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Mattmaymatt 8 July 2011

I am 18 years old with self taught knowledge of multitrack recording. Is the Recording Connection a good way to introduce me to the next step in music producing/engineering?

http://www.recordin… The Recording Connection | Audio Engineering and Music Producing School[/]="http://www.recordin… The Recording Connection | Audio Engineering and Music Producing School[/]

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bart_R Tue, 02/07/2012 - 04:38

theDAWstudio, post: 383264 wrote: That is exactly what I am saying. Most of the older people in the industry had no formal education and started as interns or janitors knowing barely anything to nothing about audio. They slowly learned by being a fly on the wall in sessions and checking things out after everybody left. They eventually learned the craft and got some break when the engineer was sick or something. The difference now is that studios expect their interns to already know how to do everything so either find a studio that doesn't expect that or find a way to learn the information. It's all about having the skill to do the work. They don't care were you got it, just that you have it.

That'sthe perfect way to break into the business.

anonymous Wed, 02/22/2012 - 04:44

I believe that recording schools are great for those guys who have always had an interest in recording but did not take it up initially, either due to time or financial constraints or because of other work commitments. At least it means that they have the chance to break into the business without having to go on a 4 year college course.

bart_R Wed, 02/29/2012 - 05:54

MadMax, post: 373853 wrote: OK, here's the deal... and it's not like I'm worried about you or anyone becoming my competition... but, leave this industry alone. Run as far away from it as you can... as fast as you can!

There isn't any real income to be had. The hours suck and people will certainly not respect you enough to pay you what you're worth in the long run.

Maybe as a musician you can make it, but as a recording engineer... you better love ramen noodles and peanut butter.

There's folks out there who steal plug-ins and use cracked software that will record artists for damn near nothing, because they don't do this for a living and have no morals or ethics. You can't compete with that, and make a living.

I agree with Thomas, get a four year degree in something. Maybe make recording technology a minor, but get a degree in a really viable industry, like electronics engineering or computer science. Hell, get a degree in accounting and do the books for what few studios will still be around in 4 years. But do yourself a favor and forget the music industry.

Very harsh words but coming from someone as experienced as you I know it to be true, sadly. Spot on unfortunately.

JohnTodd Wed, 03/07/2012 - 08:23

The industry is not doomed - but it will have to change. And, it will change. It will. People won't stop listening to music, so other people won't stop making it. It has to be recorded somewhere.

And regardless of the latest techno-gizmo or the latest musical styles, The Holy Laws Of Physics dictates that the best recordings are made in a great sounding room with at least decent gear. Back in the 60's, Abbey Road had primitive equipment from our standards, but they had great sounding rooms and talented engineers/producers. These things never go out of style. Abbey Road's recording were of high quality for the time.

MadMax Thu, 03/08/2012 - 17:09

From the chair I sit in; On a daily basis I see large markets for music. However, the actual need for music is becoming severely narrowed due to the consolidation of large media outlets.

So, as the cost of gaining access to larger markets rises, there becomes far more smaller markets that cannot afford mass media costs. THIS is where the future music industry will wake up to find itself...

audiokid Thu, 03/08/2012 - 17:14

MadMax, post: 385941 wrote: From the chair I sit in; On a daily basis I see large markets for music. However, the actual need for music is becoming severely narrowed due to the consolidation of large media outlets.

So, as the cost of gaining access to larger markets rises, there becomes far more smaller markets that cannot afford mass media costs. THIS is where the future music industry will wake up to find itself...

Okay Max, now you are hitting on some good stuff! Lets have some predictions?

MadMax Mon, 03/12/2012 - 20:45

Dunno about predictions... as much as some realities...

Since the US PUBLIC airwaves are owned and controlled by so few large media conglomerates, that locally produced ads soon won't be done at the local stations, as there aren't going to be much more than a couple of employees actually working at the station... they're all just taking taped feeds. That leaves a significant amount of work to be done locally... but there isn't much margin in it... as the cost of airtime is too expensive to give much of a budget to the actual commercial.

Local cable takeovers are doing the same thing to local TV advert...

Since there are so few decent pro-level studios (soon to be left operating), the handful that are able to diversify and hang-on, will actually be able to get some decent clients... as the majority of the new musicians that are coming up, will eventually discover that making real music (as opposed to 100% synthetic) is easier, cheaper and better quality tracking, when teamed up with a professional facility.

audiokid Mon, 03/12/2012 - 21:27

The last commercial work I did was 14 years ago when the local radio station asked me to listen to a generic compilations of Stingers and do one for them in exchange to advertise my studio. They couldn't afford my rate but trading worked. The compilation tracks I listen too must have been on every top 40 radio station in the country. It was cool they wanted something local but they are centralized as you describe, no one real in that office anymore. I still hear all those generic background tracks everywhere.
I've moved to a town of 70,000 and I don't think there is one pro studio open anymore. I would love to jump in, I own all my gear so I wouldn't need to suffer from high interest load payments but even then I doubt I would make enough.

I do have hope though. I think people are starving for originality and real musicianship, again. I think we're coming close to hitting the bottom and something will blossom.

MadMax Wed, 03/14/2012 - 15:18

I disagree... I think we're still a good ways from the bottom... but I don't actually think it's going to be a hard crash like it was when the content managers embraced CD's and let vinyl drop by the wayside. While CD's are dead, and the manufacturing segment of the content managers (labels) will miss the revenue, the bottom line is that too many artists are now able to completely sidestep the majority of the publishing obstacles... and with CD sales already plummeting, the transition should be rather scary.

Scary from two aspects. First, that there is no longer a physical product to offer the "buying public"... other than branded merchandising, and a download card... ( which is possibly of some minimal value, like a concert ticket.) Since there is no physical product, the value of the digital download, while of legal value, cannot accuratly reflect the reality of market value. - To wit, what has more value?? A concert ticket to The Beatles @ Shea or Hollywood, or a digital download card for ANY band?

OK, so that doesn't sound scary... there's no product, there's no shipping, warehousing or much in the way of manufacturing, other than merch. What's so scary??? That's a plus, right?

Maybe... for some, yes... others... no...

It ultimately gets scary, when the ability to do so much of your own publishing ends up costing you more than you can possibly recover, because the time to audit correctly eludes you... potentially leaving a lot of income on the table.

dvdhawk Fri, 03/16/2012 - 13:12

Let me preface this by saying, I've done the indie-release / indie-label thing to death back in the early-mid 90's. I worked with a couple bands that got played on a couple dozen commercial and college radio stations regularly, got ink in some music magazines, had CD distribution into a major chain of record stores (remember those?), countless CD consignment retailers, international distributors selling our CDs in Europe and Japan - despite the fact we'd never left our tri-state area. All of this was before Al Gore invented mp3s and we had to work our asses off to get any of that done. Every bit of it was done with demo tapes/CDs, printed promo-packs and business cards, and phone calls (just like Edison, Gutenberg, and Bell envisioned it I'm sure).

We're watching big studios fold one after another, because with the loss of major label business they can no longer support themselves in the manner in which they were accustomed. I don't expect the more modest studios to be replaced by bedroom studios, any more than drum machines replaced good drummers and MIDI made classical musicians obsolete. (remember the furor over that??)

Every generation wants/craves their own musical identity, so I think there will always be a desire for new music. But with the absence of physical product, we're going to have to do some serious brainstorming on ways to monetize the resulting music. Because let's face it, no artist - in any medium, can bring their art to the masses for very long without financial support. It's difficult in this climate for a well established band to succeed, and 1000x harder for an up-and-coming indie band to breakthrough from eking out a living, to livin' large. And don't forget to factor in the rarity of those who make a splash for more than a year or two. [Don't blow that first wad of cash on a mansion in Beverly Hills kids - there's never any guarantee you'll see another dime] The business will shift and even IF you're still wildly popular, you may not longer be profitable.

Everybody has had to change their way of thinking to adapt to the current state of the business. Do you know why it costs $125/ticket to see a big name band in concert these days? Because they can't make a living on the mark-up of the physical recordings anymore. Concert tickets and merchandise are what keep them going. There was a time they made money on sheet music too, but now you Google the song title and can find 500 free tab versions of any song you like ( some of them might even be right ) - or there's somebody on YouTube willing to show you how to play it.

Billboard is a joke. As anyone from Johnny Cash to Curt Cobain would tell you as they flip the business the bird on the cover of Rolling Stone - corporate music still sucks. And anybody that doesn't believe payola still has a stranglehold on radio is living with their head in the sand. In the mid-1980's when the model for a profitable radio station switched to national satellite feeds for all or part of their programming, it became all but impossible for a band without major label support (dirty bribe money) to get airplay on a commercial radio station. College radio stations have always been fertile territory and a valid way to build a following - assuming you play music that appeals to that age group.

There are thousands of great bands out there we've never heard of, and for them, the technology is a double-edge sword. With affordable DIY recording equipment more bands can make recordings, theoretically kicking down those obstacles and getting more good music out there - but they're lost in a sea of a million other bands fighting just as hard for attention. The good news is, the market is wide open to all comers who may not have been pretty enough to get a second look from the all powerful labels and agents. With the interweb, anyone can have the means to distribute their musical genius around the world - along with those million other bands - plus the added bonus of having the works 'freely shared' by the handful of fans that did find them. Also back on the plus side, do something great and/or memorable and it can go viral - and 'boom goes the dynamite' you're the flavor of the month - I hope you have a plan on how to capitalize on your 15-minutes of fame.

Watch late-night TV and see some of the godawful 'bands' that are wasting precious network airtime. Some of them are so bad you know nepotism and/or bribery are the only way they could 5 minutes in a cab - much less 5 minutes of airtime. The NY based shows are especially supportive of new music good and bad. Sometimes it's nothing more than bad-pantomine-theater and you WISH they would have lip-synced. And sometimes if you get lucky, you'll see some great band(s) you've never heard of who can really deliver the goods live. These are usually the real bands who have been out there payin their dues, playing small to midsize stages for 10 years to earn their shot at becoming an 'overnight success'. On more than one occasion I have been on iTunes downloading their album/EP before they finished their 3 1/2 minute song on Letterman.

As for our part, we can only do everything in our power to make sure our recordings sound 100x better than the efforts of the bedroom and garage studios. Now anybody with a computer, a $30 USB mic, and Audacity can say they've 'got a studio' - although they don't have the first clue what to do with it, as evident in the questions we see here on a daily basis. Many of them won't or can't read the manual, and they want the information spoon-fed to them, because they're never learned anything useful by trail and error. The fact is, not everybody is geared toward tackling the learning curve of DIY recording - and that's OK I can't play the tuba (only because I've never applied myself to learning the tuba). Anybody who is good at this, didn't master it overnight. It takes an investment of time as well as money to learn, but sadly we often see those who believe buying a new mic will make them sound exactly like their idol.

One good thing I've found with people I record who own any sort of recording equipment of their own.... they understand the process better and they're less likely to choke when the red light comes on. Back in the day, we used to 4-track our songs in the basement and make sure everything was worked out before we went to the pro studio.

And hold on to your hats, lots of musicians like the ego-stroke they get from saying they're "in the studio" working on a project. I think there's only so much swagger you would have if 'working in the studio' involved wriggling past the furnace and stepping over the cat-box. So if for no other reason than that - I think there will always be a demand for a proper professional studio facility such as Max's little slice of heaven. Great sounding tracks, the full equipped professional studio experience, and rates that should make anyone think twice about DIY.

What the bands do with it from there to make a living...? I'm not sure where we're going.

Ryan Edward Wed, 03/21/2012 - 05:57

MadMax, post: 385941 wrote: From the chair I sit in; On a daily basis I see large markets for music. However, the actual need for music is becoming severely narrowed due to the consolidation of large media outlets.

So, as the cost of gaining access to larger markets rises, there becomes far more smaller markets that cannot afford mass media costs. THIS is where the future music industry will wake up to find itself...

This man sure knows his mustard.

BobRogers Wed, 03/21/2012 - 06:57

MadMax, post: 385941 wrote: From the chair I sit in; On a daily basis I see large markets for music. However, the actual need for music is becoming severely narrowed due to the consolidation of large media outlets.

So, as the cost of gaining access to larger markets rises, there becomes far more smaller markets that cannot afford mass media costs. THIS is where the future music industry will wake up to find itself...

I agree that the consolidation of national media concentrating on a few well-tested national common-denominator markets opens up a lot of niche markets. But one thing we're not acknowledging is that we are also in competition with every recording made since, what, 1945? Don't like what's on Clear Channel? Name your genre and I can find you a couple of albums from the 50's and 60's to get you started. Spend an afternoon telling Pandora which of the songs you like and Pandora will find more to your tastes. (And either Pandora will get a better catalog and a better algorithm for learning our tastes or somebody will.)

On the other hand, if my evil plan to launch a national techno-klezmer craze works I'll be able to monopolize the techno-klezmer market for centuries. (That was a joke - but just in case I googled techo klezmer. Sadly, I would not have a monopoly.)

anonymous Wed, 04/04/2012 - 04:32

dvdhawk, post: 387272 wrote: To underscore the info on the shift away from physical product:

Here are the 2011 numbers on physical CD sales vs. digital downloads etc. from an article in PCMag.
[="http://www.pcmag.co…"]
U.S. Music Sales Flat, But Digital Music Sales Soar
[/]

It's interesting how digital music is winning against physical media whereas with movies it's the other way around.

Thomas W. Bethel Wed, 04/18/2012 - 06:13

I have had students of the Recording Connection apply for work here. They are under educated and think they know a lot more than they do. I had one "gentlemen" tell me he could "align multitrack machines" So I sat him down in front of our MTR-10 with the manuals, the test equipment and the test tapes he would need to do an alignment on the machine and told him to go ahead with the alignment. He looked at me and said "well I should have said I have seen an alignment done on a multitrack machine but have never done one myself". He also did not know anything about dBs or gain staging but he was a graduate of "an accredited recording school" He was full of BS!!!! and lots of it. I have had other students from the RC apply here and most of them don't know the first thing about audio as it applies to professional level work. IMHO we need less audio engineering wannabees and more people who actually know what they are doing.

MadMax Wed, 04/18/2012 - 06:57

Right on Thomas!

If a program is GOOD, it will teach you not only the basics of electronics and the physical aspect of the job, including technical skills. But the better programs will teach a student that the reality is a future of continued learning. Additionally, it must include the myriad of aspects that come with the field of audio... the business side, the legal side, the creative side and even the side of psychology that comes with the terrirory of working with creatives.

Otherwise, I'd rather get a kid who has a passion for this and bring them up through the ranks.

I've actually had students from several programs that were looking for "part-time or full time" jobs tell me: (paraphrased) "While you're out on a 2 or 3 day remote, I'll come in and run the studio for ya'!"

I bet you would...

If you're not willing to work a remote for/with me, I really have no use for you - as you have no understanding of the reality of work, and what it takes to make a living in this industry.

Thomas W. Bethel Wed, 04/18/2012 - 07:43

I love the students that come to you and want to work but when you tell them that there is a lot of night work or weekend work they say "gee that's when my band practices" "My girlfriend wants me to spend weekends with her". I guess I should appologise to them that the job THEY ARE BEING PAID TO DO is going to interfere with their social life. I also have problems when a student working for me says "I don't think that is in my job description" when you ask them to clean up the cables after an outdoor remote recording or vacuum the control room. When a student says "that's not the way we were taught to do it in school" or "our instructor told us to always use an XYZ microphone to pick up a snare drum" I have to remind them that they were in school when they were told that and now they are working in the real world where we may not have a $3000 microphone to use on the snare.

What they did not teach then in places like the Recording Connection could fill a couple of books and they are IMHO not preparing them AT ALL for the realities of work in the year 2012 and beyond. Audio education in some schools is outstanding sometimes however it is laughable.

If you are going to go to a "good" school go to one that will not only teach you audio but all about the business and legal sides of your work.

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