ive used a sm58 under the ride several times for live sound. Sounds fine everytime

roger that!.
As Joe Meek has said before--(If it sounds right,it is right).
In my personal opinion,I think that the 58 is one of the best (road worthy)live or recording mics ever :wink:

Just curious, has anyone ever given the Sm58 a go on the Hi hat as well?. What were your impressions?

So what is everyone's general take on the FMR RNP 8380?
I don't have a preamp for my voiceover recording, but I'm seriously considering that one.

I've heard such good things generally, but I wanted to get some personal takes on them.

Thanks,
Brad Venable
Voice For Hire, LLC

I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp.

What are your reasons Kurt? I have had great success with the RNC which is what has interested me in the RNP... and I've only heard good things about it.

Compressors are different than mic pres and just because a company makes a good compressor doesn't mean that they make a good mic pre (and vice versa).

I just don't care for the sound or the way the things are built (yes I have used one). There's a lot I'v already said on these pages regarding RNPs and other budget mic pres. A lot of people get upset with me when I start whipping on cheap mic pres so I will just say, do a search on my name, mic pres or "rack crap" and you will find it. :wink:

"I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

Well, thats the trick here Kurt.. You are only getting one channel of the brick for the same price as a 2 channel RNP..

heyman wrote: "I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

Well, thats the trick here Kurt.. You are only getting one channel of the brick for the same price as a 2 channel RNP..

It could be a 24 channel pre ... I just don't like the build quality or the sound of the RNP.

I would prefer one channel of "real" pre instead two channels of something that I feel isn't as good anyday. I have never felt that quanity over quality was a good choice.

But if you really want to play the best value card, I would likely choose a Studio projects SP 828 ... 8 pres and a 2 channel summing mixer for about $600.

Kurt,

do you like the pres in the SP 828?

I'm guessing they are the same Burr Brown amps found in the Toft and Meek pres. (Grace, Sytek etc...) They probably sound good, but they don't seem like they'd be your cup of tea.

No, you are correct. The SP 828 is not what I usually like, but that doesn't mean that others may not like them as well. They may be just what some people are looking for. I am coming to understand that (well, comprehend it, I will never fully understand it). That said, I would be interested in taking the SP 828 out for a test drive ..

For a "best value bang for the buck" type of thing, you get a lot more from the SP 828 than from either the RNP (or the Sytek which is essentially the same topology as the 828, the Sytek does have a better power supply than the RNP or the SP 828 however).

IMO the cost and features of the SP 828 is much more in line with what it should be. I think the price of the RNP and Sytek are unjustifiably inflated, perhaps to make them appear to be better, by nature of the higher cost. It's an old marketing technique. Keep the price up and the consumer will perceive the product as better than some of the less expensive alternatives. "It's gotta be better, it costs more."

So Kurt you dig the brick? As a mic pre, not a DI only, do you think it fairs well with say UA-610, Summit, Manley etc. Of course we're talking the brick here and it has zero bells and whistles and a comparison to Manley etc is pretty big shoes to fill. BUT just basic sound quality/usability do you think it's in the same ball park, same sport, or is it midget wrestleling and the Manley (etc) is russian hockey?!? I'd just love to have a couple nice tube pre's for bass mics, kick, vocals here and there etc and it shure is a cheap and easy way to go. But, (as I'm shure you'll agree) i'd rather save up more and get one of the aforementioned pre's if it's gonna stomp the brick in the end.

Cheers.................

I have not heard "The Brick" in action yet. Before I say too much about the Brick, I should get one and work it for a while. But it is designed and constructed in the manner that all good pre amps are.

It has a very adequate power supply, it's class A, transformer balanced and discreet construction. I suspect there's some type of op amp involved and most likely it has surface mounted electronics instead of through the board but as a cost conscious alternative to high end boutique pres, it is probably comes the closest any product designed to a price point has yet come to comparing.

"I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

"I have not heard "The Brick" in action yet. Before I say too much about the Brick, I should get one and work it for a while. But it is designed and constructed in the manner that all good pre amps are."

hmmm VERY INTERESTING Kurt -

Care to revise your statement? :oops:

Gotta have a little fun at your expense...

:lol:

It's cool Kurt. Anyone with experience of the brick and UA, Pendulum, Summit etc care to elaborate??? Could be the brick is a one trick poney but it could be a good sounding trick esp for the bucks.... I've "heard" that the sounds are identical to the VIPRE you just only get one setting instead of 300! If that one setting is a good all-round setting AND the above is tru then.....hell.....I'll take two please. Perhaps I'll give one a try then if it's not all that it can retire to DI box status at which it should be kick ass.

I just sent a request to GT for a couple review units ... let's see if they send at least one out. I'd like 2 if possible so I can check it on kick, snare and overheads ...

I was noticing that Leland Sklar has endorsed the Brick ...

heyman wrote: "I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

"I have not heard "The Brick" in action yet. Before I say too much about the Brick, I should get one and work it for a while. But it is designed and constructed in the manner that all good pre amps are."

hmmm VERY INTERESTING Kurt -

Care to revise your statement? :oops:

Gotta have a little fun at your expense...

:lol:

No not at all .... I truly think a person can make some judgments like this without hearing. My remarks are based on the construction and design topology of the Brick vs the RNP (which I have used).

It's like making a judgment that a Harley is going to be faster than a Honda 50 .... no contest and I don't have to ride the Honda to understand the differences.

There have been a lot of very positive reports regarding the Brick from many people whose opinions I respect deeply. Based on these things, I am willing to say that the Brick is worth considering. As with all things, ymmv and you should listen / decide for yourself. :lol:

Just having some fun with you Kurt.... I have tried GT products before and I think they do a quality job..

Btw Kurt, are you by chance related to Norm Abrams form the TV show "This old House"?

Gotcha.... :D

heyman wrote: "I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

"I have not heard "The Brick" in action yet. Before I say too much about the Brick, I should get one and work it for a while. But it is designed and constructed in the manner that all good pre amps are."

hmmm VERY INTERESTING Kurt -

Care to revise your statement? :oops:

Gotta have a little fun at your expense...

:lol:

hmmmmmmm--------is right :shock: kinda makes you wonder----dont-it? :?

eddies880 wrote: [quote=heyman]"I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

"I have not heard "The Brick" in action yet. Before I say too much about the Brick, I should get one and work it for a while. But it is designed and constructed in the manner that all good pre amps are."

hmmm VERY INTERESTING Kurt -

Care to revise your statement? :oops:

Gotta have a little fun at your expense...

:lol:

hmmmmmmm--------is right :shock: kinda makes you wonder----dont-it? :?

You're just nit picking. Again, "I truly think a person can make some judgments like this without hearing. My remarks are based on the construction and design topology of the Brick vs the RNP (which I have used).

It's like making a judgment that a Harley is going to be faster than a Honda 50 .... no contest and I don't have to ride the Honda to understand the differences." I will add I don't need to ride the Harley either.

All that aside, I have heard and used the RNP, which is what I still unequivocally say I don't care for. I would recommend almost anything over the RNP. Clear enough?

I might be wrong, but I heard that the SP 828 hasn't even been released yet. Maybe Kurt's tried it. I don't know of anyone who has (other than the PMI folks and perhaps any beta testers).

Kurt Foster wrote: [quote=eddies880][quote=heyman]"I don't care for it. At that price, I prefer the GT Brick ... a "real" pre amp."

"I have not heard "The Brick" in action yet. Before I say too much about the Brick, I should get one and work it for a while. But it is designed and constructed in the manner that all good pre amps are."

hmmm VERY INTERESTING Kurt -

Care to revise your statement? :oops:

Gotta have a little fun at your expense...

:lol:

hmmmmmmm--------is right :shock: kinda makes you wonder----dont-it? :?

You're just nit picking. Again, "I truly think a person can make some judgments like this without hearing. My remarks are based on the construction and design topology of the Brick vs the RNP (which I have used).

It's like making a judgment that a Harley is going to be faster than a Honda 50 .... no contest and I don't have to ride the Honda to understand the differences." I will add I don't need to ride the Harley either.

All that aside, I have heard and used the RNP, which is what I still unequivocally say I don't care for. I would recommend almost anything over the RNP. Clear enough?So what are you trying to say Kurt? :? -----------------can you please be more "specific?" :? ----------------------------Just jabbing at you dude--dont blow a tube 8-) its all in fun

J-3 wrote: Could be the brick is a one trick poney but it could be a good sounding trick esp for the bucks....

The Brick absolutely is a one-trick pony. I mean, you basically only have one knob to adjust. I think of it more as a workhorse pre than a standout colorific golden pre. For a single channel of tube pre, I think it is hard to pass up at the price. However, if you were to buy like 4 channels of Brick, the price would not be far off from a 4-channel Sebatron or something, which would probably be a better choice with more options. If GT comes up with a 4-channel Brick, I would think they could do it at a much better price than 4 bricks alone, and that would probably be a cool thing. Imagine 4-channels of decent tube pres in a box for say $1099 or so. People would snatch em up I bet. 8-)

What was this thread about again?

I'm having difficulty understanding why the SP828 is being recommened? Kurt, is it based on you saying " remarks are based on the construction and design topology of the..." (would you insert SP828? into that sentence?)
Are there other reasons why you are recommending these? Reason I ask is cause i'm trying to get some pre's for a moble rack and was heading in the direction of the Sytek.

Your most likely right Reggie about the one trick pony thing, but if you think about it, API and many others only have 1 knob on their pre's and they're great. So just because there's only gain dosn't mean it can't get colorful or be very nice sounding. If the topology is there like Kurt is saying and the tone is there (which I don't know that I've read much about how these things ACTUALLY sound) then it could be a very nice unit. With a few nice functions aside such as minimal eq, output gain, etc it "could" possibly stand up there with UA, Sebaton and others........Right?!?

Functions:

API 312 -1 gain knob, polarity, phantom, pad, mic/line DI

GT Brick - 1 gain knob, ground lift, phantom, (auto switching mic/line), DI

Everything that you need in a great pre is there IF it sounds great. Does anyone have any links to reviews of the brick in action? Or do any brick users out there that have UA, Seb etc etc etc want to give some comparisons?

I will say this about the Brick:

I've owned one for 2 weeks and have recorded 2 projects with it. I've only used it on acoustic guitar, bass DI, and vocals. This purchase is the only one that I haven't second guessed. The sound quality, clearity, warmth, and lack of noise make this preamp just killer. I did a few a/b tests between the Brick and my on board (Tascam) preamps. The Brick brought out everything that the Tascam pres were missing and highlighted the areas that needed it....especially on acoustic.

I've considered buying another, but I decided to take a different approach. My next investements will be an API Lunchbox and a 4 channel Seb. Then I can never bitch about preamps again!

So anyway....the Brick is a very nice sounding unit overall and the price is even better.

The Brick absolutely is a one-trick pony. I mean, you basically only have one knob to adjust.

The RNP only has one knob too ... and it's a stepped attenuator that I found to be a bit coarse for any degree of fine adjustment. At one setting, it can be too low, click to the next and it's too much. Perhaps it is supposed to be used on the inserts of a small mixer but that seems to defeat the whole idea of a stand alone pre.

I agree that if you want more than one channel, you are just as well off with a Sebatron. But the Brick seems to be a good choice for those on a budget, who only need a single channel. The idea of a multi channel Brick is interesting ... I have no idea if the exsiting power supply would be adaquate to drive more that one unit at a time but if it can, the cost savings of packaging 2 or 4 of them together might be a good idea.

The word is the SP 828 is being shipped.

I'm having difficulty understanding why the SP828 is being recommened? Kurt, is it based on you saying " remarks are based on the construction and design topology of the..." (would you insert SP828? into that sentence?)
Are there other reasons why you are recommending these?

I am not super crazy about any of these types of pres (RNP / SP 828) but the SP 828 seems to be the most cost effective choice. It uses the same Burr Brown chip the Sytek offers as an upgrade and has more channels and features, for half the price. IMO it's a no brainer.

Hmmmm. This is getting more interesting all the time. Actually if you do the math the brick looks better and better. A few people around here have said they've got the brick $325. I bet you could pretty easily walk into GC and pickup 2 for $325 ea. easily. Prob get 4 for $300 each. That's $1200 plus no tax, no shipping (if you have a tax free acount). That's approx the price of the 2 channel Seb with out VU's and about $200 more than the UA SINGLE channel. So that's 4 bricks for the price or 2 channels of seb or 1 channel of ua (almost) . Now of course the seb and the ua have basic eq which would be nice, they're in a nice pro rack not a goofy looking "brick" painted box, they have the in/outs on the back where they should be. BUT, then again the brick(s) can easily be set on a rack shelf and hauled to a gig or remote very easily. They can also be used for a variet of other things as well (see gt web site) The only thing I wondering is if it'll power my R-121 (it's pretty quiet) and if it'll match my TLM-103 well. The 103 is on the bright side so I'd think the brick might tame it down in a nice way for vocals/ac. gtr. The R-121 I'm shure would do fine with the brick for loud elec gtr which is what it does 80% of the time anyway. Snare, kick, toms, bass mics/di's probably would all sound great with the brick (might have to pad though).
Will the brick dirty up when cranked? I've heard/read it's "like the ViPre set on only one setting, is that true? (shurly not) and what setting is that?
Is the Brick neutralish, darkish, brightish, cleanish, dirtyish...anyother type of ...ish.......?

Some hot rod mods to the thing I'm shure could be made to make it more desireable to individual users.....even changing the tube could yield "better" results, more gain, etc......

So have you tested it out, Kurt?
I just bought a RNP, and think it sounds excellent. Of course, I've only used a DMP3, Presonus Blue Tube and E-mu TFPRo (Audiodock) and the FMR RNP is superior.

A pair of "The Brick" just arrived yesterday. Holy moley, these things must weigh in at 10 lbs each. Lots of iron in there. Transformers on the inputs and outputs and a very beefy power supply. I am gonna pop the lid off one today and check out how the thing is constructed. I am guessing there a lot of surface mount components ... not the best way to build anything but there must be some compromise somewhere in order to achive the price point.

As far as getting 2 or more at $300, don't hold you breath ... that's dealer cost pretty much ... $325 is a great deal.

Give 'em a whirl; let us know whut you think. Can you pop them open without having to buy them? Maybe keep that on the DL... :lol:

I'm especially interested in what you think about those on overheds. I might have to spring for another if the result is good.
Remember, keep an open mind without bias on this cheap piece of budget junk. 8)

:|

Well I was wrong. The Brick uses through the board mounting for the components. This means in 20 years, the thing can be repaired even if the company goes out of business or sub assemblies aren't available.

All the connecters and switches are mounted to the case so there's no strain on them or the very smallish PCB when plugging or unplugging mic or guitar cabels. All in all, the construction is very robust. I'm almost afraid to try them out now, because if they sound any good at all, I'm going to want to keep them.

Reggie wrote: Remember, keep an open mind without bias on this cheap piece of budget junk.

I would not call it cheap ... $325 is a lot of cash to a lot of people and it is defiantly not a piece of junk. I've seen gear at three times the price that wasn't as well built. But this does show that a really good basic mic pre can be made and sold at a reasonable price point, which is what I have been asking for all along.

Now there are some things I don't like already. I don't like the stand alone case design. It is a bit cumbersome to deal with in a CR setting but it would be perfect if you were using "The Brick" as a di box or if you are one of the "tweaks" that like to keep mic cabel runs to a mininmum by placing the mic pres in the live room with the performers. The power and phantom switches are on the rear panel and the mic and 1/4" connectors are on the front. So to turn on phantom power you have to fumble around on the back panel. The mic cables will be going into the front of the unit and hang across any other pre amps you may have in the rack. I would have preferred to see the ins and outs on the rear and all the switches and pots on one panel on the front. But that's small stuff, not to be sweated especially when you consider the cost of the unit.

It will be interesting to see if Groove Tubes rack mounts 2 or more of these babies in the future. That would be a killer set up.
8-)

the other thing to remeber is that with none of the switches or conectos being pcb mounted they left it preaty open for any one to build there own rack mountable case.

one complaint; the small tube is solderd to the board i dont know if this is a real big problem if this tube goes out mutch. its the smallest one about the size of a 3cm long pencile.

Kurt Foster wrote: Well I was wrong. The Brick uses through the board mounting for the components. This means in 20 years, the thing can be repaired even if the company goes out of business or sub assemblies aren't available.

All the connecters and switches are mounted to the case so there's no strain on them or the very smallish PCB when plugging or unplugging mic or guitar cabels. All in all, the construction is very robust. I'm almost afraid to try them out now, because if they sound any good at all, I'm going to want to keep them.

[quote=Reggie] Remember, keep an open mind without bias on this cheap piece of budget junk.

I would not call it cheap ... $325 is a lot of cash to a lot of people and it is defiantly not a piece of junk. I've seen gear at three times the price that wasn't as well built. But this does show that a really good basic mic pre can be made and sold at a reasonable price point, which is what I have been asking for all along.

Now there are some things I don't like already. I don't like the stand alone case design. It is a bit cumbersome to deal with in a CR setting but it would be perfect if you were using "The Brick" as a di box or if you are one of the "tweaks" that like to keep mic cabel runs to a mininmum by placing the mic pres in the live room with the performers. The power and phantom switches are on the rear panel and the mic and 1/4" connectors are on the front. So to turn on phantom power you have to fumble around on the back panel. The mic cables will be going into the front of the unit and hang across any other pre amps you may have in the rack. I would have preferred to see the ins and outs on the rear and all the switches and pots on one panel on the front. But that's small stuff, not to be sweated especially when you consider the cost of the unit.

It will be interesting to see if Groove Tubes rack mounts 2 or more of these babies in the future. That would be a killer set up.
8-)

So are you doing a review of the Brick.

It will be interesting to see if Groove Tubes rack mounts 2 or more of these babies in the future. That would be a killer set up.

the other thing to remeber is that with none of the switches or conectos being pcb mounted they left it preaty open for any one to build there own rack mountable case.

I am also hoping Groove Tubes will rack a pair of these up and if they don't it should be an easy DIY project.

Maybe Kev will give it whirl?

DaveG wrote: So are you doing a review of the Brick.

Kurt seems to like to look at components first, then make judgements on how he expects it to sound, then finally take a listen... his conclusions are ussually pretty much what he initially expects, though you'd think if he just listens first without knowing anything he might conclude a more reasonable/believable truth of opinion.

jamiey wrote:
Kurt seems to like to look at components first, then make judgements on how he expects it to sound, then finally take a listen...

Yes I do. I don't have the time or resources to buy and listen to every p.o.s. mic pre that comes down the pike. So I have to rely on manufacturers to supply the review pieces. Manufacturers don't like it when the loan of a piece is requested for review purposes and after going through the time and expense of shipping a piece to the person, no review follows.

In that case I am forced to write an ambigous, middle of the road review (like the PreSonus review I did) which no one is happy with. I don't like having to do that. I have to weed them out first. I often will look at build topology to help make these calls .... Wall wart? ummm no thanks .... Pots and connectors surface mounted to the PCB? ... I'l pass.

2 +2 always equals 4, not 5 or 6, no matter how hard some manufacturers may try to convince people of it. The's no way any pre is going to pass muster with an 8v dc power supply, no matter how many ampers it supplies.

jamiey wrote: his conclusions are ussually pretty much what he initially expects

Uh, what is wrong with that? It seems to me, that proves my obsevations more so than not.

jamiey wrote: you'd think if he just listens first without knowing anything he might conclude a more reasonable/believable truth of opinion.

If you have a constructive suggestions to make as to how I can cull out the losers, I am happy to hear them.

Lets please not turn this into yet another flame war that strays off topic ... That helps no one. :roll:

So is the sound as you expected, Kurt? :-?

Still listening to it ...

Kurt Foster wrote: Still listening to it ...

Take your time, I am really interested in this unit and will gladly wait for a good honest appraisal of the Brick.

I've researched quite a few pres over that last few weeks and feel submerged in info and decisions. :?

I recently looked at a Focusrite Platinum TwinTrak Pro Duel Channel Strip and wonder if it is any good. Any thoughts on this unit Kurt or know where I can find some reviews on TT Pro?

The Best,
DennisT