If you are recording one track at a time a channel strip just may be the answer. There are so many nice ones available the best thing I can recomend is to see if you can find a rental place there in Cleveland to rent one for a few days to try out.

I have an Origin here and I like it very much. Mic pre, DI, EQ and compressor section all in one... very smooth and uncolored. You can add some color and attitude by useing the transformer across the input and the tube topology on the mic pre, eq and compressor section. I find the STT-1 to be very versitile.

Sebatron has the "Thorax", at considerably less than the "Origin" and another to consider is the API channel strip, which is a real winner! All three are very different from the others ...

If I could swing the cash, right now I would love a rack full (16 channels) of Great River MP2NVs and the EQ2NVs ... very good sounding stuff!

Another to consider is the SSL XLogic channel. Very nice compressor and excellent EQ.

I am getting 6 channels of this very soon plus another 6 of API. :)

steve

Wow! Steve! That's going to be some serious front end... just what you need for the PT rig! I'm drooling!

Boy you guys answer fast! And with great advice. I almost alway record just one track at a time. So the channel strip does sound like a good consideration. I've never heard of the SSL Logic nor the Thorax. I have read a lot of posts where people seem to say a lot of positive things about the great river stuff. Kurt, you said that the Origin, the Thorax and the API all sound so different. How is that? Also, is there any benifit to having a rack full of stuff rather than a channel strip? Lastly, I mentioned before that I read a lot of great things about the Distresser. Everyone seems to say that it's a must have piece because they like it so much. How much weight should I give this in my decision making process?

Kurt, by the way I really enjoyed listening to your mic preamp comparisons. I liked the first 2 which happened to be the Speck. I listened to the mic comparisons too. I've always read about how legendary the Neumann U87 is but i never knowingly heard it until I listened to your demo. It sounds amazing!

They all sound different because they do what they do in different ways.. and because they are different designs. The Origin is a "twin topology" pre that offers both solid state and tube circuts, as well as transformer in or out, the API uses transformers and an OP AMP and the Thorax is an all tube, transformer discreet type. You will find that almost all gear sounds different from each other even if the design philosiphy is similar.

Hey Kurt. I've been looking at gear still and I checked out the channel strips that you had mentioned. I can't find any place around here that rents gear so that I can hear the difference. I'm thinking about getting either the great river pre or an api. Phoenix and John Hardy also have my curiosity. My question to you is this. How would having a good pre an empirical labs distresser, and an outboard eq such as the speck compare to having the Millennia Origion that you had mentioned? Which would give me a better sound or be more versatile?

[ January 04, 2004, 09:29 PM: Message edited by: WDavidW ]

You might be able to open a relationship with one of the highend audio dealers that can ship you stuff to try out, especially if you can leave a hefty deposit.
I would look at Millennia, Sebatron, Phoenix, Universal Audio, and OSA.
David

Originally posted by WDavidW:
Hey guys. This is my first post. I’ve read a lot of your posts and you guys are all great. I hope to get some good advice. I’ve been doing some home recording for the past couple of years and decided to upgrade my equipment. My path was Octava mk319 mic to a Mackie 1202vlz pro to dbx266xl to maudio sound card to the UAD1. I recently bought a Blueberry mic and now I’d like to improve my whole front end by upgrading my mic pre and compressor and avoid all my old junk altogether. The more I read the more confused I get! Should I get a channel strip such as the Universal audio 6176, the Avalon 737, the Langevin Dual Vocal, Millenium Origin or any other channel strip? Or am I better off getting a mic pre such as the John Hardy, Manley, Brent Averill, Great River, API, Pheonix, Vintech etc. etc. etc. and then a compressor such as the Empirical Labs Distressor? I have no idea which one to get because I haven’t heard them. Can you guys suggest something to me? I’d really appreciate it! I’d like to stick with all discrete class A stuff. My priorities are 1)male vocals (that’s me) 2)guitar acoustic and electric 3) base 4)keyboard. No drums. My style ranges from Pink Floyd, Larry Norman, Simon and Garfunkel, to Matchbox 20 sounding stuff. I’d like to keep everything as close to $2300 as possible. Thanks a lot for the advice!

Put the Pendulum Quartet on your list to check out.

I start to drool when I see the Quartet... (We need a gremlin that drools). David

I checked out the Pendulum Quartet, on the internet, that you mentioned to me. When i read about it, it sounds realy good. Now I'm moe confused. Did you see the Quartet II that's coming out? Wow! It sounds like it's going to be smokin'. I'm still undecided. How does the Pendulums sound compare with the Millenium? There both about $2650 a pop. And how does this setup compare to the setup I mentioned above using all seperate pieces of gear? eg. great river pre + Distresser?

Originally posted by WDavidW:
I checked out the Pendulum Quartet, on the internet, that you mentioned to me. When i read about it, it sounds realy good. Now I'm moe confused. Did you see the Quartet II that's coming out? Wow! It sounds like it's going to be smokin'. I'm still undecided. How does the Pendulums sound compare with the Millenium? There both about $2650 a pop. And how does this setup compare to the setup I mentioned above using all seperate pieces of gear? eg. great river pre + Distresser?

I've never compared the Millennia Origin to the Pendulum Quartet. Theoretically, the Origin should be more versatile, given the separate solid state and tube circuits. Nonetheless, virtually all of the anecdotal reviews of the Quartet on the web mention that the Quartet is very versatile. All state it's an incredible piece. Indeed, of all the reviews and comments I've ever seen on any Pendulum product (there are several), there was only one negative review, that of the SPS-1, stating that its eq circuit was below par (I disagree, as I have an SPS-1 and the eq is great).

I believe Fletcher has compared the Origin and the Quartet, at least he has offered opinions comparing the two. He quite clearly prefers the Pendulum Quartet.

The Quartet II is not an upgrade of the original Quartet, nor is it a replacement. According to Greg, it's a complementary piece. The Quartet II is not $2,650, the street price wil be more in the $4,000-$5,000 range.

A suggestion: call Greg at Pendulum. He's one of the masters of audio design. He's also a great guy, and will take the time to speak at length with you.

Ok-still... Pendulum Quartet -vs- Great River ME1-NV + Distresser + Eq ?

Who wins?

First off, you have to be skeptic when you hear words from a salesman, even Fletcher. He sells the Quartet and none of Millennia's products. He also has vested interest as he was deeply involved in the design development of the Quartet-II unit. If you read the internet you'll find that Fletcher has had, and continues to have deep conflict with Millennia.

Second, I am doubtful that there has been that many Quartets sold, and not as many Quartets as Origins. You have to keep in mind that the reviews you read on the net as well as how many of them there are, are only a very small fraction of the total opinions and owners of those that really use those type of hi-end products. They both are great hi-end products that will serve you well with very little to complain about.

Originally posted by WDavidW:
Ok-still... Pendulum Quartet -vs- Great River ME1-NV + Distresser + Eq ?

Who wins?

Everybody wins! Don't think of it as one being better than another as you should that what is best is what is best for you and that will depend on your needs, wants, working style and what other gear you already own. Hi-end all-in-one units are flexable but are often not as flexable as having seperate units. They are only of true value to you if you like and use all the sections and features. They can be of great value in cost savings over what you would pay for seperate units. They are ideal for DAW front ends and those that take gear for remote use that also like to save rack space.

You can't really do a direct compare of the Pendulum Quartet -vs- Great River ME1-NV + Distresser + Eq because they all are very different sounding with different feature sets as well as one being a tube unit and the others not.

Originally posted by AudioGaff:

Everybody wins! Don't think of it as one being better than another as you should that what is best is what is best for you and that will depend on your needs, wants, working style and what other gear you already own.

hmmm....very insightful

Another thing. I understand that Fletcher might have his own biased opinion, but I wonder why sdelsolray and David Doc Herbert seem to be so high on the Pendulum?

I wonder why sdelsolray and David Doc Herbert seem to be so high on the Pendulum?

because they are gear-slut-pigs!

They just love great gear and they can see that the Pendulum is a great piece.

I reviewed the Origin and I liked it so much I purchased the review unit.

You keep asking about the Distressor and so you don't feel like I am ignoring you I will say this, I personally don't like it. I am not saying it's junk, a lot of people seem to like it a lot and you will hear of many people getting great results with it, but myself, I don't like stuff that distorts on purpose ... just my 2 cents on that.

Originally posted by Kurt Foster:

because they are gear-slut-pigs!

That's funny!
Kurt, I know that you recently purchased the Millenium. Have you heard the pendulum Quartet and if so what do you think? I'm sure that you are very happy with your new Millenium gear. Sorry I keep rehashing the same questions but I'm trying to get as many opinions as possible before I make a purchase. I can't find anyone around that rents gear so I'll probably have to go out and rack up a purchase of 4 or 5 pieces of gear on my credit card, play with them for about a week or two and then make a final desision and return the gear that I don't want. Because of this method I want to make my list as narrow as possible.

No I haven't heard the pendulum but judging from the construction and the reputation of the company I am reasonably sure it is good. I personally would lean towards the Quartet II as I like all the loading and transformer options..

The available info out on the Quartet II looks like it's going to be awesome but it's also going to be priced around $5000- a little bit out of my price range.

Originally posted by WDavidW:
The available info out on the Quartet II looks like it's going to be awesome but it's also going to be priced around $5000- a little bit out of my price range.

Mine too! :D That's why I always recomend the Sebatron pres... they are the least expensive, tube, all discreet, transformer loaded mic pres I have found so far. There are a lot of possibilities in what you can do to the sound with a Sebatron with the pads, deep, lo cuts, bright and air switches not to mention stacking channels for extra gain or drive. It is a vey flexible design. I have also found the Sebatron to be the best direct box I have ever used for electric guitar. It sounds very much like an old Fender Tweed Deluxe.

hi david!

i use avalon vt737sp, 2 amek 9098,dbx160s,2 distressors w.british mode, ese mastering comp etc... in different combinations as my recording chain. if i would have to choose a best setup from above equipment i would go for amek9098 and distressor with british option. it offers many different sound settings for any kind of music or style. another option is avalon vt 737. i use avalon every day on many different recording sessions and i am always very satisfied with results. i think all the recording channels in this range are very similar -the difference is in their character and your personal taste.

I record similar material, Matchbox 20 sounding stuff. The pendulum quartet and the Great River pres sound totally different. If this going to be your only mic pre I would suggest the Great River. It records everything well, the DI sounds great and you can get a variety of tone shaping by using the gain and output knobs. The pendulum is an excellent vocal pre, the DI is pretty good also, but when recording electric guitars, the Great River is my go-to pre. Vocals the Pendulum.

"another option is avalon vt 737. i use avalon every day on many different recording sessions and i am always very satisfied with results. i think all the recording channels in this range are very similar -the difference is in their character and your personal taste."

I own an avalon 737 and a few neve universal audio and rca preamps, as a channel strip the avalon is ok, the preamp sounds a bit wierd in comparison to the descrete transistorvintage tube pre-amps , the avalon has a serious problem with high bass and low mid, like a strange ambience on this frequency range , i mean ,the preamp is nice and quite, but is a nice preamp to use for only one or two channels in a total mix (the best woodwindflute signal chain i've ever worked with from pre amp throguh compression to eq)because it isn't that accurate and it does'nt cut through the mix, i find the compressor to be unusful most of the time (with the exception of woodwinds and sax) , but the eq is very usefull musical sweet and flexible