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pcrecord 5 May 2015

Hi everyone !
The recording phase as ended. It's now time to talk about the tracks and mix.

Everyone is allowed to participate, just ask for the link, download the tracks, mix the song and upload an mp3 here and the full mix to the same link in the folder Mixes. ( I will provide the link in private ) We're gonna take a few weeks to mix and then the Mastering phase will start.

It's not a contest, it's just for fun, exchanging, Learning.
There is no mix guide line except those :

  • Do not change the structure of the song
  • it's a pop/rock song
  • 120bpm at 24bit96khz

Topic Tags

Comments

pcrecord Sat, 05/16/2015 - 08:07

I hope you guys are gonna come up with some nice mixes.. For those who want to participate write to me in private I'll give you access to the stems ;)

Here's my take on it.. which is pretty conservative, 1 room for the drum and a master reverb (same on all instruments) Minimum EQ and Comp.

[MEDIA=audio]http://recording.or…

Attached files All I have to do_pcrecordMix.mp3 (4.8 MB) 

DonnyThompson Sun, 05/17/2015 - 05:12

I'm diggin' it...

Nice mix, Marco. (y) Nice space, depth, balance. It's very smooth and organic. Vocals are warm, but still nicely present. You've got everything going on that I personally like to hear in a mix :

Richness, Warmth, Definition, Clarity, Depth, Space, Air and Silk.

I also like the arrangement - a lot ... it's a fresh approach to a classic song; and the arrangement still fits the song - like when Jose' Feliciano did his version of The Door's Light My Fire ... it was different, but it still paid respect to the song .
You didn't drift so far away from the original that it became unrecognizable ... LOL ...

There's only one exception to the arrangement that made me cock my head, just a little bit... :confused: - I found the distorted rhythm guitar to be somewhat out of place with this arrangement/approach - particularly in its relation to the EP and the clean rhythm guitar - which I love, BTW.

I'm not saying that it's "a bull in a china shop" kind of thing ... I just found it to be a bit momentarily distracting. But this is a personal taste thing, and only IMHO, of course.

All 'round, you've all done a really nice job with this. ;)

FWIW

-d.

pcrecord Sun, 05/17/2015 - 13:20

Thanks for the good words Donny.. Originaly it was decided to be a pop rock song and there have been words in the process of recording that the tracks people made was going too soft.. I think the distortion guitar has it's place because it gives a strait rithme to complement the strait drum.. Without it I felt it was mising some strait 8th notes references.. Althought maybe I mixed it too hot for some parts and or it could have been less distorted.

Anyway, I'd be very happy if you had time to mix it too DonnyThompson ! This part of the project is all about analysing the tracking and share mixing techniques and any insight is welcome ;)

I'm trying to be an open book about this mix, if anyone has questions on how I did something or how I could have done it better, please do ask or comment !
To those who read this .. please give the mixing a try.

DonnyThompson Tue, 05/19/2015 - 00:46

Ya, I like this better.

This is a nice mix, pal.

There's quite a bit of demand lately for remakes of classic songs these days - particularly with TV shows ( and some movies, too) who don't want to pay the licensing for the original versions, which can get fairly pricey. Many prefer to use cover versions because it costs them much less.

If you watch any network TV shows - like Grey's Anatomy, Joan of Arcadia, etc., you'll hear cover versions of popular songs in their episodes. They use cover versions so that the licensing fees are much cheaper than if they'd us the original versions.

It's one of the reasons why, if you buy DVD collections of past TV shows that had the real versions of songs in their episodes - like WKRP In Cincinnati, or even Saturday Night Live, with their weekly musical guests, that the music has either been changed, or sometimes, even deleted entirely, because the companies releasing those old TV show collections on DVD don't want to continue to pay the licensing for the music that was on the episode when it originally aired.

You should try and shop this to a production music library service... they generally pay a one time fee to use it - you won't get any royalties - because you didn't write the song - but those companies will generally handle all the paperwork and clearance through the publishers and the Harry Fox Agency, so all you need to do is to provide the song, mixed, mastered and ready to go. You should look into it. ;)

Smashh Wed, 05/20/2015 - 07:04

Nice mix Marco (y),

You've got everything nice and clear and warm on this end . . I'm finding the rhythm guitar on the right a little distracting . For me i wanna hear something smoother there , maybe the keys and
make that rhythm guitar thinner so its more percussive maybe and buried a bit .:)

pcrecord Wed, 05/20/2015 - 09:02

Smashh, post: 429132, member: 45856 wrote: Nice mix Marco (y),

You've got everything nice and clear and warm on this end . . I'm finding the rhythm guitar on the right a little distracting . For me i wanna hear something smoother there , maybe the keys and
make that rhythm guitar thinner so its more percussive maybe and buried a bit .:)

You are very welcome to do the mix as you please Smashh (and anyone for that mather) ;)

I like your Idea to put the keys instead of the guitar on the left channel. What made me put both guitar left and right was the fact that they share common frequencies and so it makes somekind of balance in the stereo Spectrum..

freightgod Wed, 05/20/2015 - 19:47

pcrecord, post: 429116, member: 46460 wrote: You know the goal was to exchange and learn and leave a trace on RO. But it's quite something that you would think it's worth selling.
The song and production is not mine and I guess if it ever happens each participants would receive their on part. :love:

for sure you should do what you want with this! Or with a better vocal...I do like the breaking of musical expectations with a classic like this. It was fun.

I'm heavy into another piece of work right now, but I don't think I could improve, this was nicely mixed.

Gotta channel my Lou Rawls...

Matt Thu, 05/21/2015 - 14:42

To be honest, I really like the vocal take. I will admit that wasn't my initial reaction after I heard the first version a while back, but I must say that you have a very unique voice which I have warmed use to and now find that it complements the songs and gives the songs more of an impact that a listener will remember.
As for reverb, I always struggle to find one that I am happy with and I tweak settings constantly, but here u just chose something in about 5 seconds as I didn't want it to be very present as it'll make the vocals more distant. Any feedback is appreciated as it's def a learning process. Thx

pcrecord Thu, 05/21/2015 - 15:30

Matt , your mix is very good. I found that everything is missing High frequencies but that could be due to your monitoring system.
If feel that the dynamics of the right guitar could be more controlled as some part takes a lot of place in the mix.. but it's a minor thing.
It's interesting that you gave more importance to the keys than I have..

In all it's not missing a lot to be sent to mastering.. Good Job !

Matt Thu, 05/21/2015 - 16:24

Thanks. I do agree with the high end but I was trying to keep it somewhat clean and wanted to stay away from boosting highs by 8db or so in places, tried to keep all eq boosts under 3db but I did focus more on frequency cancelling where I did reduce some troubling ringing frequencies by quite a bit. Thanks for the input, I wanted that before sending more time on a second pass. As for the keys, I did add a bit of width. And I'll look at the guit as I didn't automate it's volume. Thanks PC!

pcrecord Thu, 05/21/2015 - 17:56

I know you were finding the cymbals a bit agressif but you could have used some other trick to control them.
exemple : multiband compresor, sidechain compression. Automation on Overheads is tricky because it wouldn't affect only the cymbals..
I recommend (well not very my place to tell you what to do..) to A/B you mix with some commercial CDs to be sure it's not that your monitoring/room isn't giving you too much or agressive HF..
I say that because, even if they are loud in my studio, it find them acceptable.

OBrien Fri, 05/22/2015 - 12:42

Matt, post: 429146, member: 48561 wrote: Here is my first go at this. Not a whole lot of processing here, spend a few mins per track eq'ing it and such. As a drummer I added some volume envelopes as I found some of the cymbals too be a bit much. It's my first go so let me know what you think.

[MEDIA=audio]http://recording.or…

I liked the distorted guitar what I didn't take well to was the stop in timing. If it modulated the stop might work but overall it is kinda bad for a dance song.

pcrecord Fri, 05/22/2015 - 15:19

That's interesting Brien. You are very right that inducing somekind of hypnosis is a common practice of dance or pop music and that practice avoids changing or stopping the rithme in the song. This could have been a valuable thing to consider in pre-production..
How did you find the mixes that were posted so far ? Would you like to participate and submit a mix?

Smashh Sat, 05/23/2015 - 09:23

I tried out the good hertz dither I got last nite , Its better than the powr dither that Ive been using.
I didnt think dither made any difference , but Im sure this one is getting a better sound ( or am I imagining things ....lol)

[[url=http://[/URL]="http://recording.or…"]DREAM DREAM DREAM.mp3[/]="http://recording.or…"]DREAM DREAM DREAM.mp3[/]

[MEDIA=audio]http://recording.or…

[MEDIA=audio]https://recording.o…

Attached files DREAM DREAM DREAM.mp3 (4.6 MB) 

pcrecord Sun, 05/24/2015 - 08:32

pcrecord, post: 429202, member: 46460 wrote: Nice mix Smashh, I find it a bit heavy on the low end (bass and bassdrum)
But the balance and ambiance is good except maybe for a thinny bit more activity on the right channel (guits etc)

Good job ! ;)

Hey smashh, I listened to your mix in the studio.. I found that there was a certain level of noise through the song and it was a bit dark. Did you put the whole mix Through a tape simulator or something ?
Other than this I like it.. casual a bit retro sounding... NICE ! ;)

DonnyThompson Sun, 05/24/2015 - 08:59

I'm hearing the same thing, Marco... it's not like crazy obvious or anything, it's subtle, but it's there. And I'm not even saying it's unpleasant... It does have a bit more of a retro vibe to it.

Sounds more like a tape sim than a console sim? But it could be either... or neither... C'mon Smash... tell us... inquiring minds and all... LOL

After listening again... and I'm picking at nits on this - and I may be wrong, too, but I'm hearing a frequency in the vocal that's a little bit distracting... it's an edgy one, like maybe around 3 - 5 k?

To me, it's a bit too much at times. It's not a deal breaker or anything, just saying what I hear. ;)

Smashh Mon, 05/25/2015 - 07:17

I had waves NLS on the reverb aux channel and the red saturation knob on full .....lol . Good picking there :sneaky:

I also have the vocals going to valhalla ubermod and then to imperial delay plugins ( I haven't used them so experimenting )

I wound them down for this mix

[[url=http://[/URL]="http://recording.or…"]DREAM DREAM DREAM_.mp3[/]="http://recording.or…"]DREAM DREAM DREAM_.mp3[/]

[MEDIA=audio]http://recording.or…

[MEDIA=audio]https://recording.o…

Attached files DREAM DREAM DREAM_.mp3 (4.6 MB) 

Smashh Tue, 05/26/2015 - 15:06

I got rid of the NLS for the latest mix .It was an experiment trying to find a nice place to use that plug in , ( it was the middle setting on previous mix) . Ive found through this thread that Im monitoring at too lower level ( especially with headphones , late at night when I cant make much noise ) .
I could hear the noise from the NLS when I first opened the session up the next day . So from now on I'll listen closer when the sessions opens with a pop/ or not, and theres a nice silence.
AS far as workflow goes , I should not post anything here late at night / or make any final decisions until the next day after sleeping on it .Also I need some silent time ( thats easy to get at night time ....lol )

pcrecord Sat, 05/30/2015 - 07:26

Smashh, post: 429247, member: 45856 wrote: I had waves NLS on the reverb aux channel and the red saturation knob on full .....lol . Good picking there :sneaky:

I also have the vocals going to valhalla ubermod and then to imperial delay plugins ( I haven't used them so experimenting )

I wound them down for this mix

[[url=http://[/URL]="http://recording.or…"]DREAM DREAM DREAM_.mp3[/]="http://recording.or…"]DREAM DREAM DREAM_.mp3[/]

[MEDIA=audio]http://recording.or…

I like what you did with the bassdrum and snare. The new mix is nice but I feel it's missing some mids specially low mids. Maybe it's a thing that the mastering would work on.
Everything is there but it could be more open, not some much like in a closet..
My comments address very subttle issues. All in all it's a good mix ;)

Maybe I'm a freak but once in a while when I mix, I check it with a spectrum analyser and try not to create gaps with a target of like a pink noise.
It makes the mastering phase a lot easier and more even so that I don't use much of gain reduction..
If it can help ;)

pcrecord Thu, 06/04/2015 - 06:23

OK there hasn't been a lot of activity on the thread lately.
I'm gonna let until monday to summit new mixes.
After that, I'll need to know if you are still interested in bringing this to mastering. If so I'll create a new thread for the mastering phase.
We can either master one mix or many, but they will need to be posted on Google drive to get the best quality for everyone ;)

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