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Ammitsboel 17 October 2004

While i was reading a 500 pages manual and adjusting tape guides today i thought about... is it time to make a new group project?

Does anybody have a good idea?
If we do a song/number again then why not bring on the artist's opinion of the different results?

...And let's have Don and Thomas with os this time... if they dare? 8-)

Best Regards

Comments

Michael Fossenkemper Thu, 11/11/2004 - 20:13

I'm going to stick with the original, I would have liked a vocal up but heck, I would also like a boat. I'm pretty happy with what i got. It will get crazy with 2 versions. (I was joking about getting another version by the way, but I thought I would ask just to make everyone's life more difficult). So I say we stick with version 1, especially since 5 have finished. I'll upload mine tonight..... well maybe tomorrow. it's late and I want to watch kill bill vol 2 again. I think one of my favorite scenes is where the mexican pimp, Benesto I think, is talking to Uma. I love that lazy blink he does, where he doesn't quite close his eyes.

anonymous Fri, 11/12/2004 - 04:34

Hi

Is trying to 'enhance' the mix = screw up the mix? :mrgreen:

I am trying to create another 'sound' on my master, than it
is originally. :) Will I be strangled by the producer for this? :?

Or should I stick to the producers original mix sound and just enhance it, with clarity & loudness etc?

Any artistic freedom for the master engineer? How do I know when I've crossed the line? :mrgreen:

Cheers
Bob
:roll:

Michael Fossenkemper Fri, 11/12/2004 - 07:52

I think this mix is a good example of "To cook, or not to cook". If you add to many spices, it'll no longer tastes like chicken. When it was chicken, it looked like chicken and tasted like chicken. Just don't try and make it taste like steak and I think you'll be good to go. It sounds like the producer and the band knew what they were doing and how they wanted it to sound. If you mold it into something else, they could like it or not. It's a gamble. The Vocal sits in a very delicate space and can be easily overtaken with a bit too much molding.

Ben Godin Fri, 11/12/2004 - 09:28

Hey to answer Bob's question. When i listen back to a mix i get a certain "mood." This mood is not caused by the song itself but rather by the frequencies that the song holds. As strange as this sounds this is how i know that the song is right. When i first did the song i was debating with myself about the mood but still deemed it fine. After debating for a little longer i decided to redo the song and this time the mood of the song was much closer to what i had wanted. Although it wasn't perfect i decided to render the new copy and that is the one that i uploaded.

For instance the 300-400hz range adds lots of boom to the song that is not necessary. This is one factor in a changed state of the song. You can recognize this and compromise with that frequency.

Every engineer is different, also if you look at the frequency chart of this song and a song with similar characteristics in dynamics, say.... Dream Theater - Strange Deja Vu, you can estimate what kind of change would be good for the song.

Massive Mastering Fri, 11/12/2004 - 10:59

BobYordan wrote: Hi

Is trying to 'enhance' the mix = screw up the mix? :mrgreen:

I am trying to create another 'sound' on my master, than it
is originally. :) Will I be strangled by the producer for this? :?

Or should I stick to the producers original mix sound and just enhance it, with clarity & loudness etc?

Any artistic freedom for the master engineer? How do I know when I've crossed the line? :mrgreen:

Cheers
Bob
:roll:

I assume, unless told otherwise, that the client attained the mix they were looking for. Communication is key. This guy seems to be looking for correction and enhancement (wash & wax) as opposed to change (body work).

But the room for artistic freedom is there - If there was none, all the end products would essentially sound the same. That's the compromise. Obviously, many of us (myself included) feel very strongly about the vocal - This was probably mixed rather loud on some large, "darker" sounding monitors - Some big 'ol 813's or 2x12 Quested's or something. Just a guess, of course, by the way the overall mix sounds. Point: I'm sure the vocal level sounded great in the control room. *IF* you've established that the vocal needs to come out a little, that's a starting point. There are about a half-dozen ways to do that. The artistic part is HOW to go about it - the compromise. What are you willing to give up to bring the vocal out? Something has to give.

Others said that the toms were too loud. Me? I love loud toms (as long as they sound good). They're the "lead" for the drums as a cool riff is the "lead" on a guitar. Some may try to tame them, some may try to enhance them.

That all being said, "normally" I try to find out what direction the artist or producer is looking for and go with that. Many clients just say "do what you think is best" and I go with that.

However, in this particular excercise, if you feel that "creating another sound" is the way to go, I say go for it. That's the whole idea behind this. We don't get an awful lot of "go for it" type freedom in this field with a cool mix like this one.

anonymous Fri, 11/12/2004 - 15:41

David French wrote: Nothing a de-esser at about 6k can't fix ;) I'm getting pretty good results with that aproach.

I don't think this vocal is so easy as you may imply, you may change the sound of the viola or acoustic giutar, or sound to compressed on those ess spots. I spent alot of time to get the intro just right, by going in by hand & adusting the bad spots only, without strapping the desser over the mix like one would do usually.
I don't even want to hear the new mix. what was submitted first shoud be used. This mix has some challanges that we will learn from, at the same time these players deserve a great master!

My rule of thumb (i learned the hard way) Is never change the mix unless the client requests it. They'r used to hearing it a cirtain way. It's the ME's job to make sure thier mix translates well on most systems, & to bring out the best that they could not do in the mix stage.

I'm done...
Ed

TrilliumSound Sun, 11/14/2004 - 15:05

Hi Bernard,

I have sent the info to you via e-mail. 8-)

Ok everyone,

Staus: 8 done,
7 missing.

No rush, we still have next sunday p.m (one week).

Hey, Massive, what's happening when you hit the "holy crap" level on your Stupidifier ? :?
Too bad it is a limited edition, I would have bought one to try it. 8)

anonymous Thu, 11/18/2004 - 00:27

Michael Fossenkemper wrote: Bob, how many versions have you done? I say we realease all the versions you did so we can see your journey or should I say hear. just kidding.

*LOL*

Yeah, well I have uploaded 4 until now, the total number is my secret. :mrgreen: For me it is also a learning process. And this was for me a tough one. *hehe* But I am 20% satisfied with the latest one and 10% satisfied with the previous 3, so I hope it will not be totally trashed by and laught at by the others when listening. :)

Cheers
Bob
:roll:

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