Beautiful!

Thanks, audiokid.

I appreciate you taking the time to listen. :)

It was a fun track to work on, anytime I can work with real players with real instruments, it takes things to a different level.

Sometimes I get so bogged down in the virtual soft-synth / instrument world, or doing all the overdubs myself, that I think the feeling in the music gets lost from time to time.

very little overdubs were done, while I didn't dislike my original tracking cue vocal, I did end up re-tracking it, as I was kind of writing the part as I went along.

**edit here: I remember now that I did in fact overdub this several times... this was a month before I had throat surgery to remove nodes on my vocal chords, so there are parts that needed fixed because of vocal breaking

The RCA microphone was borrowed, a dear friend of mine was happy to oblige - as long as I put my house and wife up as collateral. LOL

It didn't take long to dial up the tone I was after, it was pretty much immediate, and with the exception of a little top-end presence boost to get more of the "air" that I wanted, along with grabbing the rasp that is inherant in my voice, it was pretty much an "instant" tone thing from the get go.

I don't own the Grace preamp either, that was also borrowed... but I was very happy with the results.

Thanks again for listening. :)

DonnyThompson, post: 397753 wrote: Thanks, audiokid.

I appreciate you taking the time to listen. :)

It was a fun track to work on, anytime I can work with real players with real instruments, it takes things to a different level.

Sometimes I get so bogged down in the virtual soft-synth / instrument world, or doing all the overdubs myself, that I think the feeling in the music gets lost from time to time.

That's an understatement!

Very little overdubbing was done on this session, we had the benefit of isolation rooms for every player. The only overdubs were the B3, the strings, and while I didn't dislike my original tracking cue vocal, I did end up
re-tracking it, as I was kind of writing the part as I went along.

Many of us do it like that now. A DAW has made writing so easy. The ease of capturing the emotional content as it comes out has been the best part of our DAW domain. What a tool for composers and song writing.

The RCA microphone was borrowed, a dear friend of mine was happy to oblige - as long as I put my house and wife up as collateral. LOL

I can see the wife going but the HOUSE! ...

It didn't take long to dial up the tone I was after, it was pretty much immediate, and with the exception of a little top-end presence boost to get more of the "air" that I wanted, along with grabbing the rasp that is inherant in my voice, it was pretty much an "instant" tone thing from the get go.

I don't own the Grace preamp either, that was also borrowed... but I was very happy with the results.

Thanks again for listening. :)

One of my goals is to track and entire project all with ribbons. I love them.

Thanks for sharing this. Nice to have you with us on RO!

Excellent! Not just the vocal mic sound but the entire thing. Thank you for sharing this with us.

I would not have guessed that it was a 44. I would expect a 44 to sound darker than this.

FWIW, I have been using a 77D recently. I have had an old one kicking around here for a long time. Last spring, I sent it to AEA for a new ribbon. When I got it back, I was very pleasantly surprised at how good it sounds. My wife sings & I had been using an AT3035 for her. We both prefer the 77D. Most of the time I don't use any eq other than a high-pass.

I also have had some very good results recently using a BK-5 on brass (a bugle).

I don't have a 44 and it has been over 40 years since the last time I worked with one. I believe that the 44 has a larger ribbon than my 77D & BK5. I would love to try one sometime.

Just an assumption on the mastering, but another reason ribbons are so awesome is they take EQ well right to the mastering stage. I can clearly hear that the mastering added a nice sizzle to the top end without creating the ess'y characteristics that often come from condensers.

audiokid, post: 397776 wrote: Just an assumption on the mastering, but another reason ribbons are so awesome is they take EQ well right to the mastering stage. I can clearly hear that the mastering added a nice sizzle to the top end without creating the ess'y characteristics that often come from condensers.

That's a great observation... and one I hadn't made myself.

I am lucky enough to know a very talented Mastering Engineer. I don't know exactly what he did on the track EQ wise, but I was very happy with the results ...I'm not an M.E. in any way, shape or form LOL so I sent it to a real guy. I know that he did mention that he enjoyed working on the track.

I would not have guessed that it was a 44. I would expect a 44 to sound darker than this.

Well your guess - as well as your ears - is actually right on the money. It did sound much darker on the original unprocessed track.

I didn't have a variety of ribbon mics to choose from, LOL... so I used the only one I had at my disposal.

I ended up adding quite a bit in the 3-4k area for presence. Don't get me wrong, I loved the dark sound of the original track... but, I wanted to get a little more presence to grab the rasp in my voice (it's inherent) without having to sacrifice the warmth at the same time. The thing I loved about working with that mic is that I was able to add the presence, without - as audiokid mentioned - adding harshness or sibilance at the same time.
If I had used the same EQ sculpting on a condenser that I did on the ribbon, I'm positive it would have ended up brittle and harsh.

I almost ended up tracking this with a condenser. The ribbon was kind of a last minute thing...and since I had a friend who had one, I went that route. In the end I was very glad I did.

I also have had some very good results recently using a BK-5 on brass (a bugle).

I've never used the BK5, although I've seen it used many times. Can you share what your mic technique was when you recorded the bugle, as far as placement and distance? Would it be a hassle for you to post a sample? I'd love to hear how a ribbon sounds on a brass instrument.

If budget would allow, I'd love to have a whole collection of ribbons. As the years have gone by I find I like the sound of them much more than most industry standard condensers, at least for what I do musically.

I'm not going to throw out my U89 or my 414's, but I sure do love the warmth and silk of ribbon mics. ;)

Thanks again for taking the time to listen, guys.

-D.

Grr i need to update my browser to use soundcloud now days.

Donny that was absolutely fabulous, beautiful. What recording and the art of recording is all about when you leave out all of the science blah blah, superior specifications, ultimate clarity cleanliness BS. Now listen to these tracks good kids because this guy knows what he's doing and this is what it is all about! This is real audio engineering. This is real talent. This takes real practice and real work and is not accomplished by a single plug-in. And this is why there has been such a huge resurgence of ribbon microphone technology. The oldest high quality microphone technology, in existence. A microphone technology created around 1928. Even before we had electrical recording capabilities. It's like hearing a fine violin on the Mozart fourth violin Concerto and not a Stratocaster with a tube Fender. Which might in its own right, sound interesting but highly unorthodox in its delivery method. Especially as a solo instrument in front of an 80 piece orchestra. That would sound like...? Well I would sound like most of the recordings I hear everybody else trying to make with their Chinese condenser microphones and somebody's $150 lollipop USB computer audio interface that was on sale. You don't get these kinds of recordings that way.

That's what I've been trying to tell everybody since we got PCM digital recording back in the early 1980s! The condenser microphones were far more important for cutting into lacquer and rolling on analog tape. And with digital, I feel it's important to throw the baby out with the bathwater LOL.

Yeah, I was wondering where that top end came from on your BK 44? And it was the mastering engineer, very nice. And yes, the 44 is quite a bit darker than a short geometry 77 or Beyer M-130/160. The sound of your 44 on that track made me think it may have been an active one? Lots of folks doing interesting mods today ya know?

Conversely and without any Mastering Engineer, I got this with a Omni 414, after midnight, without headphones, with a cue speaker, on the gravel in front of the garage and behind my truck LOL. This had been an all day tracking and overdubbing event in this guys two-car garage and was used as the garage and never a studio. And the only difference between this and the new Foo Fighters release is the DA-88's instead of the Studer. And all first-generation 16-bit converters. Which gives it that nice rasp (inherent in 16-bit, 44.1 kHz) LOL.

So mine sounds like this from 1993 on a 414 vocal microphone with old-school all transistor microphone preamps and all going through a VCA before it hits the two track bus. And even that's going through a VCA LOL.

These of course are MP3's from the.wav Masters that were transferred on an Digi design Audio Media III card back in 1996, via early useless software. And this was mixed at the end of the tracking session when I was quite burnt out. We tracked, overdubbed, mixed, all within 16+ hours, an entire album. And these are a couple of cuts.

[MEDIA=soundcloud]remyrad/earthbelowslide-in

And there should be a second cut also from the same session. This is all analog except for the PCM recording and storage.
Mx. Remy Ann David

We tracked, overdubbed, mixed, all within 16+ hours, an entire album.

Yup. Been there, done that, although I wouldn't recommend it. LOL

Thanks for the kind words Remy, I really appreciate your feedback and taking the time to listen.

I really enjoyed the audio you posted... the first thing that struck me was the separation that you managed without it sounding separated.
(I know that may sound like a confusing statement to some, but I know you get what I mean)...Nice definition, and very nicely all glued together... I'm assuming, besides your skills as a cooker, that the 1176 and the dbx 165's played a part in that... ( I loved those 165's... thumb)

So here's what I'm thinking...

The ribbon mic I used on that track wasn't mine...it was borrowed from a friend. I've been out of the 24/7/365 side of the biz for so long now, I've kinda lost track with what's hot and what the best bang for the buck is in regard to newer mics, especially ribbons.

If I was looking at spending around $600 for a ribbon that's primary use would be my vocals (but also well rounded enough to do acoustic, electric and nylon guitars, as well as other other uses like ambient/room miking), based on what you heard vocally in the song I posted, what would be your recommendation, or am I being foolish to think that I could get what I want for that price?

Also, I know that nearly all the old vintage ribbons were Figure 8, is that still the case or has that changed?

I guess my question is, What ribbon you would get if you had around $600 to spend, or ...would you wait til you had more $ than that?

-d.

DonnyThompson, post: 397797 wrote: Can you share what your mic technique was when you recorded the bugle, as far as placement and distance? Would it be a hassle for you to post a sample?

The microphone was approx. 3' from the bugle. The room was fairly dead. The microphone was pointed at the instrument and at an angle of about 45 degrees from the axis of the instrument.....I tried to place it so that it was not directly in the path of the sound coming from the horn.

I'm sorry, I can't share the track at this time.

I should also add that when I say that I got good results what I really mean is that it sounded good to me without using a lot of equalization.

Again, thank you for sharing your excellent performance.

Hey Donny,
I had a few hours to mess around in the studio today so I thought it would be fun to load your beautiful song into my hybrid rig and tweak it for about 5 mins total. Makes good conversation to say the least and I'm an aspiring "something in this business" so I do all I can to improve my skills.

I heard some things the other day in the mix and thought they would be fun to try and fix. I am a big fan of George Benson. I studied his playing for years. Man, you have his sound down on this! I love the riff you do in this.
Anyway, I felt there was too much sizzle around 12k, a dip in the mids that IMHO, took out important energy in the whole song and a bit of a howl in the 270hz area so I tweaked, ran it through my analog rig and have it online if you are interested?

Since we are talking about ribbons, as mentioned a few posts back, I feel there was about 8db of extra top end on the Vox that I would have not added on the ribbon but whats remarkable, if this was a condenser, it would be ripping our ears big time. Ribbons are the greatest and I think everyone should have a few in the locker.
I pulled out 6db in the recording and there is still too much info there. Not sure where its all coming from but I thought it would be interesting to talk about it.

Absolutely! Upload it!

bummer, I can't access soundcloud all of a sudden, can you?

No problem accessing it here, tree.

working now. stand bye...

I'll check back later... I had back surgery yesterday so I can only sit in this position for so long, but I really do look forward to hearing what you've done with it. ;)

Here the first one that was simply eq'd a bit. I used a Fabfilter Pro L on it. I've been playing with this for a week, its the best limiter I've found so far. Just posting this as a FYI. It does kill some transients but overall, its pretty impressive. Most limiters I'm tried don't get close to this one. I think the next best would the the Weiss DS1 which is 8 grand. This is 250 bucks lol.

Got to run. I'll post a few loops after I make supper.

[MEDIA=soundcloud]audiokid/donnymaster2

Also Note the area near the end, lyrics: How much "I miss you" everyday. 1:34 ) I was able to clean that one hot spot up quite a bit without effecting the rest of the track. Sequoia 12 is incredible software.

audiokid, post: 397868 wrote: bummer, I can't access soundcloud all of a sudden, can you?

I have not been able to for a few day maybe a week now.
I get a message telling me I need to upgrade my browser.
Not something I am willing to do at this time.
: (

That sucks Pan! It came back on for me right away. Soundcloud upgraded their system, and its way better! You can compare tracks side by side now without reloading them back and forth. For me, this is a big step forward. Its a lot smother too.

FWIW, I notice the newer browsers utilize java better. These are interactive functions that you don't know are missing or see on older browsers.

Yea my G5 is not going to cut it, I think I have upgraded it as far as it will go.
I knew this was coming, just hate to make a change at the moment. Trying to hold out just a bit longer, just not 100% sure what direction I am leaning as of yet.

LOL, I'm also upgrading to a new i-7. Actually bought one. Sat there and looked at the box for a week and a half and returned it because it really wasn't what I wanted.

In regards about a ribbon microphone in which one I would choose. I chose mine 30 years ago and it's the Beyer M-160 and the 130. The 160 is one of those few that works out so well, for so many applications and unlike other ribbon microphones, it's a hyper cardioid where the 130 is a standard figure of 8. They both have the same short geometry dual ribbon design. I've found mine to be fairly rugged until they are dropped 6 feet onto a hard floor. Sheesh. Geez. I'm still sick over that one. You can find these years in good condition on eBay starting around $400-$450 and up. Generally around the 500-$600 range for a virtually new one perhaps actually new as they are generally less on the Internet stores. Worth every freakin' penny. So I had four M-160's. Now only three and the 130. So I'm still set to do a MS stereo pair and a pair of hyper cardioid outriggers. For stuff like symphonic work. Just fabulous. Incredibly fabulous on any squeaky coloratura Sopranos. And while they don't sound as dark as a 44, there is no doubt you are listening to a ribbon. I only drag out my 77 DX's on rare occasions. For stuff like music of the 30s and 40s at the Corcoran Art Gallery and such when not only do I want that ribbon sound, I want that look of that 77. It's so much more real. And then the 67's & KM-56 on other vocals and instrumentals. It doesn't get more real than that even when you're going into an API 3124 mixer. I don't need to go into my tube preamps and I also have eight of those. Four of them custom by the Father of Vertical Hold for television and my mentor. While I love tubes, I really prefer my transformer coupled all discrete transistor microphone preamps.

The other nice thing about those M-160's is that they are shaped like a normal microphone. And that makes them much easier to use and position in comparison to those larger, bulkier, modern classic designs. Which is fine if ya like the look but where is the practicality? Obviously the entire Royer line is out of that budget of yours. Now I did not find the inexpensive, American imported, Chinese, Cascades line at all objectionable. What I found objectionable about them was their Chinese transformer. So for 100 extra bucks, you get a fine American-made transformer which really transforms that cheap Chinese ribbon microphone into something far more viable and for a fraction of the cost of anything else. So you could afford to get two or three, for the price of one 160. Nearly thing I did not like about the Chinese transformer was a bit of a boxy sound around 250 Hz. You know the cardboard sound. And while you can not stand out with an EQ, nowhere near as nice as the transformer upgrade they offer. Ya know, those ribbon Transformers are bizarre. Something like a 50:1 winding ratio. Which probably also explains why they so easily blow up, with a bad microphone cable and phantom power on. Maybe I'm wrong about that? Maybe it's 1:50? Yeah. The ribbon is a virtual short.

AT is also offering some interesting looking and slightly more reasonably priced ribbon microphones. We all like their other products so... (actually they're not my favorite stuff but it works). Haven't heard their ribbons though? Forget about the SHURE/Crowley & Tripps. They're pricey. And cannot use them for MS. Different response in the front from the back. I refer to it as the perfect microphone you'd never need. I think it's moronic when somebody wants to change what a figure of eight microphone is supposed to. What? No switch? No way to just make it a figure of 8? I thought that disappointing since I also have a SHURE 300. And those were ribbon microphones they did use to make. Though I don't have the old Johnny Carson SHURE ribbon microphone. Not sure if there'll still re-ribbon those old microphones or not? My 300 is still in good shape.

A couple of the ribbon microphones that I've used, but I really wasn't completely wild about was the Beyer M-260 and their M-500. Now that 500 was actually intended to replace a SM58. It also has a very nice high-end. Not something though I would use on a Symphony Orchestra. A Fender Twin Reverb, no proble'mo. I wasn't wild about it for vocals.

How about an Altec Lansing 639? You get two-for-one. One dynamic. One ribbon. Great nostalgia. And that's another microphone, one of the few I've never played with. Though I do have a recording that CK LW made my mother, back in the 1960s on a full track Ampex. That was the only microphone used in the concert hall where she was singing. I never much cared for that sound I heard and they used a 639. That was a nice Ontario Symphony Orchestra Hall. So it sure wasn't the hall. The orchestra was rather abysmal. My mom was her normal incredible self. And it's probably a recording I'm going to be releasing soon be once I start my huge archive project. She had a technique like no other.

I'm like my mom.
Mx. Remy Ann David

audiokid, post: 397873 wrote: Here the first one that was simply eq'd a bit. I used a Fabfilter Pro L on it. I've been playing with this for a week, its the best limiter I've found so far. Just posting this as a FYI. It does kill some transients but overall, its pretty impressive. Most limiters I'm tried don't get close to this one. I think the next best would the the Weiss DS1 which is 8 grand. This is 250 bucks lol.

Got to run. I'll post a few loops after I make supper.

[MEDIA=soundcloud]audiokid/donnymaster2

Also Note the area near the end, lyrics: How much "I miss you" everyday. 1:34 ) I was able to clean that one hot spot up quite a bit without effecting the rest of the track. Sequoia 12 is incredible software.

LOL... great. Now I have two great versions to choose from. Thanks a lot. LOL

I really like what you did in taming the top end, which, don't get me wrong, didn't bother me as much as it bothered you, but what you did is sure nice to listen to as well. I like that the changes you made didn't effect the "silk" of the track.

I agree with you about the condenser - if I had used a 414 or 89 on that track and had used the same EQ settings as I did to brighten up the 44, it would have drilled a hole in your forehead. ;)

Although, to be fair, I can say with a fair amount of confidence that I wouldn't have jacked the presence on a condenser like I did with the 44.

You mentioned that you noticed a dip in the mids on the original version, can you be a bit more specific as to what freq(s) you noticed were lacking? I ask because the mid range in general gave me fits in the mix, I adjusted accordingly based on what I heard, but obviously I was dialing down energy that perhaps I shouldn't have been, and likely because of burn out and ear fatigue, I didn't notice that I was attenuating them as much as I did.

It's great to have another set of pro ears to listen objectively. I appreciate that you, Mberry and Remy took the time to listen, and your comments, observations and suggestions are REALLY appreciated.

I am very interested to hear your thoughts as to how you or Remy would have approached the project had either one of you been the engineer on this track.

As it was I was wearing many different hats on this song - writer, arranger, performer, engineer, producer... LOL... objectivity can get a bit lost that way. ;)

Thanks again for taking the time to work on the track, audiokid. Feel free to experiment with it any way you'd like. :)

-d.

Personally, I would love to hear your version before it was Mastered? I'd like to hear that ribbon roundness that was lacking due to the jacking of the high-end. I mean you did that to make it sound vintage. Your Mastering Engineer did a fine job but I really think that he took the wrong liberties with what he did to your track. Don't get me wrong, it was very nice but at the same time, it was very wrong. Our recordings today seem to overemphasize all this high-end crap! And I really feel that this is due largely to the difference between men's and women's hearing? I find that this over exaggerated high=end that guys like irritate a lot of women. So a lot of women think you guys are actually deaf. Of course you guys can talk women into most anything. I don't. Quality recording is not about too much high-end. It's about the sound. And I think a lot of people are missing the boat on that? You've all been brainwashed by marketing BS.

I bet your track sounds absolutely beautiful just the way you recorded it? Even better than what you posted?
Mx. Remy Ann David

If you want to hear some good sounding vintage vocal recording turn on AMC. They seem to be running the movie White Christmas 24/7. Can't recommend the plot (such as it is), but the vocal recordings are great. I don't know for sure, but since it was 1954 I am guessing big RCA ribbons. Bing Crosby and Rosemary Clooney in front of the mics doesn't hurt either.

To be fair gang, a lot of the high end jacking was done by me in the mix stages. ;)

Honestly, this performance was the last one I recorded before I had nodules surgically removed from my vocal chords; they had gotten so bad that I got to the point where I could hardly even talk, so I think that subconsciously, maybe I was sculpting the tone of the vocal track around that problem - I was pretty self-conscious about it at the time.

I'll let you in on a little secret... there is one line in the song that I performed after the surgery that was a punch in... two months after the original vocal was tracked.
I borrowed the mic from my friend again for about 2 hours one cold and snowy Sunday afternoon, and I "fixed" just one phrase where my voice had cracked on the original performance.

I'd be interested to see if anyone could pick it out... I worked my ass off trying to match it in tone and timbre to the rest of the performance that was recorded two months previous, just before my surgery, so that it didn't sound like a drop-in after the fact.

I'll buy a virtual internet beer for anyone who can pick it out. (y)

Remy, as far as the original version goes, I'll see if I have something, maybe a rough working copy of a pre mix or something- that I could post. I don't know that I do, but I'll look. :)

Remy, I agree . Men and women hear different, no doubt about that.

Converters and most brickwall limiters combined with online audio are the evil causing all this metallic horrible sound this last decade. I can't hardly take it anymore.
I almost lost my hearing doing that Indaba Remix for Christina Aguilera. The Vox track was enough to make me stop music and sell everything. I hope this gets googled and someone from her production team explains how they could release something so bad? That is the worst case of smashed audio ( from someone that popular) I have ever heard in my 35 years. My kids even commented on it.

But this taught me something valuable and confirmed what I am hearing and tuning into. But it has nothing to do with your song here Donny!

hehe, you are fun, Donny. I'll take a crack at it. Don't tell!
Thanks for welcoming me into your track and sharing things too. I have a few more things I will post later.

pan60, post: 397881 wrote: Yea my G5 is not going to cut it, I think I have upgraded it as far as it will go.
I knew this was coming, just hate to make a change at the moment. Trying to hold out just a bit longer, just not 100% sure what direction I am leaning as of yet.

Yep. the old G5 in the office wont go any faster or operate anything new. Too bad cause its a great old computer. Probably when I eventually upgrade the studio computer to a Thunderbolt system and PT HD then I'll have something that will support all the newest browser settings.

And no, I can no longer access soundcloud even though I have an account.

Davedog, post: 397921 wrote:

And no, I can no longer access soundcloud even though I have an account.

WOW! I so surprised this happened so fast, there was no warning either..

I know even with our current forum software (vbulletin 4), there is talk they no longer want/will support the older browsers. Its causing all sorts of problems. If this happens, I have to make a choice. One of the main reasons is security.
There are so many exploits caused from patching the generations back, just so people can continue using old code. You can imagine the tiers/ levels of code that could be stripped out and optimized. Speed and performance , stability, features and security are all the reasons.

These updates, upgrades to more secure code are close to being launched. I'm currently on Firefox 18. Its a two street really. If I want more security, I need to be careful which websites I am on too. There are security warnings popping up more and more.

Google just emailed me a message stating that my current VB needs upgrading. They know right away and rank you on this. I haven't updated to the most resent release a few months ago . As an example, we are 2 years ahead of GS. Google may stop recommending sites that carry possible exploit vulnerabilities. Going from example, FB to an old website poses something I'm gathering?? And then there is the mobile world steering this too.
Big changes are coming.

I too have been having some bizarre problems with Sound Cloud. Unsuccessful uploads. Hung up on transcoding audio and crashed. Error message that my track was too loud? Even though it was normalized to -.8 and no peak indications in any of my software. So it was likely during their own upgrade? Yes I do rather like the new version. I also think their results sound a bit cleaner with less of that data compression sound.

This six-year-old HP 1.7 GHz, core duo laptop I'm still using and I don't have any problems with Sound Cloud. Why should a G5? So are you saying that Apples are taking a bigger technical dump than old PCs? Or am I getting clueless again thinking that the G5 ain't all that old? I actually think it's something else flaky going on with the Internet or your ISP? Ya know all these companies have their own agendas? Maybe they were upgrading something else to accommodate everybody else's upgrading of something else and they sort of all met in the middle together this past couple of weeks? Could also do some crazy international hackers trying to wreak havoc? Perhaps they've succeeded? But I really think it's 12-21-12?

See you all at Alpha Centauri howdy
Mx. Remy Ann David

I'm reading that the G5 was actually a more stable and tighter Mac. Mac is changing and I don't think its for the better in the pro audio world as we know it. maybe PC too. Its getting all goofy.

From what I've read in my numerous audio, video, broadcast and computer trade journals, all of our computers as we know them today are going to be soon discontinued by most manufacturers. Everything is heading towards tablets and smart phones. That's for all of these companies are now making their huge windfall greed profits. So no need to produce larger more expensive computers when they can sell you a smaller piece of crap for almost as much money.

So this will likely move us towards specifically designed professional pieces. With an associated rise in cost equivalent to that of professional recording gear from yesteryear, i.e. never cheap again. Which might be great for some of us professionals? And where simple stupid apps and single button devices will be available to consumers at Wal-Mart. Which may make for less competition for us? On the other hand, it might be just the last nail in the coffin? I'm sure you know, realize and understand that people today care less and less about quality and more and more about stupid simple mindless fun. Where if sound simply comes out it's fine. And which is what I'm largely hearing from the generationally younger bands today. It's empty sounding. And they're not complaining. Half the time it doesn't even sound like they know how to use a reverb or a limiter? Not that it's all that way but I'm sure hearing a lot more of what I don't like.

We're the end of the line... or... MIC.
Mx. Remy Ann David

With all the talk regarding soundcloud issues, perhaps I should just create a new "recording org" folder and start placing things in Dropbox.

For those who want to share audio, get suggestions, have our colleagues proof mixes and music, I'd be glad to create a folder and send out invites. I just need email addresses.

And if not, that's okay too. :)

-D.

None of the pre Intel chip macs will run anything new enough Remy: (
So the G-5 is just becoming an anchor if you need to get on line.
Works fine as intended just not so great for the internet.
I have two machines here but the machine I use for recording is also the one I check email and the forums on, I am in front of it the most.
The other one is in the office and I seldom even look at it.

pan60, post: 397976 wrote: None of the pre Intel chip macs will run anything new enough Remy: (
So the G-5 is just becoming an anchor if you need to get on line.
Works fine as intended just not so great for the internet.
I have two machines here but the machine I use for recording is also the one I check email and the forums on, I am in front of it the most.
The other one is in the office and I seldom even look at it.

This is exactly why I dumped Pro Tools (all Avid). ( generally speaking) all you guys who think you are getting a deal buying a used HD system, jokes on you. You cannot use an older computer in a modern studio without headaches much after the ball drops. Avid is the worst investment because of this. The support will drop off like you have the plague. Trust me, yes, no.... maybe...

But for all those who don't care about being on top, it ain't about that. Its about being able to interact with the changing world while using old dated software, hardware and a computer that no longer will support anything but what it had at the time. Until it breaks too. Then its all junk.

I am not a Pro Tools (all Avid), fan by any means!
I use DP and RME mostly but just having the G-5 is a pain.
Even when I get a new computer I will have to get a new monitor because my are the older macs: ( plus new PCIe cards no matter. Just a royal pain!

Yeah, we know how to maintain our equipment and computers. We know how to make the last. How to upgrade them. And every few years a gun is shoved into our ribs with our backs against the wall and nowhere to go. Well... you go to the store again. And then ya spend the next couple of years making it all work right. That's what we got in this business to do isn't it? Spend money? The money that was funny when we had it. Bye-byehowdyMoney all gone.

Mx. Remy Ann David

I just despise being forced into upgrades just despise it!
one issues myself as well has some others have had with the G-5 is getting small hard drives. the lager hard drives seem to be killer these things. i spoke with a friend in LA and he told not to put a big drive in my it would kill it, i did it anyway and for the first time every the fans started revving up to hi, with-in a month it was dead: (
I grabbed another one of my G-5's to hold me over but I think these just done.
You cannot relay on getting smaller drives so no sense in staying with these machines?
And I hate buying into a new machine because I see some upcoming changes that are not just the oh a big comp type change but a total way we look at comps change.
I am so on the fence with getting into RADAR or something similar and just getting completely away from a computer for anything g other than email and internet.

Yup! I hear you indeed! Money money money all the time. patching bugs and upgrading. Talk about loudness wars. This is just as bad.

Thats why I've gone hybrid. I'm done with plug-ins and all that holds me hostage. I use the DAW for storage and clinical work but the hardware sums it together. And we know all DAW's are equal to a point right? And no matter what DAW I use, I can get by. Right now Sequoia is the best for me but maybe another one will come by that rivals it. If that happens, no big deal, I switch with the times for little expense. All it really is, a storage device that allows me to edit audio. So what do I need that it does better? Clinical stuff lol. its a computer.

I don't even need a great computer like I did back in Pro Fools day. Less plug-ins, less need for a fancy DAW and constant upgrading. And you don't really need all those plug-ins either. They really aren't making our music sound better. They are patching the problems all caused by the DAW in the first place.

That's how I hear it.

I hate plug-ins! I only have what came with DP. I have no interest in spending any money on then either. Don't like-em don't want-em.
i personal can not see plugs-in being worth the cost of admission. i just cannot see it. i'll keep my hardware all day long. i relies they take up space but they are not milking me dry in the form upgrades constantly. and when something better comes out the hardware is still as somking good as it ever was! yes their can be some maintenance but nothing compared to have to shell out thousands for a complete computer and software overhaul.

pan60, post: 398009 wrote: I hate plug-ins! I only have what came with DP. I have no interest in spending any money on then either. Don't like-em don't want-em.
i personal can not see plugs-in being worth the cost of admission. i just cannot see it. i'll keep my hardware all day long. i relies they take up space but they are not milking me dry in the form upgrades constantly. and when something better comes out the hardware is still as somking good as it ever was! yes their can be some maintenance but nothing compared to have to shell out thousands for a complete computer and software overhaul.

I don't mind plug-ins ... actually, I'm still amazed at the technology and what is available... and how for the most part, everything I need now resides in a little box - compared to the 8' long, 3' high rack that I used to have housing all the peripheral OB gear... and the miles of cable to connect it all...

What I despise is the authorization keys and friggin' dongles that are required in many cases to allow you to use them.

It's frustrating. I've purchased them, they're mine, I shouldn't need to have extra hardware between my keyboard and the computer in order to access them... or worse...

A few weeks ago I was at a friend's house helping him mix a few tracks. His recording area is your typical, run of the mill basement set up. I suggested that it might be best if we moved his rig to his living room, where the space was much bigger, not as confined, and would offer a better sounding room in which to work.

So....we moved the DAW, set up and began to work. At one point, I wanted to put a Waves L2 limiter plug on the master 2-bus, and low and behold.... it wouldn't let me - because the plug required an internet connection to authorize, and he didn't have an internet connection in his living room.... but that's not even the point! The point is that this plug-in that he had paid good money for, had purchased legally, was now refusing to let him use it because of some BS authorization process that required a connection to the net.

I was absolutely floored by this whole concept. I've got an older version of Waves Diamond Bundle, and Thank God I don't have to use any sort of authorization process to get the plugs to work, so this was all new to me. I'm not against an initial authorization process of some kind, a one time method of registration or authorization that unlocks the product upon install... but after that, leave me alone! I've done it, I've registered the product, now stop asking me to prove time and time again that I'm the legal user of a product that I have purchased!

I'm still in a state of disbelief that this even happened.