A few cheap items for you to consider:

Preamps: Mackie 1202VLZ-Pro Mixer, or one of the smaller Spirit boards with the Ultramic preamps. Also try Ebay for the Symetrix SX202.

Mics: Marshall MXLV67G. Those go for less than a hundred nowadays, and won't sound any worse than a Rode NT1. Similarly, check out the Oktava stuff. Be sure to go through a stack of them to pick out a few good ones. The MK319 is the large diaphram condenser, and the MC012 are the small diaphrams.

Compressor: For $175, there is no compressor better than the FMR RNC. Used Symetrix stuff is pretty cheap nowadays, and sounds quite good. Check ebay.

Best of luck!

I think basho is pulling your leg. I would not use, much less purchase, any of the stuff he mentioned (with the exception of the RNC) unless I wanted to make a bad recording on purpose. As he mentioned, these are "cheap items" and sound it. I think the Rode NT1 is a far better mic than the MXL ...

While the Korg D16XD is a decent recording package, ( a friend of mine has one of these and it’s kinda cool), these items should pretty much be nixed from the list (IMNSHO)

- 2* Behringer T1952 Tube Compressor , pure rack junk, this stuff spontaneously combusts in racks, no kidding.)
- 3* ART TPS Preamp System More rack crap
- R0DE NT-1A , mmm, not so bad, I’ve heard better, better than the above 2 items. You could still do better with some Audio Technica mics like the 4033.
- 2* AKG C1000 fugedabudit! This is a horrible mic, like biting a piece of tinfoil. Again, in your price range ATMs are the best sounding mics.
- Event TR-5 Powered Monitors Do you smear mud all over the windshield before you go to the store? These thing only lie to you, get some Yamaha MSP5s, a much better speaker.

Yeah, I know I’m opinionated. :D

Originally posted by Kurt Foster:
While the Korg D16XD is a decent recording package, ( a friend of mine has one of these and it’s kinda cool), these items should pretty much be nixed from the list (IMNSHO)

I have to agree with Kurt on this -

By the way - on the D-1600 although i own one of these...... ummmm... I'm also Kurt's friend.......... could he....... ummmmm....... nah - he's talking bout someone else......

Anyway - i digress...... although i own one of these - and i really do love it to pieces - it is not what I would want to be the centerpiece of a semi pro studio. Maybe you should reconsider this.

Rod

Good ole Kurt, saved me a lot typing. I will defend the 1202-VLZ or VLZ-PRO version. While certaintly not the greatest kit of gear, it is the most quick, easy to use, flexable and best bank for the buck utility tool I've ever owned or used. That sucker comes in so very handy when you need a few extra mic pres, keys/sampler/MIDI module/drum machine sub mixer as well as other sub mixing, headphone feeds, extra effects sends/returns, general I/O and inserts interfacing, DI box, signal splitter and even more I'm forgetting about. I even take it with me for jam sessions, small PA or DJ control and as part of my personal support gear kit when I mix FOH. It has paid for it's self many times over.

I think Wackies are great for small PA work, very flexible in use, a lot of bells and whistles and built like a tank. I have a SR24 in use in my system for no latency monitoring and headphone mix's. I like the SR 24 best out of all the Wackies for this as the inputs sound better to me for some reason and the SR 24 has 6 dedicated aux sends instead of the 3/4, 5/6 flip that is implemented in all other Wackies.

However nothing I record ever passes through the Wackie on it's way to the DAW or out of the DAW to the CD burner. When I switch between the Wackie and the spdif monitors from my Dakota card, I can really hear the damage the Wackie does to the audio. It is filthy compared to the output of the CDr.. I might use the SR24 to sum my outboard reverbs to a pair of returns in the DAW at some point if I was forced to but that is the only thing I even consider using it for..

Heres my buck and a half(inflation being what it is)....The Mack-i-Whacks being what they are,theres simply no point in arguing about their attributes as opposed to their drawbacks.At their price point they have a funtionality that is somewhat better than their low-bred clones the B-b--b--b----beh-rin-gers...And let me simply say that I tried both a B..b..b.bear-thin-jeer and when I picked it up I could hear loose impediments rattling around inside....a NEW one...and the Mack-I-Whack sounded a lot more strident and pinched than the old Yamaha...Most people think that technology for small mixers began and end with this Mack-a-Whack crap....SORRY...theres been very good sounding small venue and project mixers for quite a while and chances are you can find a Yamaha/Tascam/etc...or maybe even a Ramsa in good condition for less than you'll pay for a new one of the others...Okay, maybe it doesnt have 6 aux's...maybe theres only 4 subs...but the sound......find me a Mack-i-Whack or Berry-jar that has pres as good as an old 2404 Yamaha or a WRT Ramsa...God forbid in yer search that you might find a real Bi-amp studio mixer...a good patchbay makes everything flexible...

Outboard: Realize there are several ART pres.One is called the Pro MPA....this one actually sounds good as does the VLA compressor.At least it doesnt have that brittle metallic kinda sound s does the dbx386....I own a bit of dbx gear so I actually like it...anyone whos tired of their 160A compressor can send it here where it'll get a proper burial....

Symetrix is the most undervalued gear on the used market right now.The 525's are very decent comps and can do a lot of things..the 201 is a nice unit...old Furman stuff works...Old Orban stuff....its all how you use it.

The Soundcraft Spirit series mixers are heads above the Mack---Behr....crappola.

Mics:NT1....nice...brittle high-end...works for some voices.
ADK A51 model V....warm and smooth..soon to be discontinued for the model VI.Very cheap for what you get.
Marshall mics ....If you like it, buy it...be sure you can test it against others..and can take it back ...

Octava MK319...try a bunch...get a good one and other than the output being a bit lower than some $3000 mics the tone will really REALLY surprise you.

The Events are cheap....really cheap...spend a bit more on the monitors...they are your best investment ....

Do NOT buy c1000 mics...there are 25 mics at the same price that are MUCH better.

The 1202 being one of, if not the first Mackie product, doesn't suffer from the same kind of signal degrading that their higher channel boards do. That SR series (SR as in Sound Reinforcement) has lots of good features for PA work but is the worst sounding of the bunch. All their mixers were derived from the the origianl 1202 design but along the way the design got compromised. The other thing is that I think is that the power supply in the 1202 is better matched than what is used for all the others. Compare them as I have and you should notice a difference.

AudioGaff,
I never heard a 1202 but I had a 1604 vlz and still have a SR24. For some reason, the SR 24 pres sound better to me than the 1604 pres. Why? Idunno... just less splatter sputter gag grunt!
The SR 24 vlz still leaves a lot to be desired however.

OK, now that you have effectivly chewed my plan to pieces (thats ok, you guys know what you're doing atleast), Can I get your opinions on what I can get for $5,000 that will be the recording medium, mics, any pre/mixers/compressors, and monitors? It has to be able to record Drums, guitar, bass, vocals (although not all at the same time).

In the meantime I will be looking up the stuff you recomended.

-Bennis

Ok Gents,

he's giving you his budget - now is the time to gently guide......... :D :D :D

Rod

I would make a Roland VS-2480 or Akai DPS24 the centre of your studio set up. Then the only outboard gear you need to start recording stuff is some mics and some monitors.

Personally I use HHB Circle 5 monitors and an assortment of mostly AKG mics with my VS-2480.

If you want to hear what it sounds like have a listen to [[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.mattargy…"]Better Half by Idiot Kings[/]="http://www.mattargy…"]Better Half by Idiot Kings[/] which is a VS-2480 recording with no outboard gear except guitar and bass POD's and some AKG mics (D112, C3000 (two), D409, C4000B).

Like you I don't do any midi, sequencing, synths.

Pete.

So....for 5 grand and you dont have ANYTHING as-of-yet?????I think we're lookin used but particular.....probably DAW with outboard, though not a lot of anything really...

$5000 huh? Why dincha effin say so? And why, if you had a budget of 5 grand, were you even considering all that crap in the first place? :confused:

Well, Kurt may have his "opinionated" opinions on stuff like the V67, but people whose opinions I trust, like Mr Harvey Gerst for instance, have made a case for that particular mic. And for less than a hundred bucks, there's little gamble trying one in MY opinion. As for the NT1, I have heard it, and it's nothing to be impressed about. I would still lean towards a good-sounding Oktava if push came to shove. Also look out for some really good dynamic mics, like the Sennheiser 441U (250ish on ebay), and cheaper ribbons like the Beyers as well.

Jeez. Was browsing through the rest of the site and read this:

The MK319 has considerably lower output but when we adjusted the playback level to compensate for this difference, the MK319 sounded very much like the Neumann(U87ai). At a savings of $2900, it's hard to argue with this. Of course, you need to go through a few to find a good one (a drag) but to save almost $3K, it's worth it.

By Mr Kurt Foster.
Makes this...

I would not use, much less purchase, any of the stuff he mentioned (with the exception of the RNC) unless I wanted to make a bad recording on purpose. As he mentioned, these are "cheap items" and sound it.

...sound a tad inconsistent, wouldn't ya say Kurt? Make up your mind, will you? :p

Uhhhh...basho.....I'm thinking that Kurt is speaking of a particular MK319 and I'm sure he would want to hear a bunch of em(as you suggested) before he ever would agree that they're not junk....which a lot of em are.However, he has been convinced now that a 'good' one has merit.If you are so worried about peoples inconsistent commentaries, then I suspect you'll have to spend quite a bit of time fleshing out all of them by EVERYBODY...and please feel free to post them ALL.However if you are simply just interested in ONE person's inconsistency, then complain about it elsewhere...ya Dig?

Now see, I agreed with you about a lot of your suggestions....but only because in this case he has a small budget and probably not a lot of hours in this business.I would prefer for him to look into a good used Yamaha or a Ramsa as these boards completely blow the Mackie/Behringer stuff away sonically.And I would hope that he stays away from Behringer rack crap....And really, I love Harvey and he is right about a lot of things, but he is not the only person in the world with a educated opinion.Its too bad you cant see past that.

Sigh. Nevermind. :roll:

It seems we have the return of one of the banned trolls in the persona of basho. His post is a return to the same old character assassination tactic that Bobby Loux, littledog and J Slaytor tried to use, carried out by these troll types, who hide behind screen names because they are to chickensh*t to register with their real names. These cretins have been sent to RO by other Forum owners, equipment dealers and manufactures, in an attempt to discredit RO and myself because they don’t like competition (RO whips their asses regularly) and because they don’t like the message I carry to people, not to waste their cash on crap gear purchases that only benefit dealers and manufacturers.

This same bunch, judging from their arguments with me, say we here at RO should embrace “rack crap” gear but then make critiques at other places saying that RO seems to be more “newbie”, home studio oriented. They can’t have it both ways. Which should it be fellas??? Hmmmmm? I prefer a pro slant on things. Pros can contribute and exchange ideas and techniques, and "newbies" can learn. It's a win, win for everyone.

The inconsistent comment is old hat. Like I don't have the right to change my mind. If we all set our opinions in stone, as basho (or J Slaytor, littledog, who ever this is) seems to think we should, none of us would progress or learn. I changed my mind regarding the MK319 after hearing it compared to my U87 just last week. I still have issues with a company that has obviously bad quality control and that is unethical enough to sell only good ones to dealers that cater to people who know what they are hearing and then blows out the junkers to places like "GuitarGit" where people who don't have a clue shop.

As far as Gerst goes, I hate much of the cheap gear he seems to like. He's entitled to his position as am I. I hate CAD mics and for the most part Acoustic guitar amps both which I understand he had something to do with. I am not impressed. I would venture to say that Harvey’s sensibilities and mine are vastly different. He seems to be more interested in price point and I am more interested in quality. Harvey is one of the only experienced people in the business I know of that takes these positions, besides some equipment dealers and brokers who seem to only tout gear they sell regardless if it is bad or good. I think it has something to do with Harvey’s friendships and associations with other manufacturers and dealers. I admit this is mostly subjective opinion on my part but it is a fact Harvey has been in the business a long time and is well entrenched. Harvey used to mod here but went over to the “dark side” where no one challenges his comments and he is treated like he is some kind of god by a bunch of “rump swabs” who seem to only be impressed by celebrity.

Instead of criticizing any one persons statement, just reply with the facts, observations and any pertinent information or comments you have. If you can't control yourself, I will and I think you know that's not a threat but a promise. This nonsense will not be tolerated at RO. Subject closed. Any replies on this matter will be deleted. Lets get back to the thread topic.

[ October 11, 2003, 03:59 PM: Message edited by: Kurt Foster ]

The whole thing about any of this, or any gear in general is that what works or even works well for one person, may not work well for anybody else. It is more than just the gear. It's how the gear is used, what other gear it is used with, and the working style of the person working it.

You'll find that most pro guys with high end gear don't know squat about the cheaper or budget stuff. They have no direct experience with it. I'm constantly asked by friends, clients and email for advice about the budget stuff or home stereo stuff and I tell them I really have no idea or clue? They seem bewildered that a music and studio pro would not know? I tell them well the stereo store sales guy knows nothing about pro audio gear and music production. The guy that works in the video dept usually knows nothing about the stereo dept and they both work in the same store. Many studio pros don't know or can't even align a deck, bias a tube, program an effects unit, wire a patchbay or use a side chain on a compressor.

I for the most part, avoid making specific suggestions but try to educate them on what to look for when buying. I end with don't believe everything a sales person says or what you read in a newsgroup, sales ad/tech sheet, and for the most part these days, you get what you pay for.

Before you spednd your $5K I think you need to decide if your need is imediate, or for the long term as it can make a big difference. In the case of the long run, you can buy some things now that can be upgraded latter. In the short term, what you likely buy for an all in one unit will either become obsolete or you will likely soon be displeased with and outgrow.

AudioGaff,
Great comments and a direct hit. I know how to align a tape machine but I have to admit I have never biased a tube. Most of my experience with inexpensive gear was many moons ago, stuff like Tascam, Bi Amp, Tapco etc. and I don't think the state of the industry has improved. Rather, I believe things have gotten worse. When I was learning recording on this stuff, the gear was still, for the most part, all discreet components. I still have Tascam and Teac gear put away in storage, that still works and sounds good. "Advances" like integrated chips and robotic surface mounting are in IMO, not a step forward in quality.

Some think this is snobbish or elitist of me to say these things but the truth of the matter is I am enamored with great audio. Cheap gear just doesn’t sound good to me and working with it is about as enjoyable as working with a musician who doesn’t know how to tune their instrument or count to four twice in time. I don’t understand the mindset of “settling” for less because of a perception that “It’s all I can afford.” Anyone can afford anything, if it really means something to them. I would bet that a lot of people who cry poor all the time have lots of money for cigarettes, booze and weed. Many of them probably buy lots of new clothes all the time and drive new cars. We, in the Western World, live where anything is possible. Don’t put limits on yourself. Dare to dream of the “good stuff”. Visualize having it. It can be done.

This is bordering on the ridiculous. You take a swipe at Harvey Gerst for running over to a forum so he can "play God", and yet here you are getting your panties in a bloody bunch because I DARED to challenge some of your opinions. That's rich.

As for your paranoid delusional rantings about me being some character sent over by some other forum, that's just plain insane. You wanna email me personally, the address is votemiles@yahoo.com. Oh, and my name's Justin S. Lee. Feel free to throw groundless accusations at me. Jesus.

Back on track here.
Valley Audio/Kepex comps are ok with me and are affordable.

Bennis,
Are you planning to have clients or is this a project studio? If you are going to have clients (sounds like bands) what genres are you likely to work in? What are you going to charge? What is the nature of the location you are going to be recording in (basement, warehouse, etc) and what acoustic treatment has been/will be done?
All these considerations will influence, at least slightly, what you need as capital equipment. Fill us in. David

Whew! I hope I never get on Kurt's bad side!

Ok, thanks for totally bashing my ideas. Let me start off by saying that I am only 15 years old. You all (or some anyways) have been in the business twice that. Please take into consideration that I have had no real studio experience, no way to listen to gear, no outside contact to the recording world other then message forums like this one.

I am restricted by the fact that I cannot drive myself anywhere and the fact that, even though I work, money isn't growing on trees over here.

Now, I had originally planned this to be a studio for just me and my band, recording whenever an idea hit and building on it. My friend, however, has come to me saying he would like to do some recording with me, of other people. I would love to do this but severely lack the equipment/skills to do it well. I plan on practicing and on acquiring enough gear to make semi-pro recordings of any music with guitar/bass, vocals, drums, and keyboards (no midi though). This is all built on the principle; the more bang-for-the-buck the equipment is, the faster I can get up and running with it.

I will be acquiring gear slowly, not spending a ton of money at once. I figure $5,000 is a reasonable number for pretty much everything, based on time it would take to get that amount before moving on to much better equipment.

Any help on anything would be good, bashing doesn't help so please, be kind. I have pretty much decided on going with the Korg unit, taking $2,000 dollars out of the original sum.

-Bennis

Originally posted by basho:
.... You take a swipe at Harvey Gerst for running over to a forum so he can "play God", and yet here you are getting your panties in a bloody bunch because I DARED to challenge some of your opinions. That's rich.

As for your paranoid delusional rantings about me being some character sent over by some other forum, that's just plain insane. You wanna email me personally, the address is votemiles@yahoo.com. Oh, and my name's Justin S. Lee. Feel free to throw groundless accusations at me. Jesus.

You made the obvious insinuation that Harvey Gerst was believable and I am not. Rather than saying you disagreed, you had to make it personal and attack my credibility making a comment that readers would be better served by following others advice and not paying attention to what I have to offer. How does that serve the disscussion? How does that answer Bennis' questions? It was simply an attack on me and really has nothing to do with the subject.

I never accused Gerst of "playing God" as you put it. I said

" Harvey used to mod here but went over to the “dark side” where no one challenges his comments and he is treated like he is some kind of god by a bunch of “rump swabs” who seem to only be impressed by celebrity."

In regards to the Oktiva MK319 it was not on the specific list I mentioned,

...." these items should pretty much be nixed from the list (IMNSHO)

- 2* Behringer T1952 Tube Compressor , pure rack junk, this stuff spontaneously combusts in racks, no kidding.)
- 3* ART TPS Preamp System More rack crap
- R0DE NT-1A , mmm, not so bad, I’ve heard better, better than the above 2 items. You could still do better with some Audio Technica mics like the 4033.
- 2* AKG C1000 fugedabudit! This is a horrible mic, like biting a piece of tinfoil. Again, in your price range ATMs are the best sounding mics.
- Event TR-5 Powered Monitors Do you smear mud all over the windshield before you go to the store? These thing only lie to you, get some Yamaha MSP5s, a much better speaker.

I actually made no direct comment regarding the Oktiva. It's to bad that in your zeal to find somthing I said that you could jump on, you failed to notice that.

..If you are going to quote me out of context, at least have the courtesy to quote me correctly.

Bennis,

i do not believe anyone intended to bash you - but you did not present to us all of the facts to begin with - which makes it a little difficult for anyone to respond to other than we did.

In fact - i would say that (for a 15 year old) you presented yourself rather well below - i certainly thought you were older.

For a 15 year old - i would consider the D1600 to probably be a good starting place. The gear is well built - has a ton of built-in effects processors and i have actually suported it in other threads.

I just do not consider this to be a move to a semi-pro studio - it is still prosumer - not professional gear.

One other thing - just for the record - you stated :

"I also plan to totally exclude computers from this process as they are unstable and I don’t feel like dealing with drivers, updates, and software. "

The Korg is nothing more than a computer...... and you still deal (as long as they support the platform) with some instabilities - software updates, etc.

Although i love the gear - i have had lock-ups on occassion - which require that i do a cold reboot in order to recover - this only gets me back to the point of my last save - so save often - it's always annoying to lose 2 or 3 hours of editing.

However - NO media is free from possible problems - at least with this i have always been able to recover.

The mic pre's aren't great - but they don't make me want to get sick either........

Pne other comment i have - you have no way to bypass the Korg Pre-Amps - so spending money on high quality pre-amps may not make sense - you'll just pass them through the Korg's anyway......

It would probably just be cleaner with better quality mics.

I'll let others address your other ideas......

Good luck.............

Rod

Hey Rod,
Doesn't the Korg have line inputs and inserts on a couple of the pres?

Well, if I got the D16XD, which I was looking at b/c of its expandability and it have no reduction in tracks for 24 bit unless going 96kHz, I can bypass the korg pre's. But on the note of "it's still software" issue...

I have tried to stay away from computers because:

- I don't really know how to build my own, which I am told is really the only way to go

- I like the plug and play ability of stand-alone DAW's

- I don't want to configure soundcards, I/O devices and the like

- I hate using a mouse to turn knobs and such

Now, if someone told me that building your own comp isn't extremely hard and that there is some sort of mixing board like the EZbus by Event that isn't very expensive, I might think about a computer. Now, everything world have to be under $2,000 including software/soundcard/computer/and any interface.

-Bennis

Bennis,
There is no reason you shouldn't be able to get a PC computer built for you under 1000 bucks that would be plenty powerful enough to run at least 24 tracks of 24 bit audio. With a Ardvark Q10 or a couple ADAT AI3s and a Frontier Dakota, you would have all the input you need (8 and 16 channels respectively). Another 300 to 500 for software runs you up to 2500 or so.. a little more than what you said but a lot more flexible and more tracks. You get the added benifit of getting into DAW, which will take a week or so perhaps to sort through but once you get through the initial learning curve, it's a breeze. Something to consider..

Kurt,

in response to your question - there are unbalanced line inputs - but no insert points..... the effects are all built in - everything runs straight through the electronics and software - and then down to the hard drive..... great mics would sound pretty damned good (the gear really is that good)but i do not believe that a good mic pre with a decent mic would make a difference.

Sincerely,

Rod

Maybe I'm in a real minority (and Kurt will probably hate this post), but... as as high school teacher, I've heard a lot of bands comprised of 15 year olds. :roll:
For a lot less than 5 grand I would look in an entirely different direction. IMHO, a lot can be done with a quality CD/RW with xlr/optical inputs, a used ADAT XT20, the used Yamaha or Ramsa mixer suggested earlier(with balanced outs or inserts) , some decent powered monitors (check any of 12 dozen threads here at RO) a few decent mics and a nice mic pre for vox and drums. KISS Method - Keep it simple. Learn the craft- you're 15- Sorry to be blunt, but no one's gonna beat down your door for even semi-pro business; ask questions on this and other forums so you'll know what questions to ask as your knowledge base grows. Save the extra money (2K+) for downpayment on future purchases and for S-VHS tapes and maintenance on the ADAT and hopefully it could be at a local studio where you can sit in during sessions. Sit back, keep your eyes, ears and mind open and take responsibility for learning not just experiencing. Take notes, draw diagrams, Read the manuals while waiting, ask questions if possible then try to duplicate it at home. If you can learn to make a decent mix on your set-up - THEN do as Kurt suggests - buy excellent equipment 1 piece at a time to upgrade. So, by the time you're a senior in high school you have equipment, a reputation and knowlege enough run a small semi-pro set up for all your high school/college friend's bands and they (not Dad) will pay for your continued upgrades. I would also advise you to learn the craft of live mixing, it can open the doors to more recording business than almost any other.
Phil :p:

Bennis,

To avoid the PC route, you may want to consider some used ADAT-XT20's. While they are 20-bit, they are cheap enough, I see them as low as $400 each and they are easy to use. They use tape, and need to be cleaned every few hundred hours, (easy enough to learn how to do) but offer great value for the novice. Most of the horror stories you may have heard about ADAT's, are mostly issues that are related to being used in professional enviornment. With a little care they work real well for part time user. A few ADAT's, mixer, cables and few mics can be had in the $2000. range. This is also the kind of setup that you can easily expand, interface, or upgrade with one piece of gear at a time. And you also have easier to use flexabiltiy to interface other gear or gear that friends may already have or intend to buy. Buying used gear in general offers the greatest bang for the buck.

Don't fret over not having 24-bit. Much of the gear that touts 24-bit does not really give you true 24-bit performance. Much of the new 24-bit gear today exists not because of the greater quality or dynamic range it can achieve but because 20-bit and 16-bit converters are no longer made or available. At the stage you are at, 24-bits is not likely to be needed or even noticed.

Looks like Phil and I were thinking the exact same thing and typing it up at the same time...

Originally posted by BennisHahn:
everything world have to be under $2,000 including software/soundcard/computer/and any interface.

-Bennis

So Bennis has only 2000 bucks not 5000, at any rate, I would avoid an ADAT like the plague. Those things are so unreliable and that technology is dead, dead, dead! I don't hate the sugestion, I actually see the wisdome of it as far as not spending a lot of cash and if an ADAT was more stable and reliable, I would agree. I had 5 of those things just to have 3 that ran all the time and even that didn't work out! They are junk I say! All that being said, it is the computer age. I think Bennis should just get on board while he is young and get with the program. Many of the skills and concepts he will learn in music software will carry over to word processing and other aspects of working with computers. Coming out of school with computer skills can only be a benefit.

Or the KORG could be a good thing. Bennis, you shouldn't really need the pres or the comps, the KORG has some of this stuff built into it via software. -
lose the Behringer and the Arts.. get the - R0DE NT-1A or a Studio projects B3, forget the - 2 AKG C1000s, the C4 from Studio Projects is a much better mic, you can get a pair for $400. Go for the - 2/3* Shure SM57 but instead of getting the 1/2 Shure SM58 just get more 57's.. instead of the Beta 52's I would go for the Audix D6 or an AKG D112e.. and the Yamaha M5 powered monitors instead of the Event TR-5 Powered Monitors. This will be a cool system and the envey of all your friends. It won't help get girls but you will have a lot of musician types hanging around. The girls love them ....

Audiogaff,

"With one breath, with one flow, you will know Syncronicity"
:c:
I think those are the words?
Phil

Originally posted by Kurt Foster:

So Bennis has only 2000 bucks not 5000

Kurt

either you or I misunderstand

I believe he has the 5 grand - but only wants to spend 2,000 for the front (the recorder) - the other 3 is for pre's mic's etc.

Rod

Rod, you were right about the money allocation.

and I really think this statement was not needed, "and they (not Dad) will pay for your continued upgrades"

I have bought everything for my guitar, bass, and recording hobbies. I am no daddy's boy.

-Bennis

Kurt, while you may have had a real bad experience with ADAT's I have logged thousands of hours with all versions of them in big studio's and in my home song wtitting set-up. I know of dozens of other users as well with thousdands of hours using them with only some minor problems. The major problems mostly arise when you are in the pro mode where you constantly and are quickly going from start/stop/locate/re-locate/rewind/fast forward and do it all over again, again and again that they show the dark side. When your gentle and use them with less stress and strain as in part-time, they can work very well. ADAT's may be aging and headed for the death bed but they are not quite dead. I gave mine up for E-mu Darwins that I still use at home and they give me the best of the ADAT with hard disk features. You could get the same kind of thing with a used Alesis HD24 ADAT hard disk recorder and a mixer.

I can fully understand the turn off to using and dicking around with the PC route, Mac or Win PC. I have extensive experience with computers big and small in computer programming, IC design as well as a being a computer user way before they were availble to people at home and I HATE THEM for recording audio. They change the whole vibe and ruin the creative flow for me. For audio editing ya, PC's then can serve me well. I never obtained the necessary skills of using a razor blade to make edits very well.

If you know your going to feel uncomfortable and not enjoy using a PC, you should not force yourself or be forced to do so. That would just be counter productive. Even more so when your first starting out. There are other options available and sometime in the future you can always jump into the PC. It's going to be around for a while...

My apologies Bennis,

I had your post confused with another I read today where the young person was getting the funds from Dad and they suggested crying to help win the battle. My error. :d:

Phil

mmmm-kay! mmmy mm-mist-tak-ke. Whew! That was hard to spit out. :D