Hi, and welcome! A few questions before we can start to make realistic suggestions for recording:

What make/model is the "fancy new 24 channel digital mixer"? What is it used for?

Do any of the classical concerts need to be amplified to loudspeakers, PA-style, other than for announcements? Do all the events that you might wish to record always have a full array of microphones set up? Are there additional microphone tie-lines from the stage to the control room that do not go into the mixer?

Recording so the result is "a professional standard" involves a bit more than accurately capturing the signals that happen to be going through the mixer. That part is the easy bit, and could be done by dedicated hard disk or solid-state recorders or by digitising to a computer. The much more difficult part of the "professional standard" is the choice and positioning of microphones for the particular combination of instruments and the type of music that is being played. Is there a set of microphones already in the hall that you would be expected to use or can your remit extend to specifying and purchase of new microphones specifically for recording? Would you be expected to specify new pre-amplifiers for the recording operations?

Thanks for the reply, here's a bit more info.

Mixer is a Presonus StudioLive 24 channel digital mixer so I suppose could be used as a sound card. Not sure what it was intended for exactly (as I wasn't working here when it was bought) but I believe they'll use it mostly to feed signals to the PA speakers from radio mics. The PA will mainly be used for announcements/lectures and direct from CD music rather than amplifying the musicians. That being said, we're flexible so I can probably use it as I see fit ultimately.

We have no equipment at all except the mixer. No more mics, no nothing. My brief was to "suggest a stereo microphone for recording so we can make professional recordings" (the brief was given by someone not particularly in the know of how these things work). Although since then I've been told to suggest whatever set-up I think is best.

As far as mic-ing goes, I was thinking I'll mostly use a stereo matched pair set-up in ORTF or a spaced pair configuration depending on the performance. I don't think I can justify buying more than a matched pair at the moment, as originally they just wanted 1 "stereo microphone" (which immediately made me think of video cameras haha).

I can ask for pre-amps as well. And we will need something to record with (either computer or solid state or whatever).

The brief was very vague, hence I'm a little out of depth trying to work out what would be best.

Thanks again.

Welcome! you are fortunate to have Bos chime in.

These are my essential.
The Royer SF-24 is an absolute essential for me.
The Millennia HV-3 series mic pre's would be a wonderful compliment to the StudioLive.
DPA 4011 and 2006 are stellar microphones.

Back to the group.

Cheers!.

Thanks very much for the advice audiokid, The millennia hv-3 has been suggested to me before also. I think the Royer SF-24 is a bit out of the price range unfortunately. Although my boss has not specified I imagine my budget is something like $2000 - $3500USD.

It has been suggested to me I could record directly into the Presonus mixer as it has got the hardware built in. Does anyone have any experience with this?

Your boss sounds like a cool guy, what a fun opportunity you have!

Your setup and room may benefit with some acoustic treatment too?

I have a SL 24.4.2 ai on its way so I'm exited to use it too.

Dvdhawk is one of our long time valued members who has the most experience with those so let's wait for him

Other than that, why not just start recording and see what you need over time now.

You will need a group of mics for various apps. Omni, sdc.

I'm no dvdhawk, but do have a 16.4.2. My vote would be to connect through a computer, rather than a hardware recorder. No need for a soundcard as the board functions as one, but FireWire is becoming more difficult to come by. You can easily capture all the channels
you need, and you'd have more editing flexibility that way.

Good luck!

With classical live recording, mics and mic technique are everything.

Yes, of course you need a decent mixing console, decent preamps, and for what you are doing, the Presonus would fit your needs, as it is what it says it is... a Live - Studio console. You have the ability to mix for FOH as well as recording performances to a DAW, via Firewire connection from the desk to a computer. When your boss bought the desk, there was multi-track software included: [="http://www.presonus.com/products/studio-one"]Presonus Studio One[/]="http://www.presonus…"]Presonus Studio One[/], which will run on any healthy computer with a firewire interface.
If for some odd reason., he didn't receive the software, you can download the Artist Series Studio One software [[url=http://="http://www.presonus…"]HERE[/]="http://www.presonus…"]HERE[/] for free.

Reverend Lucas, post: 420254, member: 48050 wrote: but FireWire is becoming more difficult to come by.

It's only becoming more difficult to see as a stock I/O in store bought computers. PCIe Firewire Cards are abundant, and inexpensive.
http://www.serversupply.com/products/part_search/pid_search.asp?pid=143614

There are several multi-mic arrays that are commonly used for classical recording: XY, M-S, ORTF, Blumlein, Decca Tree, Jecklin Disc and Dummy Head.

Part 1: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/1997_articles/feb97/stereomiking.html
Part 2: http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/1997_articles/mar97/stereomictechs2.html

The type of mic array you choose will determine the type of mics you use in terms of pickup response (Omni, Cardioid, Fig 8, etc.,). There are some tried and true's that are commonly seen for live classical recording, such as the Neumann KMS Series of SD Condensers, the AKG 414, Earthworks Omni's (Decca Tree), the Neumann Dummy Head and Beyers, Coles, AEA and Royer Ribbons.

The SOS articles above do a pretty good job of explaining the various arrays and techniques.

FWIW

d.

If you can find a computer of a suitable type for the occasions you need to record, then it sounds as though the majority of your budget could be put into acquiring microphones and the necessary stands and local cables.

However, I think you need to build this capability up in stages. Show what can be done with a single stereo microphone or (better) a pair of mono microphones recording through the StudioLive console to a computer. With careful choice of microphones, this would be a good-sounding system and reasonably versatile. However, it will not cater for all types of instrumental groups, and when you come up against one of these, you can show what you have been able to achieve so far and suggest that further modest investment in microphones would make a significant difference to the range of ensembles you could cover.

That point may happen relatively soon, for example, if you find you have a lieder recital coming up where as well has having an overall stereo pair you need to spot mic the piano and the singer separately.

For a good set of microphones that would be able to be used as the main pair for just about anything from an a capella vocal group to a symphony orchestra, I would suggest you consider a matched pair of [[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.akg.com/…"]AKG C414[/]="http://www.akg.com/…"]AKG C414[/]s. These could be had for about £1400 ($2400). Although the matched pair comes with a stereo bar, you should allow at least another $200 for a couple of sturdy stands so the microphones could be mounted together in a variety of configurations on a single stand or used separately.

For a computer, as the others have said, you need one with a FireWire port. This could be a pre-Retina Macbook Pro (as all the larger screen ones had FireWire ports), a PC laptop of a type that has FireWire, or a PC desktop and a low-cost plug-in FireWire card. My advice would be to go for the PC desktop and a FireWire card, as you can then make sure that the FireWire interface has a TI (Texas Instruments) chipset. This is important for reliable recording.

Another critical aspect is are the recordings to be made with or without an audience? If there's going to be an audience, then your mic technique probably needs tweaking - will chunky cathedral stands be acceptable, or will the mics need to fly on cables? We spend ages on here discussing and often arguing about A/B, X/Y, M/S and the dozens of even more specific and niche techniques, and that's before we argue about mic choices. Natural acoustic ambient recording is a real experience skill. It's a combination of knowledge, skill and experience and takes a long time to develop. It's possible to get a pretty good multitrack, close miked recording with common sense and a bit of luck, but to walk into a space, hear it, see the musicians and then predict a suitable technique and mic position takes experience. Poor placement, by even just a few feet stops your recording sounding like a commercial CD and makes it just a record of the event. What you record onto, to a large degree is unimportant - the key features are mic location and choice.

If the concert hall sounds good, then it's easier than if it doesn't. If visual elements matter, then large chunky mics may simply be out of the question, so you buy small, slim ones, and nice mountings - fit cable connection points and build a system. On the other hand, if visual aesthetics don't matter - you might buy something different?

My own opinion is simple. Put the effort into finding the right place and technique for the space, then modest mics will work so much better than truly excellent ones in the wrong place.

Before you buy anything, find a local 'expert' with some gear and get him or her to do some test recordings so you can assess the sound and try a few things - well worth the outlay to prevent you wasting your budget on kit that just won't work for you.

For recording classical music in a new concert hall like yours, it’s crucial to capture the natural acoustics and dynamics of the performances. Your idea of using a stereo mic pair is a great starting point, especially for chamber music and soloists. Here are some suggestions to help you achieve a professional-quality recording:

1. Microphone Setup: For classical music, high-quality condenser microphones are often used to capture the natural sound of the instruments. A stereo pair, such as Neumann KM 184s or DPA 4011s, positioned in an ORTF or spaced pair configuration, can work well. This setup will capture a good balance of direct sound and room ambiance.
2. Preamps: While the digital mixer likely has built-in preamps, using dedicated high-end preamps, such as Grace Design or Focusrite ISA series, can provide a cleaner, more detailed sound. This would be especially beneficial for classical music, where nuances are crucial.
3. Recording Device: A hardware recorder like a Tascam DA-3000 is a solid choice for capturing high-resolution audio without relying on a computer setup. However, recording directly into a computer using a high-quality audio interface (like an RME or Apogee) also gives you more flexibility in terms of editing and mixing later on.
4. Room Treatment and Mic Placement: Since your hall is newly built, experimenting with microphone placement is essential to get the best sound. Take time to try different positions and distances from the performers to find what works best for the hall's acoustics.
5. Additional Equipment from New Town Spares: If you need any supplementary gear like cables, mic stands, or other audio accessories, New Town Spares has a wide range of professional equipment to help you complete your setup.

With a combination of quality mics, dedicated preamps, and a reliable recording system, you'll be well-equipped to record the concerts at a professional level.

For recording classical concerts in a hall like the one you described, it's crucial to prioritize high-quality equipment that can capture the nuances of the performances. Here are some suggestions to help you achieve professional-level recordings:

1. Microphone Selection: A stereo microphone pair is indeed a great starting point. Consider a pair of high-quality small diaphragm condenser microphones like the Neumann KM 184 or DPA 4011. These mics are excellent for capturing the detailed sound of chamber music and soloists. You could also explore using a main stereo pair in an ORTF or AB configuration, along with spot mics for certain instruments, if needed.
2. Microphone Preamps: Even if your digital mixer has decent built-in preamps, high-end external preamps can significantly improve the sound quality. Look into preamps from brands like Grace Design or Millennia, which are known for their transparent and detailed sound, ideal for classical music.
3. Recorder Setup: A dedicated hardware recorder, such as a Tascam DA-3000 or Sound Devices MixPre series, would be reliable choices for recording directly from the mixer. These recorders provide high-quality analog-to-digital conversion, which is essential for preserving the audio's fidelity.
4. Soundcard & Computer Setup: If you prefer more flexibility for editing and post-production, using an audio interface and recording directly to a computer is also a viable option. Interfaces like the RME Fireface or Universal Audio Apollo offer excellent preamps and AD/DA conversion. Pair this with a Digital Audio Workstation (DAW) like Pro Tools or Reaper for more control during mixing and mastering.
5. Acoustic Treatment: Don’t overlook the hall's acoustics. While the new hall may already sound great, some additional acoustic treatment or portable acoustic panels could help refine the recorded sound.

For sourcing high-quality audio gear, consider reaching out to specialized suppliers like Server Blink, which offers a range of professional recording equipment suitable for demanding setups like yours. Their selection could help you find the ideal combination of gear for capturing the true essence of live classical music.

For a professional-quality recording of classical concerts in your new hall, a stereo mic pair is a great starting point, especially for capturing the natural acoustics and spaciousness of the performance. Since you’ll be recording live concerts for CD, here are some recommendations to help you achieve the best results:

1. Microphone Setup: A high-quality stereo mic pair, like a matched set of small diaphragm condenser microphones (e.g., Neumann KM 184 or DPA 4011), will provide clarity and detail. For classical music, positioning is key—consider ORTF or AB configurations to capture the hall's ambiance effectively.
2. Preamps: While the built-in preamps on your digital mixer may be decent, using dedicated high-quality preamps can improve the warmth and depth of the recordings. Something like the Focusrite ISA Two or Grace Design m101 could give you an edge in capturing the subtleties of chamber music.
3. Recording Device: A reliable hardware recorder, such as a Tascam DA-3000, will be perfect for live recordings. You could connect the mixer’s output directly to the recorder for a clean signal chain. Alternatively, if you want more control over editing and mixing, feeding the output into an audio interface and recording on a computer using a DAW (like Pro Tools or Reaper) would be an excellent option.
4. Room Acoustics and Additional Mics: Given that classical performances benefit from capturing the room’s natural reverb, you might want to use additional ambient microphones to blend in some of the hall's sound with the close-mic'd source.
5. Techify Nation Recommendation: If you are looking for versatile gear options, you might explore what Techify Nation has to offer in terms of audio interfaces, microphones, and preamps. They specialize in high-quality equipment that could be beneficial for your setup, ensuring a professional standard for your recordings.

With a bit of experimentation and the right gear, you'll be able to produce recordings that truly showcase the beauty and acoustics of your new concert hall. Good luck with your setup!

For recording classical concerts in a space like your new 500-seater hall, capturing the natural acoustics is key. Given the quality of the venue, a stereo mic pair is definitely a good starting point. Consider high-quality condenser microphones, such as the Neumann KM 184 or the DPA 4006A, which are renowned for their transparency and natural sound, ideal for capturing the subtleties of chamber music.

Pairing the microphones with a good preamp can indeed enhance the sound quality before sending the signal to the mixer. Look into transparent preamps like the Grace Design m101 or the Millennia HV-3C, which are commonly used in classical music recordings for their clean and accurate reproduction.

Routing the mixer output to a reliable hardware recorder, such as the Tascam DA-3000 or Sound Devices MixPre series, is a solid choice for CD-quality recordings. These recorders are known for their low noise and high-quality converters. If you prefer to go the computer route, an audio interface like the RME Fireface or the MOTU 8Pre-ES can provide great sound quality and plenty of inputs.

Additionally, CTS Point could be a valuable resource for sourcing high-quality audio gear and accessories. They offer a variety of professional recording equipment, including microphones, preamps, and other essential audio gear that might fit your needs for classical music recordings. Given that budget is not a major concern, investing in top-notch equipment will help you achieve a professional sound for your concert recordings.