Could you please change your and omit the word Noobie to be replaced with a more defined question?

Thanks. These guys know their chops...but that word can cause you to be overlooked. Or in some cases, over-ran :)

Have you signed up for Fantasy football yet?

Computer and decent interface 2,500
1 LDC and a bunch of 57's 1,000
monitors + headphones 1,000
cables, stands, other goodies 500
TOTAL $5,000

This is really the minumum ante to get in the game. I spent about 7K my first year in business and another 5K the second year, and another 5K the third and so on...
This obviously includes no building or sound control, but you could do some remote stuff to get started.

Just about everybody has a "studio package" to sell you, but I wouldn't do it. You will learn a lot more if you have to study and agonize over every piece of gear.

"This obviously includes no building or sound control," /quote

All outdoors, eh? What a pita THAT must be?

Hey, at least not having a building would mean not having to deal with all of those nasty reflections and standing waves and stuf like that.

The downside is having to dump water out of the microphones after it rains. And yes, I do know from experience that mics WILL still work after you pour the water out of them!

MarkG wrote: And yes, I do know from experience that mics WILL still work after you pour the water out of them!

Good to know! I'm gonna run all my stage mics through the sink to clean them! Will Dawn cut smoky grease spittle better then Ajax? :shock:

Kapt.Krunch :wink:

Smoky grease spittle?!

I offer my clients chocolate and bottled water. What do you give them, cigars and baby-back ribs?

I know where I'd record...

Can I get some of the honey glaze on this cigar?

MarkG wrote: Computer and decent interface 2,500
1 LDC and a bunch of 57's 1,000
monitors + headphones 1,000
cables, stands, other goodies 500
TOTAL $5,000

I note a DISTINCT lack of funds allocated for software. I'd suggest getting Audacity and Reaper (only a couple hunnerd ) and get as many free plugs as you can find, The DigitalFishFones stuff is great, also AIRWINDOWS has some good plugs, some for free.

just say no to craks.

dwoz

Can you drop out of school before you get started? Some of those schools will put you in hefty debt and chances are you won't be getting a job in the industry any time soon. Instead of the student loan, go and spend the money on gear and learn hands on. If you have to, go to the local adult learning center and see if they have a digital media program. A few hundred dollars for the basics is much better than 20 grand for the basics. You can learn a lot about mic placement from reading in forums like this AND from just experimenting.

Research on the web is free BUT there is a lot of misinformation out there. This is a good place to ask questions as the miss info is rooted out quite quickly here due to the large population of WORKING engineers(myself NOT being one of them). I come here to read and learn.

Are you planning to charge for your services? I would say a proffesional studio can be roughly started for $25,000 USD +/- 5,000 USD.

I have built 3 small studios over the past 15 years, and that number always seems to be about right. Each time I have traded up gear and acoustics.

For a first time professional studio (i.e. one that charges for your services) you should invest in your mics, monitors and acoustics. Pick up a simple all in one pc interface to start, then after a bit of time move on to the next stage.

The next stage would be A/D and D/A, PRE AMPS.

Don't forget the cables, they cost more then anyone cares to remember.

Anyway just a few thoughts...

dwoz wrote: [quote=MarkG]Computer and decent interface 2,500
1 LDC and a bunch of 57's 1,000
monitors + headphones 1,000
cables, stands, other goodies 500
TOTAL $5,000

I note a DISTINCT lack of funds allocated for software. I'd suggest getting Audacity and Reaper (only a couple hunnerd ) and get as many free plugs as you can find, The DigitalFishFones stuff is great, also AIRWINDOWS has some good plugs, some for free.

just say no to craks.

dwoz
That was a little on the low side. I was thinking of something like a protools rack unit with only the factory plugins. It deosn't take long to rack up another couple thousand in decent plugins. I also didn't factor in an external hard drive for about $300. I was probably thinking of numbers I would give my WIFE if I was going to build something. The estimate for my current studio (structure only) started at 20K....HA HA HA.....(over 40K and it's still not actually done yet)

Not to mention, most hardware comes bundled with software anyway.

But I can't mention that.

10 grand was enough for me. i use nuendo for software. gets the job done :D

hmmmm... 10k? 20k? I wish......

I'm somewhere around $75k for the upfit and just over $120k in gear....

I musta' did sumpin' wrong........

Keep in mind Spitfire used words like "little", "just the basics", and "not outrageous" to describe what he wanted to do.

MarkG wrote: Keep in mind Spitfire used words like "little", "just the basics", and "not outrageous" to describe what he wanted to do.

Uh huh.... that's what I said, too! :-?

...to your wife?

Codemonkey wrote: ...to your wife?

I concluded long ago that Max was married to a Saint...a really crazy Saint.

I could easily drop 100k on a studio if I had 100k... an api 1608 would get you halfway there haha

Oh Bob... That was good... really good! (Like your wife ain't a saint, either?!?)

Seriously though... Crank alludes to an excellent, although scary, point that I was also making...

However much money you have... a studio can take every dime you have... and THEN some.

You have to be aware of GAS, and combat it. A second cousin to GAS is the hope and dream of owning a decent room... which either one of the above afflictions are bad enough, but to find yourself suffering from both.... oh man.

Just open your wallet and watch the money fly!

MarkG wrote: Keep in mind Spitfire used words like "little", "just the basics", and "not outrageous" to describe what he wanted to do.

The problem is that he is talking about going to school for this. So I'd assume he wants to make a living at it somewhere down the line. A $20K studio puts you in competition with every kid with rich parents and every middle age guy who would rather play and record music than pay for a boat or a sports car or a mistress. It's a "don't quit your day job" kind of investment. In fact, it's a "work harder at your day job so you can fund the studio" kind of investment.

Sure there are some commercial operations that can be started with relatively low overhead - a mobile unit for one. But there is no way I know of to get real sound isolation in that price range. So any low cost operation has to view itself as a niche operation. To offer a full range of services at professional quality you have to start with a budget close to what Max is talking about. Anyone thinking about starting a pro studio should look at the the [[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.recordin…"]Saga thread. [/]="http://www.recordin…"]Saga thread. [/] Max has a lot of sweat equity, and he isn't building the Taj Mahal. But it's still costing a pretty penny. If you are talking about a real pro studio offering a wide range of services, I'd describe his as a very nice "little" studio that's "not outrageous."

I totally agree that to have a Pro-grade studio that would qualify as decent, one would need to plan on 50-60K to start.

I interpreted spitfires needs as a living room "practice" studio, and that he would be working in an established studio to start off with for his income.

We seem to be entering a stage where the room is becoming more important than the gear. So, a discussion about budget without including the building is probably not productive.

I would consider my setup as modest-entry level. But when you put the gear in my new room, I am now over 50K. And that is with doing most of the labor myself.

MadMax wrote: hmmmm... 10k? 20k? I wish......

I'm somewhere around $75k for the upfit and just over $120k in gear....

I musta' did sumpin' wrong........

I would say you only did something wrong if you can't hear the difference between your recordings and those of an amatuer with 5K in gear.

i am new here....and first off...i have never been part of a forum where people are so mean...thread after thread i read is full of people insulting others questions and responses...without giving a hint of advie themselves....

wow....

and im not talking about everyone...there are some helpful responses here

i cant even believe no one asked the poor school boy what he wants to do with his studio???!!!!!!

what type of music do you want to make?
what do you want to record?
do you want to be a commercial studio renting by the hour...
or take on a more producer role working closely with artists?
do you plan on recording live bands?....electronic music??
singer songwriter acoustic music???

you need to know exactly what you want to do before we can tell you what you need

I haven't seen anyone throwing insults in this thread and I'm pretty sure it has been established what the op plans on doing with his studio. It's tough not to be somewhat cynical when this is supposed to be a "pro" audio forum and people ask questions about how they can connect their Behr....... mixer to their "hi end" SoundBasher card.

That being said, I am not a "pro" and have still found a mountain of good info on this forum. The kind of info that most people pay $20000 or more to get and still may not get because the class is just too big and the "school" is too interested in playing on the starry eyed dreams of their students. Don't be critical about that statement now. I've just payed off my student loan which I started 13 years ago.

I think the answers are usually as sharp as the question is appropriate and well informed.

Fella said "you want a better answer, ask a better question"!!!

Well, since you asked in the "Pro Audio Forums" your going to get answers from pro's using pro gear. Thus greatly increasing your cost.

If you know alot about computers, well atleast enough to build your own, you can do a decent home set up for personal/demo use for WAY less.

1: Build a dedicated computer. NOT your family PC, but one that you can strip down and turn off all the crappy stuff in the back ground if your using windows. I built mine using Mac OSX 10.5.1. (I cheated) Use lots of Ram, atleast 2 Ghz (I use 4)and a fast HDD.
Price... $700

2: Get a decent interface. I got the Presonus FireStudio. Comes with CuBase LE, which you can use for now, or if your really good at Torrent, you can find another software.
Found a referb one for...
$500 (You can get a FirePod or FireStudio Project for cheaper)

3: Get a decent condensor mic for Vox. This can get expensive, but for starters, you can spend about...
$100

4: Get ATLEAST 5 Shure SM57's for drums and guitars, (you should get 7 though, all depends on size of drumset) also a decent kick drum mic. Price...
$600

5: GOOD pair of headphones
$100

6: Decent set of monitors
$100

7: Stands and Cables
$200

You can spend about $2,300 and get going with a decent set up with decent quality. You won't be releasing any major records on major labels, but it will sound good enough. Mine does! :D

Seth kinda' makes a valid point, but one whose direction I would seriously caution about to anyone serious thinking of doing this as a professional.

While this is a nice little starter setup, it is by no means anything will attract clients to call you on a consistent basis.

I didn't say you couldn't make a decent recording, I said it wasn't on par with many people's expectations of a professional level studio.

Getting a core system such as this is severely limited in it's capability... you can't record and entire band at once and expanding it is going to be all but impossible.

But as long as you go into it knowing that you will never get much more than some basic chops from it, then by all means, go for it.

The other thing to keep in mind is that you will NEVER have enough mic's. Your mic collection is an investment that will always expand.

Don't bother with cheap cables either... you'll spend twice as much in the long run replacing cables that fall apart, become noisy or just plain break in the middle. You don't have to spend a lot of money, but you shouldn't buy the $10 specials either.

Now for the ugly part.... all of this the jumping off point for GAS. Once you get the bug, you are doomed.

Unfortunately, one of the truths that a lot of folks are avoiding, is the reality that there will be few studios that will be in existence in a few years that will hire you once you get out of school. Why? Because they are dying on the vine because of the little home studios putting out fair to decent work. They won't be able to afford you, so you'll have to build your own shop.

Now you're competing with the other home/project studios and the guys who are just hanging on with the small to medium sized room.... and to differentiate yourself from the other guys... you're gonna have to build a good sounding room.... because when you go to school, you'll actually find out how damned important the room is.

So... you look at your gear and try to sell it... it's a decent starter system... you'll find out the ugly reality that all this starter gear is worthless. You might get 10% of it's purchase price... other than your mic collection.

Spunkadellic wrote: i am new here....and first off...i have never been part of a forum where people are so mean...thread after thread i read is full of people insulting others questions and responses...without giving a hint of advie themselves....

I coulud point you to much worse fora than this one, in both regards. This one's pretty helpful compared to some.

I kind of agree with Seth on this.
With the Firestudio you can ADAT 16+ channels in for a total of 24.
I can't see more than that being *necessary* to do a full band.
You will want to get better preamps than Presonus provides, however.

And Max is right, sort of. I am following the blueprint of a friend/mentor that used to live in town. He got more than enough work to constantly upgrade his gear, and has since moved on to Austin.
There, he rents a studio for a day rate. He makes very quality recordings.
Most importantly, he's making pro contacts.
His situation can be viewed at:
http://www.myspace.com/icecreamfactorystudio

So, you can go from a project studio (I've spent $10-$15k already) to a more pro setup.
I have 9 channels of external pres to use in lieu of the Presonus (FS and Digimax) stuff, an outboard EQ and compressor (for ST mixes, mostly), two sets of monitors, a bunch of cans and around 16 mics.
Not to mention cables, stands, and some minimal acoustical treatment.
All carefully selected on the cheap.
It's the bare minimum to do a full band well enough to get more clients via word of mouth. Each of the three projects (I'm still wrapping them up) I've done featured new gear and a better process. I think it's a great way to learn the ropes.
I am now slowly upgrading this stuff as the money comes trickling in.
I'll likely start with pres (suggestions, anyone?), then mics, and then move on to a better interface (or maybe a console if I get enough dough!) and more outboard compressors, and finally a MacPro. (That's gonna be another $10-$25k easily).

So, not easily done. But possible. You have to have enough local bands you can record to make the money to upgrade.
All of this of course, excludes the actual building.
I am fortunate enough to rent a church in conjunction w/ 2 other engineers. This gives us a sanctuary (the big room), CR, and 4 other rooms to use for isolation purposes.

The most important thing imo is this:
Try and buy the best gear you can, and make sure it can move if you have to move. Your pres and mics and any outboard gear are most important.

Alright - tear me down now, you pros!
I'd love to be able to do it your way, but budget requires I cannot.

You can see the list of my gear (most of it) and pics of the space at:
http://www.myspace.com/soapfloatsrecording
Keep in mind, I first started using the space this spring, and transitioned from a musician doing some live taping to this setup.

This question is really very open ended and impossible to answer without responses to certain questions.
My first question is always: "How many things do you need to record at one time?"
Then: "How much do you have to spend?"
It's kind of like how much is a car?
You have to tailor the system to the needs of the individual.

Very true - for anything you plan to spend any kind of money on.

I think MadMax was most concerned that some of the paths/choices the poster might make ultimately lead to dead ends - fine paths to learn the trade, but not if you want to get to a certain level.
And he's right - I'm looking at the $$ I've spent on cheap mics and pres, monitors, etc; and thinking that I might have made different choices that set me up for the future better.
Right now the only purchases I can carry into a pro setup would be my Sytek 4Aii, dbx166, Shure drum mics, and maybe a s select few of the other cheaper mics that might have specific apps. Still, they'd mostly be at the bottom of the list.

But most people can't afford a console, or anything with names attached to them like Neve, API, Neumann, etc.

So you have to research and compare your ass off, and try and make the best choices based on budget - AND get as much of the best advice you can. Considering I needed to get started tracking full bands, I think I did pretty well.