ADAT is only good for 8 channels at 48k or 44.1k. It is a very good format but make sure your cables are quality. I used to use it lots when I ran redundant double ff800 into twin HD24xr.

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Thanks for chiming in John, what interface did you use or would you recommend?

I use Adat into a presonus lightpipe. I use rme and apogee Convertors via adat. When I record live gigs via adat hd24 I play it into my computer via adat via adat cable. For a while I had some issues because with the video card in my Mac but updates stabilized things eventually.

The presonus lightpipe is discontinued and when it goes out of date I'll need to get either an RME pci raydat and thunderbolt adapter if that is made by then or an Orion 32. 32 channels is essential to me. Do you have a PCIe slot? The raydat could work.

Hi Paul, yes, I have PCIe slots available.

The RME ADI-8 QS interfaces have 2 ADAT ports in each direction, so can go to 8 channels at 96KHz by using S/MUX protocols.

For PCIe interface boards, you could look at another German product: the Marian [[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.marian.d…"]Seraph[/]="http://www.marian.d…"]Seraph[/] A3, which has 3 ADAT ports supporting S/MUX protocols.

right: [="http://www.sweetwater.com/insync/s-mux/"]What is "S/MUX"?[/]="http://www.sweetwat…"]What is "S/MUX"?[/]

Bos, thanks for chiming in.

I thought this but wasn't sure after reading so much on ADAT. I've been confused over other interfacing options for these since I got them. Will I still get the low latency?
Being accustomed to AES EBU ( and now MADI), and understanding this interface will top out at 96k ( which I have no requirement to go beyond anyway) , what should I be expecting ( pros, cons ) introducing S/MUX to my workflow?

Thanks for the Marian [[url=http://="http://www.marian.d…"]Seraph[/]="http://www.marian.d…"]Seraph[/] A3, tip, I get why we want more I/O for them now.

Marian [[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.marian.d…"]Seraph[/]="http://www.marian.d…"]Seraph[/] A3,, not available in NA.

Its refreshing to understand S/MUX better. These QS are even cooler now.

Bos, I need a min of 24 ADDA

hypothetically,

if I bought another QS instead of selling these, and sold my Orion32, I would free up some cash for a used QS and an S/MUX interface. Would I get 24 ADDA top performance @ 96k like I have now via S/MUX?

How solid would the clocking be with S/MUX?

audiokid, post: 410494 wrote: Thanks for chiming in John, what interface did you use or would you recommend?

Duh, you were obviously using the FW off of the FF800. Chaining interfaces to another is so confusing to me.

Another question which lends itself to my last question about clocking.

This interface would then do it: http://www.rme-audio.de/en_products_hdspe_raydat.php These are often available at a good used price ( http://www.ebay.ca/itm/like/301097706735?hlpv=1&cond=2&clk_rvr_id=588212030799&item=301097706735&lgeo=1&vectorid=229529 ) so I may be switching gears here is this works out. but...
I see an optional clock on the RME page which concerns me.

I have clocked with just the adat called and been fine but it is better using an external clock via bnc connectors.

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TheJackAttack, post: 410506 wrote: I have clocked with just the adat called and been fine but it is better using an external clock via bnc connectors.

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Is this a general consensuses about ADAT/ S/MUX?

Chris,
ADAT is a very old protocol and on the way out. No one is making these things any longer and support will be waning. Unless you are going to work at 44.1 or 48 k the 48 k limit or the use of kludgy S/MUX that limits channel count to half are reasons. Clocking issues (ADAT clocks automatically through the light pipe) and the expense of and the mess a snarl of light pipe cables creates are other reasons.

If i were in your position I would be looking at MADI, USB, or Thunderbolt and to a lesser degree Firewire interfaces.

Sorry to hear you don't care for the Orion ... I had high hopes for that one.

Thanks for chiming in Kurt!

I love the Orion but the QS' are a bit smoother and have a more appealing gain management and additional analog connectors that come in handy when you are in that creative magic when every second counts.

The Orion 32 is excellent with madi. I definitely recommend it. But the rme aid-8 qs are superb. Thus why they cost $3000 for 8 channels

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all my interfaces here use ADAT and i also ran a bank of ADATs in the 90's. they are fine for what they are but i really don't think you will be very happy with them if you don't like the ORION ... maybe you need to just bite the bullet and get the RME's? i don't think you will be satisfied until you do ......

hmm, that pretty much killed ADAT for me. hehe Clocking is everything. The Orion 32 and MADI is unreal. Never had better. USB was pretty good until I started pushing the tracks and the session got large. MADI, is the thing.

The QS have an optional MADI card but they are $650 each too. Damn, this stuff is expensive. I should just sell out and go fishing lol. Hard to get music out of my blood.

We are plagued aren't we.

I still use ADAT through my HD24 as my primary converter. Lately I have been experimenting with tracking @ 44.1 instead of 48. I think I'm starting to hear the down dither when I mix down to 44.1 for print. Until I can work with higher rates throughout a project I wont really know, but I am searching for that clarity. I think its all about the clock and conversion at this point. If I have less than 8 tracks at a time I am strictly through the ADAT from all analog front end. I have a patchbay setup as ins/outs/ for the HD24 and can use it as my converter, avoiding the digi at all costs. The clock in the Alesis is so much better than the digi one in the 003. And the conversion is more 'musical' for lack of a better description. The Orion is in my future. As is MADI

I don't use an external clock with my converters. I have found less reliability with external clocks. I am very much in the minority.

Paul999, post: 410544 wrote: I don't use an external clock with my converters. I have found less reliability with external clocks. I am very much in the minority.

What devices were you using that an external clock was not MORE reliable?!?

Using an external clock with an ADAT HD24 it was not more reliable. I am using 16 channel of rme and 8 of apogee and 8 behringer all using lightpipe and no external clock. Early time I tried I got clocking errors. Even when I could get it to be stable(not often) there was not difference in sound using an API a2d as a master clock or a waves maxxbcl as master clock.

Interesting. The clock in the HD24 is known not to be particularly stable. The upgraded HD24XR has the better clock and it is really only "accurate" at 48k. I have used the Fireface as master clock without issue through bnc connectors with the HD24XR. At one point I had dual FF800 and dual HD24XR and an Onyx 800R chained together.

This is is the type of thing I've read time and again. At the time that I was trying solve issues I had my video card in my imac causing issues with audio clicks and pops. External clocks always made it worse. It very well my be that now this video card issue is solved that things may be better with an external clock. My system is now rock solid and I am hesitant to tamper with it.

TheJackAttack, post: 410551 wrote: Interesting. The clock in the HD24 is known not to be particularly stable. The upgraded HD24XR has the better clock and it is really only "accurate" at 48k. I have used the Fireface as master clock without issue through bnc connectors with the HD24XR. At one point I had dual FF800 and dual HD24XR and an Onyx 800R chained together.

If you are solid then I wouldn't touch it. I just had never heard someone who was less stable using an external clock.

Fascinating none the less.

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There seems to be two opinions on external clocks. Some swear by them , others not. I think it is really subjective.

I just sold a 10M, a $7000.00 clock which is considered to be the worlds best. It never did one thing for me. I did extensive null tests to try and convince myself that I must be deaf or my monitoring was weak. That's what the dealer selling these told me when i said it never did one thing for me lol.

I even did blind shootouts with other classical musicians ( young and old) and no one, and I mean no one heard any benefit with or with out it through my system. My internal clock is obviously working and system and workflow is in sync. This new MADI interface I have is dead locked, even better than AES EBU. I'm extremely impressed but being uncoupled like I do it is even better.

To my understanding, internal clocking is superior if you have a good set-up. Some converter designers tell me that external clocking is actually a detriment compared because its that much further away from the source. I believe even Bob Katz and quite a few ME agree with this statement.
http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jun10/articles/masterclocks.htm

I've never experienced sync issues but, I also don't think we know we are having them until you hear you are out. I think a lot of people are actually having clocking issues that don't know it too. But, I don't think its because their clocks are bad. I think workflow has more to do with it today.

Although I don't have a need for external clocking, I do believe (some) people do hear an improvement with them because they are using a variety of converters coupled to one system. There also seems to be a lot of believers who do round trip processing that find they help tighten up their imaging. My guess is they are pushing their system out of sync . When using an external clock, it hold the loops better, less phase.

here is another one:
[[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.gearslut…"]Mr. Katz...External clock? - Gearslutz.com[/]="http://www.gearslut…"]Mr. Katz...External clock? - Gearslutz.com[/]

My experiences with an external clock have been two fold. Either there is no change our there is improvement. This was the first instance I had heard of where the clock made things worse.

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TheJackAttack, post: 410564 wrote: My experiences with an external clock have been two fold. Either there is no change our there is improvement. This was the first instance I had heard of where the clock made things worse.

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When I was doing research on the 10M, the first time I read this I was surprised too.