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nandoph8 4 November 2004

What is the difference between the Neve 1073 and the 1272? I'm looking the get some Neve preamps but seems that that all the 1073's have the eq which I don't need, I just need the actual input preamp. Is the 1272 the input preamp for the 1073?

Comments

johnwy Thu, 11/04/2004 - 08:33

Great question

"A 1272 is a line amp/summing bus amp from the circa 1970-76 era of neve consoles, such as 8048,8014,8016,and bcm10 portable consoles.

A 1272 is not a mic pre, nor was it ever used by neve as such.

However, when asked what he thought about people rewiring the 1272 as a mic pre, Ruperts' answer was" why not? It's all the same stuff in there". "

but imho one can never have too many eq's :D

AudioGaff Thu, 11/04/2004 - 21:49

To keep it short simple, the 1272 is and has 2 of the same gain stages as the the 1073 which has 3-gain stages. The third gain stage is used/switched in when more than about 60dB gain is required. Up to the 60dB-65dB, the 1272 is and has the same sound though there can be some minor difference that many chalk up to age, condition and how hard the mic amp is driven than they do because of the third gain stage. For older mics or for gain needed over the 60dB, the third gain stage does make a real difference in both tone and character compared to the 1272.

The 1272 has been talked about many times here at RO. Check the archives for further comments. I also don't think it is accurate or fair to save the GR NV unit is a Neve clone. While it is true it is a Neve 1073 influenced design, it stands on it's own merit that is both different yet retains much or the 1073 flavor and character. If your looking or you want something that can be considered a real Neve clone, look to a either a real refurbished Neve 1073 or clones made by Brent Averill, Chandler or Vintech.

KurtFoster Fri, 11/05/2004 - 12:57

Geoff Tanners comments were very interesting.

Great River also manufacturers the GRMP2 ... the MP2NV is a modded version ..

this from the Great River site .. http://www.greatriverelectronics.com

"Two design types of preamplifiers are currently available - Original MP Series, the clean series, and the newly developed NV Series, the vintage sound series. The Original MP Series, the MP-2 and the MP-4, are two channel and four channel units that offer the most pristine, definitive sound clarity and accuracy available today. These units have optional output transformers to isolate and balance the signal.

The NV Series, featuring the MP-2NV and the ME-1NV, modernize vintage sound. Both units are tunable preamplifiers that offer the same definitive sound and solid craftsmanship as all Great River Electronics preamplifiers with the ability to 'tune that sound' a la 1970's 1073's."

I exchanged several emails with Dan Kennedy and we discussed the 2 / 3 stage subject ... and he feels as I do, that the 2 stage 1272 does not sound like an original Neve pre ...

I have used the Brent Averill 1272's before and while I agree they are a considerable step up from most pres .. they do not compare to "real" vintage Neve pres or the true 3 stage versions built by Vintech or Brent Averill. I also had some issues with the build quality of the Brent Averill 1272's I used ... they fell apart in the rack within a couple of years. Fortunately they belonged to a studio where I was doing a lot of engineering at the time and not to me.

AudioGaff Fri, 11/05/2004 - 22:22

Kurt you should know that one experience with one product is not the all be all of fair judgement of quality. I've have had my BA 1272's for over 10-years now and they get dragged all over the place as they are part of my remote outboard rack. Not one single problem in either sound or with the bulid quality. On top of that, I have never heard one bad word word form anyone else in over 15-years of reading the net, taking to friends and clients and others on Brent's build quality be it his refurbished 1272's or anything else that comes from his place.

Perhaps the one you used had or even still has issues that need to be addressed. After all, if it was an older refurbished unit some amount of failures are likely to occur no matter how good of a refurn job was done. Not all 1272 units are built or sound the same and many don't even have a decent power supply which has much to do with the sound. So important is power supply that each mono 1272 deserves it's own. The other part of how much a 1272 sounds like a 1073 is what mic is coupled to it and how the 1272 is setup/driven. As a guy that used to own real Neve 1073's I am more than aware of what the exact differences are in tone.

The 1272 does not need to sound exactly like a 1073 to be of value as tool that has both a great tone and character that is worthy as anything ever made in the Neve linage. And now that I own x81's, the 1272's are still of great value for what they offer that being different than the 1073 is a big part of their charm and value in my world and others as well.

Guest Sat, 11/06/2004 - 07:08

nandoph8 wrote: my dilema is as follows:
I want to get the 1073 sound but i don't need the eq.

...and my question is "do you know the 1073 sound?"

I run into so many brothers that say "I wanna 1073" but have no idea why. Lemme tell ya, the 1073 is no 'magic bullet' by any stretch of the imagination. It's a good tool from time to time, but IMNTLBFHO has been put way higher on the 'old stuff food chain' shelf than it really deserves.

People read all these magazine articles saying "we used the Neve 1073 along with [name favorite 3-8 THOUSAND $$ microphone here], and they think, oh the magic bullet was the 1073.

Wrong.

Good performers, good performances, great source tones and a well defined strategy and variety of recording tools will be the magic bullet a "Neve" ain't fuckin' it [and I own a bunch of 'um, I know what I'm talking about].

There are so many things in my arsenal that get used before "Neve" stuff it's ridiculous... API, Great River, Phoenix Audio, DW Fearn, TAB-funkenwerks, Chandler "TG" series stuff, etc., etc., etc. One of the reasons for this is that I hear the "Neve" signature 'smear' on so much crap out there that I use other stuff just so the recordings I make stand out a bit from the overall sound of all the other stuff... so that the recordings I do have a bit of a 'special' edge that help draw in the listener.

The "Neve Sheep Factor" thing is at an all time high... and I'm afraid it's more from ignorance than experience. Yes, Neve and some of the "Neve-esque" tools are cool... but you really have to have a good sense of how and when to apply them within the context of a project or you're just screwing yourself and the artist.

Sorry for the rant... it just gets a bit frustrating when you hear the same erroneous doctrine spewed time and time again.

Peace.

LittleDogAudio Sat, 11/06/2004 - 19:37

Stay cool Nandoph8.

It seems like Fletcher is getting tired of explaining the obvious truth that: Just having all the "most talked about gear" doesn't mean shit unless you have the ears and the dedication to educate yourself on how to use it, I'm certainly not talking for Fletcher, just a guess.

Now to give your question some service. Check out the Vintech Dual 72. I own 3 refurbished Neve 1272's and a vintech dual 72. They are both very good and sound rather simular. They will not sound great on all sources and if used too much on one song, can start to cloud things up a bit.

I love them both on electric guitar, any small stringed instrument (banjo, mandolin, uke, violin, ect) and they can sound amazing on the right vocalist. I don't like them on, over-heads, bass guitar and some acoustic guitars.

I hope this gives you some insight.

Cheers

Chris

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