They'll do what they do best. Take the good designs and work of others, copy it, and make it as cheaply as possible to produce the most unreliable, shoddy cheap consumer products on the market.

How they survive is beyond amazing. I guess, good marketing of lousy Chinese junk, and otherwise reputable outlets carrying their products. They can't even resist co-opting names...as in their line of "iNuke" garbage.

Kapt.Krunch

Kapt.Krunch, post: 390135 wrote: They'll do what they do best. Take the good designs and work of others, copy it, and make it as cheaply as possible to produce the most unreliable, shoddy cheap consumer products on the market.

How they survive is beyond amazing. I guess, good marketing of lousy Chinese junk, and otherwise reputable outlets carrying their products. They can't even resist co-opting names...as in their line of "iNuke" garbage.

Kapt.Krunch

Bosch bought Behringer, Midas and KLARK TEKNIK, and are using technologies from all of them in the new products. It's a new day for their products now that they have in house engineering.

The X32 is a combination of Midas and KLARK TEKNIK technologies, quite different from their previous products.
It will take time for them to refresh the whole lineup, but keep your eye on the new ones.

:cool:

Looks pretty cool indeed, for $2899 I'm sure there will be some takers.
Only time will tell with the quality and reputation, which can change in the blink of an eye!
Most electronics is assembled in Asia these days so no surprise there. All about the QA.

If you look at something like the A&H GSR24M at $10k+, this thing is priced almost at the ZEDR16 level.
32 in 16 bus, FX, automation, iPad like screen everything digital....what more do you need to make that hit record for AMidol auditions...who knows??.....you can be assured it's going to sound "digital", so I'm sure the sound purists will claim all kinds of crazy things...but in the end it will still be 115db S/N using typical digital circuits.

Everybody can afford to have a console in their bedroom now!
Only time will tell.

Actually, I think it was "The Music Group" (Parent Company of Behringer)who bought out Midas and Klark Teknik from Bosch. [[url=http://[/URL]="http://mixonline.co…"]Here's the article[/]="http://mixonline.co…"]Here's the article[/].

Michael Deeb wrote: The KT and Midas brands “will continue to operate autonomously under the leadership of John Oakley while benefiting from the synergies of our combined efforts,”

Regardless, it seems that Behringer will benefit from the new blood and genuinely original ideas from within the companies. Whether that will translate to their quality control or not is another thing altogether. Not everything coming from China has to be of poor quality. Most computer parts are made there. Of course it all depends on whether or not Behringer are willing to spend a little more money on quality control.

The Behringer Powerplay 16 looks very nice !!! Its on my next purchase list

hmm, first glance looks really cheap. The buttons are sure to stick. My guess, presonus is working on a second generation StudioLive already. I'd be waiting.

The resale of this would be terrible.

Sorry to be the downer but they need to change their name too. I have zero faith in that company.

I have a set of their Truth 1031 active monitors and they were my first set (all I could afford) and 6 years later, they still sound nice. Also have their 8 channel head phone amp and 6 years later, it still does its job. While I personaly would never buy their mixers and amps, some of their products, well, work and are very cost effective.

My apologies for being so down on them. I know they make some products that are really well priced and do what they say they do. Like their headphone controller, that looks pretty cool. And I'm glad to hear your monitors are working well too! They are definitely helping people get into recording.

audiokid, post: 390176 wrote: My apologies for being so down on them. I know they make some products that are really well priced and do what they say they do. Like their headphone controller, that looks pretty cool. And I'm glad to hear your monitors are working well too! They are definitely helping people get into recording.

I didnt mean it in a bad way. Its all good. I know some of their stuff is junk !! But at least by them making stuff inexpensive, it helps keep the price of the good stuff lower too. Well, somewhat. :) And I no longer use the monitors as my main set. Upgraded to KRK's But that new personal monitor mixer system (powerplay) look sweet.

Behringer means two things to me:
Generally poor quality
Sometimes a steal if you get a good one

There are some products/models I still use (reluctantly), and there are others I also still use - as a doorstop.
Like many here, I have limited faith in their products. I also have experienced some units that far outperform their price point.
Guess we'll have to see which this is?

amen

I have to admit, there is one piece of Behr gear that I think is pretty decent. Their Vamp 2 amp emulator. I had a Vamp 2 that sounded really nice. It felt cheap. It was cheap but it sounded really good. Their mixers are generally awful though. Cheap. And their IMP preamps sound like crap. Noisy and sterile. I can deal with the sterile but the noise is unacceptable.

Maybe this will improve now that they have some influence from these other two companies. We will see.

I've used plenty of Behringer's stuff. Their audio isn't horrible. Their repair ability is. It's disposable stuff. But when one considers the quick march of changing technologies, it doesn't matter if it lasts a long time anymore. It's inexpensive enough to be able to replace it often enough so as not to worry about huge investments and long-term usage.

I still like my old stuff that's not Behringer stuff
Mx. Remy Ann David

Hi All,

Just wanted to address a couple small points here.

Kapt.Krunch, post: 390135 wrote: They'll do what they do best. Take the good designs and work of others, copy it, and make it as cheaply as possible to produce the most unreliable, shoddy cheap consumer products on the market.

With all due respect, the X32 is a completely original design that Behringer developed completely in-house with help from our sister companies, Midas and Klark-Teknik. It is not a "copy" of anything.

hueseph, post: 390160 wrote: Actually, I think it was "The Music Group" (Parent Company of Behringer)who bought out Midas and Klark Teknik from Bosch. Here's the article.

Regardless, it seems that Behringer will benefit from the new blood and genuinely original ideas from within the companies. Whether that will translate to their quality control or not is another thing altogether. Not everything coming from China has to be of poor quality. Most computer parts are made there. Of course it all depends on whether or not Behringer are willing to spend a little more money on quality control.

This is correct. Behringer, Midas, and Klark-Teknik are all owned by the same parent company (MUSIC-GROUP) but are all autonomous in operation, for all intents and purposes. That said, there are some products like the X32 and the upcoming QX series mixers, which can be seen as a "collaboration" of sorts.

RemyRAD, post: 390208 wrote: I've used plenty of Behringer's stuff. Their audio isn't horrible. Their repair ability is. It's disposable stuff. But when one considers the quick march of changing technologies, it doesn't matter if it lasts a long time anymore. It's inexpensive enough to be able to replace it often enough so as not to worry about huge investments and long-term usage.

I still like my old stuff that's not Behringer stuff
Mx. Remy Ann David

A big problem that we had in the past was with third parties managing our warranty service and spare parts operations. Now that we have very recently opened up our new service center and parts warehouse in Las Vegas, we are addressing those problems. Granted, we still have a ways to go, but I believe we are on the right track.

Take Care,
James Burns,
Social Media Coordinator,
MUSIC-GROUP US.

James,

Thanks for chiming in. As much as the group can be cynical here, we do welcome an insiders voice. Behringer has had a bit of a shady past in the experience of many of us but myself am hoping that is changing. Many companies have had to revamp their business model. Some for better, some for worse and others with little effect whatsoever. With the economy the way it is, there is a huge market opening up for a company such a Behringer which potentially take a "lion's share" if the quality can surpass the price. Everybody wants a bargain.

At any rate, looking forward to seeing what else is in store.

From one of my Logic user group meetings I learned that the Music-Group had an office in my region. good to hear from a real person.

Hell has frozen over. Behringer are now offering a 3 year warranty on all of their products. That's generally longer than the life expectancy of most of their products. LOL. But seriously, could things really be on the change? I have to admit, they have my attention now.

I have always been curious about buying Behringer stuff but have always gotten more bad then good reviews, So I never did. And starting a home studio I think eventually after I save up im going to get the X32. I have no money right now just had 4th open heart. And James Thanks for sticking up for your product.... sounds amazing to me.... it will be mine!

BobbyRose23, post: 395238 wrote: I have always been curious about buying Behringer stuff but have always gotten more bad then good reviews, So I never did. And starting a home studio I think eventually after I save up im going to get the X32. I have no money right now just had 4th open heart. And James Thanks for sticking up for your product.... sounds amazing to me.... it will be mine!

Hold your horses there. The X32 is more of a live mixer. I don't think it will really serve you in a studio. In fact take deep consideration of this because there are far better recording mixers out there. The X32 may have some nice features but none of them will do you any good if you have to mix everything down to a stereo pair.

Take a good look at the Allan and Heath Zed R16. It runs around the same price but it is a fully funtional contol surface (you can control your DAW with it) as well as a 16 channel FireWire audio interface. Whic means 16 channels in to 16 separate tracks simultaneously.

[[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.sweetwat…"]Allen & Heath ZED-R16 | Sweetwater.com[/]="http://www.sweetwat…"]Allen & Heath ZED-R16 | Sweetwater.com[/]

hueseph, post: 395240 wrote: Hold your horses there. The X32 is more of a live mixer. I don't think it will really serve you in a studio. In fact take deep consideration of this because there are far better recording mixers out there. The X32 may have some nice features but none of them will do you any good if you have to mix everything down to a stereo pair.

Take a good look at the Allan and Heath Zed R16. It runs around the same price but it is a fully funtional contol surface (you can control your DAW with it) as well as a 16 channel FireWire audio interface. Whic means 16 channels in to 16 separate tracks simultaneously.

[[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.sweetwat…"]Allen & Heath ZED-R16 | Sweetwater.com[/]="http://www.sweetwat…"]Allen & Heath ZED-R16 | Sweetwater.com[/]

Dude you must be off your rocker, that's more live sound right there. So you want me to get something doesn't have DAW control, compressors, built in effects? Seriously dude don't say another word to me if your that delusional. Your right there are better things out there but nothing at that price with that feature set! Thanks

BobbyRose23, post: 395242 wrote: Dude you must be off your rocker, that's more live sound right there. So you want me to get something doesn't have DAW control, compressors, built in effects? Seriously dude don't say another word to me if your that delusional. Your right there are better things out there but nothing at that price with that feature set! Thanks

Just to be fair...the X32 is all digital whereas the A&H ZEDR16 is all analog (preamp, mix, summing, EQ, pan) that has a digital interface converter (FW/ADAT).
The X32 being all digital (DSP and mix), is really a DAW in the box. The faders are digital, the controls are digital, all the effects are digital, all the editing and mixing is digital. Practically all the computer will do is "tape" things.
I'm sort of surprised it doesn't have a couple of 1TB HDD's in it. Then it would be an "all-in-one" recorder.....those again!
Seems like we're going back to the future....again.
UA has there Apollo which I'm sure has a better DSP and effects/tools as does the RME UFX with TotalMix.
Faders, connectors and colored button groups are cheap to build and pretty soon it will be one chip in the middle of the board....

And lets not forget the StudioLive being a killer live and recording solution at an incredible price.

I agree with ya completely. A friend of mine who does a bit of everything was talking to me and we just thought because I said a home studio that's all I'm using it for. Maybe I am doing live sound when I need too ya know? That dude should not assume he knows what I need. My friend (who does professional live sound and recording) and I both looked at everything and came up with this choice.

BobbyRose23, post: 395242 wrote: Dude you must be off your rocker, that's more live sound right there. So you want me to get something doesn't have DAW control, compressors, built in effects? Seriously dude don't say another word to me if your that delusional. Your right there are better things out there but nothing at that price with that feature set! Thanks

The Zed R16 Does have DAW control. That being said, I totally missed the FireWire Connectivity of this board. I could swear that's a new feature and I've been following this since they released it. If it isn't too obvious, I started this thread. I'll have to hold back on opinion for this board until there's some track record. The fact that it has Midas preamps is a draw. I want tried and tested though. The Studio Live consoles have at least as good a feature set. I could care less about the effects. I have enough effects and I don't need that many.

In fact at the time that I posted this thread originally, there was no firewire capability. It seems they have included a FireWire card since. Originally this was to be an option but I suppose the received many requests for this feature on their facebook page.

Im liking this mixer. And I wonder if Behringer may introduce a firmware update that would give it more "studio" features at the expense of some of the live features a studio user may not need. You know re-program the thing for studio only use !!!

I'm Sure the rep from the Main Company who is on here, which seems like a great guy and I am sure will pass that idea along. I think that is something that could possibly would happen. I am just wondering capability with Windows 7 and later myself. I am stuck between this and studio live. But I'm getting pros and cons from friends of mine and would love to hear input from you all!!

I'm not down on Behringer's stuff. I've made quite a few lovely recordings on some of their cheapest equipment. Not horrible and I've heard worse. I think they're pairing with MIDAS will be good and beneficial in the long run? The MIDAS stuff has always been built rather rugged. And maybe this will improve the Behringer product line? It's certainly an interesting looking mixer. A piece that has actually caught my eye. Though I will still always love transformer coupled microphone preamps and output line amplifiers. I don't care much for transformer less sound. I like my chicken crispy and my sound smooth. And I like both quite spicy. Maybe I should just get rid of that other crappy old Neve? Na, not yet.

But I'm thinking about it for my combo surround control room?
Mx. Remy Ann David

(That is if I stay in business?)

Mommie, make it go away!

hueseph, post: 390902 wrote: Hell has frozen over. Behringer are now offering a 3 year warranty on all of their products. That's generally longer than the life expectancy of most of their products. LOL. But seriously, could things really be on the change? I have to admit, they have my attention now.

i'm scared .... now Behringer's ok?

..... to qoute Harry Neilsen ... "Good bad, good bad, good bad, good bad .....

so Behringers either getting better or Midas is getting worse. I suspect the latter.

I cannot imagine any company with dignity taking on a name like Behringer unless, Midas needs the facility and all workers to manufacture Midas the Asian way.

Or, Midas as we knew it, is over and Behringer consuming more opportunities.

i can't say it a fact (here comes the ugly rumor) but i think i heard somewhere Midas was sold and the new management moved production to Indonesia. so again rather than assuming that Behringer is improving their product line i would suspect that Midas is getting cheaper. i will look around to see if i can find something on the interweb to support my statements ...

yeah. bummer news.

http://www.google.com/url?sa=t&rct=j&q=midas%20audio%20news&source=web&cd=3&cad=rja&ved=0CDIQFjAC&url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.audioprointernational.com%2Fnews%2Fread%2Fbehringer-buys-midas-and-klark-teknik%2F01874&ei=IBqUUO7IGsv3igKjuoHIBg&usg=AFQjCNGI2f3wYVJaxtWDE-Iz1qb_hKxKdg

There ya go. Asian companies buying up the deals like pacman.

You see, what's great about Bosch, the original owners of Klark Technik and Midas, they're 92% owned by a non-profit trust. They're not out for the profit of their shareholders. Most of the margins in the products they produce to go to employee salaries and R&D, which is why they (for the most part) make such good stuff.

Company –[="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Robert_Bosch_GmbH"]Robert Bosch GmbH - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/]="http://en.wikipedia…"]Robert Bosch GmbH - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/]
Trust – [[url=http://="http://en.wikipedia…"]Robert Bosch Stiftung - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/]="http://en.wikipedia…"]Robert Bosch Stiftung - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia[/]

Under new for-profit management, the companies won't be the same.