other way around.

SanDiegoSounds wrote:
Speed of what? and for what? Microsoft actually uses Apple, Sun and Cisco hardware for Design, Servers, and Network Routing respectively. So that statement is a joke...Sorry it just is.

Well since were in a pro audio forum, and were talking about DAWs, when I use the word "speed" in reference to computers, I'm probably not reffering to servers or networking. That should be pretty obvious.

It's generally accepted that when you use the word speed, in reference to computers, your talking about processor speed.

How fast is the fastest Mac? And how fast is the fastest PC?

The gap will only get wider.

Apple tried to claim that the new G5's were the worlds fastest personal computers, but that turned out to be a total crock of sh!t.

http://spl.haxial.net/apple-powermac-G5/

When it comes to speed it's PC all the way.

But I still like Macs.

It's generally accepted that when you use the word speed, in reference to computers, your talking about processor speed.

Umm...Ok. Ever heard of bus speed, disk-speed, PCI-Slot speed...Oh and yeah CPU clock speed.

The gap will only get wider.

The gap will only get smaller. As consumers we see things like 10 years later than they occur in the corporate/goverment sector. 64-bit computing and super fast FSB speeds have been around for way longer than the G5 or AMD Opteron. So maybe you'll see a little bit quicker of a trickle down of technology from Intel (Pentium) than Motorola (PowerPC), because Intel sucks. So what. :roll:

When it comes to speed it's PC all the way.

When it comes to a cheaper alternative for CPU speed it's an Intel/AMD CPU all the way.

M.

P.S. Don't get me wrong, I work on Dual Xeon High-end servers all the time. They are great bang for the buck, but cannot hold a candle to a Sun,SGI, or any high end UNIX workstation.

Stop comparing Mac to PC....it's like playing swords with your dicks....chill out!

I have a shitty eMachines computer with 1 gig of RAM, a new firewire card, and everything else is stock.

I've been running Cubase SX, my FW1884, and recording bands non stop with it. Yes I have some problems but not enough to make me spend $2500 on a Mac. Although I am going to eventually purchase a Mac...it's going to be for reasons of having the money and wanting to spend it on somehing I can oooohhh over for a few weeks and not because it does the job better or worse.

Until then...a PC will do the job just fine and I can build a goddamn Nasa supercomputer for $2500 in PC parts.

therecordingart wrote:
I have a shitty eMachines computer with 1 gig of RAM, a new firewire card, and everything else is stock.

And you wonder why you have clicks and pops on your recordings? :D
Just kidding.
Sort of.

Only on my snare tracks using the same cable and same mic. I think the cable comes loose....because wouldn't I be getting clicks and pops in the rest of the kit as well?

Yes my computer sucks...but it was $300 doing the job of a $2500 Mac or $1500 PC.

in refrance to speed; floting point computations are done faster with a PC.

yes protools is written for the mac; but then agien i dont like protools all that mutch i like cubase.

a 233Mhz G3 in that era i was running a dual celeron 500 system that did audio just fine with out any dsp cards i bet thet system would be great with a couple dsp cards as well.

and red when did you have problems with windows? was it bat in the windows 3.x or 9x days? alot has changed its built on NT now dos has nothing to do with it. i too have always hated win95-me but being a MSCSE i love NT its verry stable XP is verry stable. any one neeping a work horse computer a PC with your coise of windows, lynux, BSD(the same that OSX is built on) and others will do them best. but if you need a computer to sit on your desk to write papers and work like your VCR or alarm clock then the new a mac is a great choise.