pow420 wrote: Me and a friend are going to invest 10k to building a pro recording studio for recording bands for money. My question is, if you had 10k in your hand right now to do the same what would you buy. The 10k has to include everything except a computer, we already have a G5. Thanks

Don't do it.

I will be uncharacteristic, and make a long post (hehe):

Going into business with friends and family is very dangerous. Many people flat out refuse to go into business with friends and family, while others go forward, but with extreme caution.

Recording studios are folding left and right, and these are people with more equipment, professional experience, and business experience than you and your friend.

$10K is a lot of money, in a way. But in another way, it's nothing.

You don't have enough for new construction.

You don't have enough for conversion of an old structure.

"You don't ...." x n situations

Sit on the money, read/research some more, and then reconsider.

pow420 wrote: Me and a friend are going to invest 10k to building a pro recording studio for recording bands for money. My question is, if you had 10k in your hand right now to do the same what would you buy. The 10k has to include everything except a computer, we already have a G5. Thanks

BWAAAAAHAAAAHAAAAAA!!!! You ARE kidding, right?!?!

OMG, you got it bad, don'cha?

I would buy $5000 worth of stock in an oil company and $5000 worth of stock in an insurance company, and forget the recording business like a hooker does a John.

SERIOUSLY!! You'ld be a LOT better off!

Save your money... put it ANYWHERE else but in a recording studio, because you are obviously under a serious delusion... NO ONE can honestly think that owning a recording studio is going to MAKE them money.

Question:
How do you make a million bucks with a recording studio?
Answer:
START WITH TWO MILLION BUCKS!

If you're doing this to make money, DON'T BOTHER!! You'll end up loosing everything. Especially when you're starting out under-funded by well over $140,000 for an entry level PRO studio.

Yeah, I'm an asshole, but I'm not a prick. I'm try to give you guys a short wakeup call as to the reality of the professional aspect of this business and the current state of the industry. Unless you're already in it too deep to back out now, you are talking about starting up a venture in what is about the worst period of time to EVER start up a studio. Everyone with a friggin' soundcard and a 57 thinks they can hang a shingle out and call themselves a studio. That's insane! More studios are closing than opening due to the fact that most people that are recording, are doing it at HOME and at their leisure, rather than spending their EXTREMELY hard earned money to go into a studio.

It takes 10's of thousands of dollars to build a MODEST studio. You have to consider at least the following as the the minimum; the building, sound proofing, acoustical treatment, advertising, marketing, permits, payroll, taxes, and consumables... and that's BEFORE you even consider your first piece of gear!

You did say PRO studio... OK, here goes, but remember, YOU asked the question...

You have a computer... So? Most of the studios/owner I know have 5-6... and a server with a tape backup.

To get into a REAL pro level studio, your $10k won't even buy a SSL9080J Power supply, much less a console... Going that way, you're done before you're started.

So, maybe you gotta' look at a modest PT rig... figure $40k. You're STILL done... and you haven't bought your first microphone!

Look, be realistic. If you can't be swayed back into reality, go for QUALITY over quantity. That way, you only have to buy once... or if you do have to sell out, you will get more of your dollars back than if you buy the cheap stuff.

Start out by trying to put together a small modest project studio. You could start out with an MBox, a couple of decent pre's, a summing box and couple of LDC mic's, maybe a few 57's, a few mic cables, a couple of decent mic stands and maybe a fairly decent pair of monitors, but $10k ain't very much.

Save up about $15k more over the next year or so while you learn to track and mix. You'll need that cash for acoustical treatment or one good mic, a few more cables, a decent pre and the like.

After a few years, you can start looking at moving to a new facility that you can invest say, $125-$150/sq ft (in today's dollars) upfit of acoustic treatment and sound proofing.

And when it's all said and done, you're still only going to have a modest project studio... that's competeing with everyother project studio, that's competing with every musician that has the same equipment, or there abouts, that you do. So, get ready guys... it's probably gonna' be rough. But if you're independantly wealthy, don't mind starvin' or are about as crazy as a bed-bug, you just might make it.

Still, if I had that $10k, I'd be searching for a much better investment than this crazy industry.

Here's some pricing to give you some ideas as to what you're competition on the PRO level has:
Genelec 1035's - $15,000
Drawmer 1969ME - $3000 ea
1176's - $1600 ea
Grace 101 - $570 ea
LA2A's - $2600 ea
Digi002 - $1200
Dangerous 2-Bus - $3000
UM75 - $5000
4038 - $1500

And this list goes on and on and dollars go up and up and up.

Good luck... yer's gonna' need it.

X

ok well first of all the friend im referring to is my best friend which i have known for about 10 years now. I am 17 and he is 21 and the studio will be going into his old room in his parents house, therefore we dont have to pay for anything to keep it there. I also live in a place where there is about 2 recording studio's with a population of about 2 million. Im also a drummer and my drum teachers other student has done the same and spend 15k and has made alot of money. I also understand stocks and property's and this is where all my money will be going after it is made from the recording studio. We have a mysapce where about 10 people have already messaged me to use the recording studio even though it is not up yet. I have to say that my shot of accually making money are greater then you have made them out to be.

Ok maybe i was out of line saying a pro studio, i ment to say the best i can do with 10k and still have people pay me money to use it. Im also not going to be building any structures the money is all for accoustic foam and electronics only.

Ummmm, I think you guys are being a little too negative.

I would buy my set up. yup.

Although, I dont think id buy the beyerdynamic m160 again. The output is just to low. Id get an shure sm7 instead. And I need a better computer, now.

stickers do you use your setup just for yourself or for others also? And how much did your set up cost? What mixer to you use?

Also since 10k is alittle short for good stuff im think since most of the music where i live is rap rap rap, im going to buy one mic and after i make more money i will buy more mics for bands. Is this a good idea?

Here is all you need to do for a fine little startup studio.

You need to purchase the Alesis HD 24XR 24 track, 24-bit hard disk recorder, with FireWire adapter. $2000

You need to purchase 3 DigiMax or equivalent, 8 Channel quality microphone preamplifiers. Under $2400 for all three.

You need to purchase a 24 Channel line level monitor mixer. $500

You need to purchase a bag full of SM57/58's microphones, stands, cables, headphones, amplifiers, speakers, etc.. $4000

You'll need to purchase a gift certificate for mental health care workers for your parents. $2000

I believe all of the rock-and-roll stars in the country will be quickly lining up to record their next mega-platinum hit with you soon?

Dreaming about your next gold record??

PRICELESS!
Ms. Remy Ann David

For everything else there's MasterCard.

pow420 wrote: Ok maybe i was out of line saying a pro studio, i ment to say the best i can do with 10k and still have people pay me money to use it. Im also not going to be building any structures the money is all for accoustic foam and electronics only.

OK, now you're being a bit more realistic... but only a bit. You say there's only 2 studios in a city of 2 million. But yet, you mention that there's plenty of guys that are doing the same thing... which is it? In truth, there's probably at least 2% of the population with recording gear/nice little bedroom set-ups. That equates to 40,000 bedroom set-ups. Even if it's one half of 1%, that's 10,000!

You should be realistic at to what you're competition is out there... otherwise you are spending someone's $10,000 foolishly. Heck, if you've got $10,000 to throw away, throw it my way. I could use the money for a new pair of DPA's and a lunchbox of API's.

Look at Ms. Remy's list... ESPECIALLY the health care cost for your parents! (Just kidding... kinda')

With part of that $10k, there's one expense you had better include at least $500-$1500 for... maybe more. Get a lawyer! Set up a corporation where you have outlined EVERYTHING. This includeds the ownership of the kitchen sink.

MadTiger's absolutely dead-on about partnerships. They can work, but only when properly executed.

Look, you're talking about having all kinds of people come into your friend/partner's PARENTS house. What if a fight breaks out and the PARENT'S stuff get's broken? What if someone breaks-in and steals their stuff? Who's accepting responsibility for cleaning the carpet when someone hurls on the livingroom carpet? - or destroys the neighbor's yard with their car when the leave pissed off after a band fight, or break-up with their girlfriend/boyfriend and punches a hole in the wall? What about parking? What about client's who bring pets? Are you guys going to have defined hours of operation? What about adding a phone? Can you get commercial lines/rates in that location? What about the website - who's going to own the domain? What about internot access? ftp? The list can get pretty long and detailed... and you had better think it through.

I'm not trying to discourage you, but just want you guys to be aware that there's a WHOLE lot more to setting up a studio than the gear.

PLEASE learn one thing here and now... There is a HUGE difference between sound proofing and acoustical treatment! THEY ARE NOT THE SAME THING!

Soundproofing is just that... keeping sound isolated... e.g. keeping sound in an enclosure or keeping sound out of an enclosure. About the only way to do this is with MASS. It takes a LOT of mass to stop sound... ESPECIALLY low frequencies! Ever have a car go by a house or building and you hear the low frequencies?

When you're producing those low frequencies, you have to either stop or at least greatly attenuate most those frequencies from leaving your studio. If they can get out, they can come in. Invariably, they will come in at exactly the worst possible moment... like in the middle of a great vocal take.

Acoustic treatment on the other hand has very little to do with soundproofing. Treatment is where you add absorbtion or difussion to change the characteristics of the room's sound.

You put absorbtion and/or difussion on the walls, floors and ceilings to break up reflections and to cancel phasing issues. Acoustic "foam" is one type of absorbtive treatment among MANY types. You don't want to just slap some foam up and call it done. You need to look into this a bit more... A LOT more.

I would strongly encourage you to head down to the acoustics forum and check out the FAQ's and go through the search engine to learn as much as you can BEFORE you start. Nothing will eat up money faster than a poor decision made in haste.

Again, you are attempting to do this on a commercial basis. That opens you up to a whole different level of liability. If a fire were to occurr, and you failed to use fire rated or fire retardent materials you are going to be sued like no one's been sued in a long time.

Which brings up insurance. Look long and hard at your business insurance. Get partnership insurance. If something happens to either one of you, how will you make payments on the bills of the company? How will you be able to even write checks or in the case of some states, can you even make the deposits to the accounts? A good lawyer and insurance agent are must have's.

Another thing you want to do is find a good independant accountant.

Of course, since you are under-age, your parents will have to sign everything for you. So, hopefully they'll keep you from sinking yourself into too much of a money-pit that might kill-off an otherwise productive member of society.

X

$10,000?

2 mics I'm not ashamed of and a dual pre I'm not ashamed of.....

That's about it.

I also think you need to temper your "If you build it, they will come" expectations.

I don't have a lot more than $10K invested in my setup, and I have some respect around town. I'm not recording rock bands, but that has more to do with the crowd I hang out with than anything else.

It's taken me YEARS to get to where I am. I did a lot of work for no charge. I spent 6 months and MANY MANY hours mixing my first multitrack recording just getting a feel for how to work with the stuff. It takes more than gear to make decent recordings.

I know your goal is to make money, and while "a lot of money" to a 17 year old is not the same as "a lot of money" to a 40+ parent of two homeowner, I'd never tell ANYONE that I've made money at this.

Assuming you have the talent and the ears for recording, it's still going to take you a while to get your arms wrapped around this recording thing. There's a lot more to it than you realize, and you're not going to know what I mean until two years down the road when you look back at what you were doing when you first started ... trust me.

Not only that, but once you get into this recording thing you'll start learning about different goodies - sofware, hadware, microphones, etc - that you'll decide you just GOTTA' have. Kiss your profits goodbye.

$10k is a lot of money - especially for a couple of young people. What if the parents decide a studio in the house is not what they expected and shut you down? Do you have another place to record? What if one of you decides it's no fun - do you have a plan (contract?) on who gets what stuff, or what it will take to buy out your buddy?

I'm not trying to discourage you - I love recording and I got started on a pretty small budget - but I've talked to MANY musicians who've been impressed with my work - every time I see them they say they're going to be in touch soon about recording, and the years go by. I think they're sincere - they're just busy. Recording an album is a big committment for everyone involved, and many musicians don't have a lot of disposable income.

If you're sure you're going through with this, setup your studio and plan to record a couple of bands for free - or for very little - and use that opportunity to learn how to record and how to mix. Take your time and learn to do it right. I think the fact that you're a drummer is an advantage - recording drums is a challenge - you can learn that on your own kit on your own time.

IMHO - if you want to record because you think you'll make money, stop now. If you want to record, and will record regardless of profits, then you've got a chance. You might get your investment back after a few years.

ok well, first of all my friends parents are gone from 6am-8pm every day except sunday so them being home is not a problem, my dad is an CPA so ive got that down. Me and my friend have built plenty of websites in our day so thats no problem either. Me and him are also going to be taking sound recording at the local university in a few weeks for 2 semesters and we have a friend who graduated on a sound engineering major and is willing to teach us everything for a mear 6 dollars an hour. Hes leeving in a year so we only have him for that long. Im going to buy a few books on sound proofing a accoustics to do it all properly. I never said that 10k and buying the gear and telling people i have a studio was going to attract them. I just wanted to know what gear i should get with the 10k nothing more. Im think since my city is all rap then im going to use the 10k and only buy one mic at first so i can buy better other stuff and then after i make some money i will buy more mics. Another thing is, i dont really have to pay for much for another 5 years except food... Im going to be in a paid for dorm and everything else paid for. The 10k is just for me the get off the ground and i want you to give me a list that i can upgrade as i go along.

pow420 wrote: ok well first of all the friend im referring to is my best friend which i have known for about 10 years now. I am 17 and he is 21 and the studio will be going into his old room in his parents house, therefore we dont have to pay for anything to keep it there. I also live in a place where there is about 2 recording studio's with a population of about 2 million. Im also a drummer and my drum teachers other student has done the same and spend 15k and has made alot of money. I also understand stocks and property's and this is where all my money will be going after it is made from the recording studio. We have a mysapce where about 10 people have already messaged me to use the recording studio even though it is not up yet. I have to say that my shot of accually making money are greater then you have made them out to be.

Ok maybe i was out of line saying a pro studio, i ment to say the best i can do with 10k and still have people pay me money to use it. Im also not going to be building any structures the money is all for accoustic foam and electronics only.

The problem is this. You can't make pro recordings with anything less than pros use, including experience. Ask yourself this: What reason do people have to come to us? It is the question that any business owner has to ask. Who needs you? Why? How much can they afford to pay? After they are gone, who else will come, and how will they know where to find us? Then you have to be legal. You have to get yourself an attorney, bank acount, insurance, make sure that your house is zoned for business in your community, look at the traffic pattern limitations, etc. It is not as easy as buying what everyone else with 10k or good credit could get at guitar center. The cat is out of the bag. You have to have the chops and industry contacts that will cause people to seek you out, no matter where you are. You will not draw business to a bedroom. Not REAL business that won't come rip you off when you aren't home.

like i said we have a friend who is going to help us in the begining and he has a major in sound engineering. My dad is a CPA and an atorney so im fine there. There is always someone in the house because they have a maid so no one is going to jack us and even if they do these people are extremely rich and wouldnt care at all. Why? It has happened and they didnt care. I think you all think im a crazy idiot kid with some money and not smart enough to do it right but i never said i wasnt going to do all of that i just ask for some assistence on picking equitment out but i thank you for the other assistence also.

pow420 wrote: like i said we have a friend who is going to help us in the begining and he has a major in sound engineering. My dad is a CPA and an atorney so im fine there. There is always someone in the house because they have a maid so no one is going to jack us and even if they do these people are extremely rich and wouldnt care at all. Why? It has happened and they didnt care. I think you all think im a crazy idiot kid with some money and not smart enough to do it right but i never said i wasnt going to do all of that i just ask for some assistence on picking equitment out but i thank you for the other assistence also.

The point remains. Who needs YOU? I wish someone had asked me this stuff when I invested my first $100k. In my market $100k is not enough. Not times 5! I have a crap load of gear, great facilities, but I am like every other studio in the world...I am not doing this for money. It is because I like the work. There is more money in the property, which is why many are getting out of business.

What music are you planning to do? What is your clientele? What are their expectations? How much will they pay? WILL they pay? This determines your gear list.

If your clientele are rappers wanting "beats", then you may not need to spend anything more than a laptop, a sampler, a large CD library of vintage R&B. Since these people that will come to you will have little money, then they can expect to get less.

You have to tell us more. You have to know more yourself.

Your friend may be the hottest thing since audio schools, but a degree doesn't mean anything. I know many, many people from Full Sail and other schools that do not know how to use a compressor after spending 4 years and 60k! Some of them can't get a job anywhere, because they don't know HOW TO MAKE A RECORD. That is the big thing. Not how to operate or own gear. That is only part of the equation.

Forgive us man, but bedroom studio does not = money. If anything, people are going to assume that because you are there, and not in a commercial space, that you don't have your chops.

Bedrooms = poor acoustics (usually), unless you have a palace with 18' ceilings and lots-o-space. I would say $4.5k on room acoustics, $5k on gear, $.5k on AC and UPS.

There are many articles in back issues of EQ on how to equip a small home studio. Again, it will be a hobbiest studio, not a pro studio. You are talking 10k, not hundreds of thousands or millions.

Holy sheet Batman! I agree.

RemyRAD wrote: Holy sheet Batman! I agree.

Uhhh... Remy... you've been sniffin' that fast forwarding 2" tape again, ain't cha' girl? :-?

I think the kid's just got it in his head that he's got it all figured out...

I was gonna' comment on the false expectations, the lack of grasp on reality, etc.

Then I thought about it...

I'm wasting my breath... as are most of us I'm afraid.

Let em' go ahead and jump in the pool... they'll jump in the deep end without looking... hehehe, the sharks are smelling the chum...

In 6 months... I'll be looking over their auctions on eBay. Hopefully they'll have a piece or two I can snag at .10 on the dollar.

If they survive... good for them. If they don't... I, along with a lot of the other treacherous ol' geezer's will be here to skarf up the good stuff at a real nice savings...

Go for it kids

MadMax wrote: I think the kid's just got it in his head that he's got it all figured out...

Yep - there's not much a bunch of grown-ups can say that an entusiastic young'un will choose to listen to - and if he's got the chops we might be listening to his work on the Radio in a few years. 8-)

thank you for saving me from a bad investment i now see how dumb it really is since it is not my passion but instead drums are. Im now going to use this 10k and put it in stocks like i originally wanted to do. The only reason i was going to make a studio was because i wanted to be able to record my bands records and make money at the same time but i feel the need to wait till i have more money and build a studio for just my band. Thank you all for the info it was worth it. :)

pow420,

There's no reason you CAN't build a nice little bedroom project studio to record your own music... none at all. $10k is a GREAT budget for that level of a project studio!

It just unreasonable to think that you could build any kind of facility that will satisfy the needs of other PAYING customers with so little money... at least based upon the experience of those of us who are already working at running studios at, or just below, the level that you think you want to operate. It just takes so much more money and time than you can imagine.

If you have the real desire to start recording, do it. It's never been more affordable... and you can get very good results with the gear that's available. Go back and read Remy's post. A good list.

If you want to test the waters, contact one of the commercial facilities in town. Talk to the owner and book a 3-5 song EP for your band. Explain to the owner that you're interested in watching the engineer track and mix to see if it's something you have a real interest in.

Start small. Learn the basics of the craft. If the bug bites... you'll be a gear slut for life... like the rest of us old' codgers (that EXCLUDES Remy!)... then eventually, your GAS will yield the $50k-$200k worth of gear it takes to open a real commercial facility.

Then, as zemlin says... we're liable to be listening to your mixes on the rasdio someday.

sheet wrote:

The point remains. Who needs YOU? I wish someone had asked me this stuff when I invested my first $100k. In my market $100k is not enough. Not times 5! I have a crap load of gear, great facilities, but I am like every other studio in the world...I am not doing this for money. It is because I like the work. There is more money in the property, which is why many are getting out of business.

What music are you planning to do? What is your clientele? What are their expectations? How much will they pay? WILL they pay? This determines your gear list.

If your clientele are rappers wanting "beats", then you may not need to spend anything more than a laptop, a sampler, a large CD library of vintage R&B. Since these people that will come to you will have little money, then they can expect to get less.

You have to tell us more. You have to know more yourself.

Your friend may be the hottest thing since audio schools, but a degree doesn't mean anything. I know many, many people from Full Sail and other schools that do not know how to use a compressor after spending 4 years and 60k! Some of them can't get a job anywhere, because they don't know HOW TO MAKE A RECORD. That is the big thing. Not how to operate or own gear. That is only part of the equation.

Forgive us man, but bedroom studio does not = money. If anything, people are going to assume that because you are there, and not in a commercial space, that you don't have your chops.

Bedrooms = poor acoustics (usually), unless you have a palace with 18' ceilings and lots-o-space. I would say $4.5k on room acoustics, $5k on gear, $.5k on AC and UPS.

There are many articles in back issues of EQ on how to equip a small home studio. Again, it will be a hobbiest studio, not a pro studio. You are talking 10k, not hundreds of thousands or millions.

Honestly, I don't think one needs to spend more 20k to have the gear to make pro recordings or just even excellent demo recordings. Although, more importantly, you do need a good space. In most cases a large rectangular room with high ceilings will work (like the main room of a small chruch if that makes sense) Anyways, a lot of bands just want to cut "good" sounding demos. Can someone record an excellent or just a very good demo on 10k + a good computer(2k),roughly 12k of gear and decent room? Yes of course. Pow420 has a space (good or not) and overhead will be minimum so he wont have to charge a lot of dough.

My rates are low since I dont have that much overhead. To promote, I do live sound on the weekends and do 2 track live recordings from the board to a CDr to give to the band and I give "good" bands my business card along with the live CD. This gets me business because I have done some killer two track live recordings from the board.

So as long as Pow210 keeps his rates fair, does a good job and finds a realistic way marketing himself, I dont see a problem of him making some extra cash.

Sheet does make a good point about people graduating from recording schools. Typically, that doesn't mean crap. Expereince is far more important. I spent most of my time earning my bachelors in "Sound Recording Technologies" at the University of Massachusetts at Lowell in the back of the room reading various recording mags cuz I already knew what a damn compressor does and how to use it or what EQ does, or delay or verb. My point is learning the in and outs of the recording process cant fully be taught in a class room along couple of school projects. It's just a starting point.

He never did get that list......

I'm late as usual but always ready....

10K ....That'll get you a decent mid-level setup that would fit nicely into a bedroom. Get a good snake so you can stretch out into different areas of the house for your bands' sessions.

10K... Will get you the ability to start to learn how.....

10K....I've got that in my board(used) and my recorder....

I have a Doctorate in Soundology from the Institute of Sore Ears,Hard Knocks and Diminishing Returns....But I run a damn fine session and make great sounding recordings.

You CANNOT become a professional Engineer until you've learned the difference between Single-Malt and Blended.

its a rule.

I think I'll just go and blend my Fiddich around in stereo?? No? They call a Black Hole a "Singularity". What's the difference between that and Glen?? I usually like to make live recordings but when they don't go right I get Livet over that!

It's not a tumor (Austrian accent)
it's a single malt Scotch!
Ms. Remy Ann David

I think my dogs done??

Wow Remy...I think thou hast partaken of a little too much of that which comes in bottles from the Gaelic lands...

Okay Pow420...here's my take on it (Y'all listen up now, I'm only going to say this once....or maybe twice...)

You can have a successful home studio on $10K!! Yup, you can. But, like Mr. Clinton before me, let's get into a little semantics here.

Define 'Successful'.

If by success, you mean lots of money, then no. However, if by success you mean the ability to do what you love and maybe take enough out for some beer (that's ROOT BEER for you young man!) and pizza every once in a while all whilst getting to enjoy good music (or sometimes bad music), then go for it.

What you will find is that, after your initial investment of $10K, you will find yourself saying..."Ooo...I could get better sound if I got mic 'X' or preamp 'Y' or converter 'Z'" and so on. It's a never ending and vicious cycle.

My solution is, budget, budget, budget. Your dad can probably help you out with this. I set aside so much money for gear purchases, so much money for overhead, so much for salaries/wages of employees and then finally I occassionally pay myself (although, I actually pay myself, as since I'm the president of an LLC, it's a little difficult to pay myself).

I have a LOT more than $10K invested, but I started with a LOT less. I now average over $50K of business yearly. How much do I get paid??? About $5k or less out of that... :cry:

Feel free to get started and enjoy yourself. I can't stress enough though that you must clearly delineate which equipment and such each party is responsible for. That way, when you guys decide to go your opposite directions (and this WILL happen), there's no arguing whose U87 is whose...

Remy's list is good, though my take would be a little different.

Here it goes -

Cables - $1k
Acoustic Treatment $1.5K
RME Fireface - $1.5K
Rode K2, Beyer M130, Beyer M160, 2 SM57, 1 SM58 - $2K
Summit 2BA-221, Grace 101 - $1k
Neumann TLM 193 - Used - $1k
UAD-1 - $1K
Powered monitors (your choice) $1K

You'll probably need some other things too, but that's when you start offering "different services" on the corner of 13th and K Streets on Weekend Evenings....

BTW - what area are you in??? We're all curious and you didn't finish filling out your profile.

In any case, your zeal is appreciated by all who have posted here. We've all been in your position more or less at one point, but we've all had our ambitions, hopes and dreams shoved down our throats so far that we're crapping fluffy white clouds of despair now...

Enjoy!

J. 8-)

Ok... everyone can hate on me after this BUT...

I think you really want to experience recording music. It sounds like you have a real passion for playing, writing, recrding etc.

Ya know what I think... DO IT!

BUY YOUR GEAR!!!

What's wrong with all of you on here? Seriously, how did you all get started? I cannot believe how much parade pissing I just read here. I haven't been on this board for ages and I was searching for some mix bus compressors suggestions and I stumbled upon this thread.

Everyone sounds JADED. Fuckin JADED real bad.

Ya know, if they don't make oodles of money - SO WHAT! Life isn't about making money. Life is about expriences, both GOOD and BAD. And if these two wanna give it a shot then I think they should.

LISTEN you two...
I started by doing the same thing as you mentioned - Home studio. Maybe mine was a little different as I strictly wokred on Hip-Hop but I remember reading that would be the way you would go for now, SO... I will tell you from my experience...

I started with less then 10k! I bought a sequencer, a sampler, a mixer, a mic and i practiced my fuckin ass off at writing beats. I put my beats on tapes (yes, it was that long ago) and i gave them to everyone around. And you know what? I was turning away emcees left and right - FOR YEARS after that.

I ended up writing, mixing, recording music for all the hot demos in the hood. PERIOD.

So, with technology so advanced I think you guys have a fair shot in getting your shit together. It's not gonna happen over night and it's not gonna end at $10k but it is a start!

As long as you realize you are doing this because you LOVE IT and secondly to make money, then you are well on the road to happiness and gear addiciotn! lol

Here's my suggestions to get you goin for hip hop demos that will sound great enough to get you more clients and get your cients noticed!

- DAW software - Digital Performer - $600
- UAD card (cheap one) - $400
- Microphone - MA200 - $1000
- Mic pre - Great River (2 channel so you can track external drum machines or whatevr vesides just tracking your vocals) - $2100
- Monitors - KRK V8II - $1000 pair
- Drum machine - Battery (the BEST drum machine plug in) - $200
- Audio interface - RME 400 - $1000
- Monitor control - Mackie Big Knob - $300
- Sampler - Kontakt 2 - $400
- Headphones - AKG K141 (2 pairs) - $200
- Mastering Software - Bias Peak Pro XT5 - $1000
- Compressor - Drawmer 1968 (st bus) - $1900

There... well, about $100 over budget but when you speak to the gear pimp he's gonna cut this price down by almost 10% so you will save a few bucks on the above and then get yourself two large foam pieces - 1 for behind the speakers and one for your cieling above your seating...

take this list and do what ya have to... change it around, whatever... this is a pretty decent starter to get good quality work done as long as you can learn how to use your tools.

Always remember man, people in the dance music world are selling records and CDs and most of them are bedroom producers, and sooner or later they get picked up for their skills.

Hope this helps.

Stay inspired man.

Well I Have around 5-7k on my equipment hahaha including computer but my multitrack recordings dont suck and I have recorded 2 Bands in 1 year is not that bad for me at all hahahaha I got this stuff because I study sound engineer and I wanted to try some softwares and see how the things work on a DAW. Ive learned a lot more on my little home project which I like to call FreakStudios haha me and my friends call it that. Than on my University. Of course I Couldnt understand anything if i didnt go to school hahaha but it helps me learn more or more Deeply.

I mean Ive Recorded Demo cds of my band and stuff and then i sell them I dont really make money per say but helps me pay for my current equipment.

I think we all here agree that its a ton of fun learning to mix master and record multi track and of course have your little Freaky studio like mine hehehehe.

If I were you Id buy some hardware and stuff for the studio maybe not all just what you need to record your band "ok". And have fun with it.

It TOOK ME A LOT OF WORK to get my things I worked my ass off seriously LITERALLY!!! hahahaha jk. Because im not from a wealthy family or anything. but I work for what i want. I LOVE RECORDING even Though I know I might not work recording per say. but I will Always record.

power trip?

Hey guys...i appreciate this forum and all the insight that I have gotten from the people that take part in it. It sure has helped me get my feet off the ground and helped me to understand a lot about the beginnings of a studio. I still haven't caught on to a lot of peoples harsh responses to newbies questions. Instead of answering questions a lot of people take on the responsibility of sharing their "professional" knowledge which is fine if you are going to be helpful but I see a few people who talk just for an ego boost...or at least it seems that way. The way I see it...there are people making quality home recordings for 10,000 or less - some stuff sounding better then expensive studio projects I have heard. If you don't agree that a quality recording can be achieved on a limited budget...that is cool with me but I have plenty of friends who are recording in their homes and making a financial killing doing it. POW- I think 10,000 is a safe budget to get things going and will create some opportunities for decent cash flow. I think investing more than 10,000k before you really know what you are doing would be a bad move. Right now I have invested 10-20K in my studio and I make enough to take care of myself and the longer you do it the more your clientele grows. Oh yeah...and don't forget do it because you love and appreciate art and the expression of art. I'd be happy just living month to month and doing what I love. You are still pretty young so you may want to think a bit more before investing in to a studio...I know when I was between the ages of 17-22 I changed my mind almost weekly about what I really wanted to do with life. Good luck with the studio!

Ben
http://www.sidewalkprophets.com
http://www.myspace.com/sidewalkprophets
http://www.iheartfatkids.com

Okay kid, you've gotten lots of advice.

You've had gear lists thrown around.

There have been many attempts, some successful, some not, at humor.

So here's some advice from good ol' Uncle Bob...

Define your mission. What do you want to do? What are you trying to accomplish? Where do you want to be five years from now? Ten? Twenty?

Having figured out all of the above, figure out your fall back position for when everything goes to hell.

I started out, as many did, wanting to be a rock star, whatever that is. I found out early on that I didn't have "it", whatever "it" is, but I was a terrific keyboard player, a solid singer and a great arranger. I became musical director for various bands, eventually working my way up to a well known act playing venues like the Appollo, Westbury Music Fair, Carnagie Hall and various arenas, stadiums and outdoor festivals around the country. I also did a lot of session work and kibbitzed with every engineer I met. I put together a home studio and increased my arranging and engineering skills.

When arthritis curtailed my performing career I flipped to the other side of the glass and things got tough! They got easier when I started to specialize; I have a knack for getting the best out of young vocalists and large vocal groups. I went back to school in my early forties to upgrade my studio skills and an instructor suggested that I get into sound design because a) I have a talent for it, b) there's more money to be made and c) you work with people who actually have money.

I upgraded my studio (two very quiet floating rooms in my basement) with a new Mac, loads of software, video monitoring and about $5k in new speakers. My areas of specialization are now dialog editing and music editing although by default I do everything else on most projects. I'm still weak on re-recording (that's what they call mixing in the film biz) but my mixes are solid and listenable.

The point of this story is that you should remember that things are not going to go the way that you planned them. I had a fall back position when my performing days ended and have found a niche that, while not exactly making me rich, has at least given me a satisfying career. There were a number of "real" jobs along the way as well which gave me solid business experience to support my creative side.

So think things through before you act. Learn from others as much as you can - even negative lessons can be important. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. Have a financial cushion set aside for when everything falls apart. Take care of your friends, take care of your family - they're great to have around when the crap hits the fan. It's hard to make friends, it's easy to make enemies, so watch what you say and do; don't burn bridges behind you. (One of my most lucrative projects and some great references came via a friend from 25 years ago.)

Good luck and keep the faith!

Uncle Bob,

You offer wise and sound advise. Many would do well to listen and learn from your wisdom.

However, a few of the later posters were quick to point out the harshness of tone that a few of us took with the young newb.

I'll try to be direct and to the point as I can... in a rant.

Anytime I see some post about a firm cash amount of either $10k, $15k, or $20k, I'm triggered to respond fairly agressively. Why? Because most of the time, it's a student in some class that doesn't want to do their homework assignment for themselves.

We (collectively) have no set firm budget. How can you? We all know that there's no set spending limit. We just have to scrape and save and do whatever we have to do to get enough funding for the next piece of gear.

If I'm wrong, I'm almost apologetic... almost.

You wanna work in this industry? Get ready, it's potentially one of the most ruthless environments to work in I've seen. It's also one of the most rewarding... that's what often brings out the best, and worst in folks.

Look at the fact that when a student comes into one of the forums and wants someone who's gone, or is going, through the process of putting a studio together, to do the work for the student. Is that really the best side of someone wanting to be a part of this industry? I don't think so... and as a matter of fact, I know it's not and I'd just as soon discourage this type of individual from being part of this industry.

There's already a glut of lowball gear out there... there's a glut of wanna' be's out there. There IS a professional side of the craft of recording and mixing music/audio. There's a profound amount of freedom that is now available to musicians to create their own music. This is the best of times, this is the worst of times.

The disparity of those who really seek to get the reward from making their own music is lost in the noise of the posers and wanna be's. The vast majority of that ilk think this is a cakewalk to fame and fortune. This is only true for a select few... a very select few... that quite often end up paying a higher price for this fame and fortune than they thought possible. The rest of us that are truely dedicated to doing this at some level of professionalism (part-time or full-time) know that the reward is when you actually produce something that is worthwhile and of value to the client and the public at large. The rest of em' can go suck eggs for all I care. Then you add an additional level of noise from students that either can't or don't want to think for themselves.

Am I jaded? Well yeah. I've been screwed, glued and tatooed too many times. Stick around on this earth long enough and you too shall be jaded. But, that doesn't mean that I think that everyone in this industry is an idiot, or otherwise... just a LOT of em'.

I'll help ANYONE. I'll pass on every bit of information and experience I have aquired. I'm more than happy to do so. Just be honest and sincere in what you are doing, and DON'T BS me.

Now that a few others have chimed in, did any of you notice that most of us "jaded old-farts" did indeed offer the support of our experience when POW changed the tone of the direction he was willing to take? Again, if you are realistic in your goals, a budget of $500 is a good start to putting a studio together... if you are realistic and willing to work hard and are open minded as to what you are going to experience and what you are going to be able to produce.

It ain't all about the gear...

/RANT

Jaded surly ol' cus,
Max

go for it

Dude go for it, spend the 10k, I know people who spent less on home studios and made good recordings, the groups/individuals they recorded are out there gigging and doing shows and selling those CDs at their shows. So maybe the recording weren't made in big high priced pro studio but it hasn't stop them from selling them and people enjoying them. And maybe they had to be a bit creative about how they recorded them with such limited means, but they did it and they sound fine.
If I was a 17 year old kid with a band and wanted to record, and there was a big high dollar pro studio run by some old guys charging 100s bucks and hour, or your little studio with some other cool 17 year kids trying to make recordings for cheap, I'd go to the studio that the kids are running, of course.
If nothing else I'll bet in a year or two you know a shit load about recording and running a business.
Besides what's 10k, I'm sure we've all pissed away more than that in our lives with nothing to show for it.