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anonymous 2 July 2002

First, thanks in advance for any comments. Second, apologies to anyone who subscribes to other threads and have seen the same question from me or other people.

I'm deciding between the AKAI DPS16 and the Yamaha AW4416. Obviously, the price difference is enormous ($1300 (plus $300 for an external CD-RW) vs. $2400 at most stores). $1100 or $800 depdnign on how you view it. That's a lot of funds. Here are my issues: 1) I'm having doubts about AKAI's dedication to supporting the DPS16. Seems like the price is falling precipitously and often enough the units are "on sale". This feels like an inventory clearance. Anyone know if AKAI is considering dropping this unit from its production line? I emailed them but to no avail. Having said that, this unit is admired for ease of use, sound quality, and affordability among other things where the AW4416 is a reputed technical beast with layers of oft confusing menus and a counterintuitive editing feature which prevents users from listening and editing in the same mode (this seems pretty foolish to me). I'm especially concerned about the editing features. Any ideas about whether Yamaha will be retooling the software to address that? Ultimately, I'm looking for a device for home recording, possibly bringing into the studio to grab some drum tracks, and maybe - just maybe -at some point setting up a little home studio for recording myself and some local artists. Maybe. Now, both machines have their ups and downs, with the clear advantage of the AW4416 being expandability and interfacing with sundry outboard gear. But all things considered - price and features primarily - which is a smarter investment? I'm not afraid to learn - and I'm not afraid to spend the money either - if I'm getting something that will be with me for 10 years and that can do the tricks I need it to do. I've long been enamoured with the Yamaha but recently have been intrigued by the AKAI. One more thing, assuming the Yamaha can be had a a discount... say 1700, 1800, 1900, 2000 or 2100... is there a price differential point that simply makes it a "no-brainer" to just go with the Yamaha. Also, while I'm rambling, I have certain concerns about the inboard CD-RW on the Yamaha. Taking that issue on its own, is it better to buy an outboard unit? Darn... one more thing.. I read that users cannot back up data to external drives on the Yamaha. Is that true? Thoughts? I'm a tad scatterbrained over the whole thing. I just want to make a sound decision. Thanks.

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anonymous Wed, 07/10/2002 - 05:55

Thanks Philly,

I've considered that option actually, though perhaps not as seriously as I should have. I will give it some more thought. My bass player has a Mac / ProTools set up and I've been negligent in checking it out. Maybe I'll head over there this weekend and check it out for myself. I'm really more of a fader guy than a mouse-guy but clearly there are many benefits to going PC based.

Take Care,
Dan

anonymous Wed, 07/10/2002 - 22:50

i know exactly how you feel. i'm still the same in some aspects, but you can always buy a controller like the tascam 428 or else something better if you have thousands to spend ha ha :p but growing up with analog makes a big difference when switching to a pc or mac based system. its hard to make the transition because you loose some of the hands on control that we all love. thats why you save to buy the controllers. but trust me, when you get the hang of it, and see the possibilities, you won't go back. much more you can do with less money. depending on what you want to do, you can build a system for less than what you would pay for some those systems and get the same results.

anonymous Sat, 07/27/2002 - 09:43

Ponto,
Don't rule out the Yamaha yet! I purchased one used about 3 months ago and love it. It is a bit difficult to learn, and is not perfect, but it is very powerful and hands on. I am going to eventually interface mine with a computer system with Nuendo through the adat light pipe. Yamaha has templates available for download that will allow you to use your AW as a controller for most software programs that are available. The Yamaha will do most anything you could want - and the opportunity to interface with a computer for editing gives you the best of both worlds - and they can be found CHEAP! I have seen them go for $1200 - $1500 on ebay. Good luck in your decision making.

SonOfSmawg Sat, 07/27/2002 - 17:40

I'll second the suggestion about going with a puter-based system. You would be SO limited with a stand-alone DAW. With a puter-based system, you will have the opportunity for growth, expansion, and upgrades. You pick the hardware you want (or can afford), and use the software that best suits your needs. With a standalone, you're stuck with all of the semi-pro components it comes with, and when it's time for you to take a step-up, you'll end-up selling it for pennies on the dollar and buying a whole new system.
If you're apprehensive about getting a puter-based system due to your lack of knowledge, you can get all of the help that you will need right here on RO, right from the start.

anonymous Mon, 07/29/2002 - 09:44

A word on the aw4416...
Maybe they fixed this maybe they didn't (one of you guys who owns one will have to let me know) but when they came out I found a problem. When you turned up the monitors there was a high frequency that just lurked around. Would drive me crazy if in a quiet room. Funny thing was it went away if you turned the knob on the top right (I can't remember what they termed it...maybe contol room out or some such) of the unit all the way up it would go away. This noise would be there even with nothing playing, just with the unit idling along. I have my suspicions that it is hard drive noise but doesn't make sense that with the output to the monitors cranked it goes away but back off to 80% and there it is. I couldn't get a straight answer from the rep (sure surprised him, though). Anyone know if this is still a "feature"?

anonymous Mon, 07/29/2002 - 11:44

Hey Guys,

Actually, to the comment above, I basically ran into an "offer I could not refuse" on eBay for the Yamaha and got what amounted to a new system for a seriously low price. So, I took the plunge and am mired (yeah, it's labor intensive) in the process of learning the new system. So far, so good, for what little I have attempted to do. Almost no noise from the hard drive and I have not noticed the hum/whistle that was mentioned from the monitor - though I know EXACTLY what you are talking about because I had a TV that made that noise and it nearly drove me into the asylum (it was a Sony TV). Anyways, I think, for me, for my applications, I have made the right choice. And I was thrilled with the fact that this machine I bought - advertised as slightly scuffed - was in new condition. Not a mark on it. Since I never used a puter system I'm hoping I won't miss it too much. And if, in a few years, I decide to go that way, well, I'll do what I have to do. But this thread will be useful for all the many other folks who are trying to make the same decision I struggled with. The one obvious lesson here is that you can get a great deal on eBay if you hunt for what you want properly and play it just right. So even if you end up wnating a computer based system I'd suggest you take a look on eBay first. I've saved almost $1000 in the last month buying from eBay and everything I've gotten has been in excellent condition. Now if only I could quit my day job and record full time...

anonymous Sun, 09/01/2002 - 20:02

Concerning the Yamaha AW4416...
There were a couple of questions that I can positively answer.
You can backup to hard drive, cdr/w and MO.
The noise you refer to is a system design flaw at the 1/4" TRS balanced outs. It is being caused by proximity of very densely laid out electronics which are being picked up by the balanced outs. If the monitor outs are turned up fully, it goes away, but that is impracticle. The issue varies slightly from unit to unit. Yamaha will fix the problem only at the California service center and will only state that the improvement in noise reduction will average 3 to 5 dB.
Phil M.

anonymous Fri, 09/06/2002 - 08:00

That's interesting about the Yamaha. That's exactly it, turned all the way up it would go away. I had the Yamaha rep come in and check it out and he didn't have much to say. Kept telling me it was hardly noticeable. In a busy music store, yes, in a quiet controlled environment it would be terribly obvious and would really fatigue the ears... Glad to know they will fix it at the service center. This was literally in the first batch of units shipped to Austin so I imagine they fixed this at the producion level at this point (seems much more cost effective than sending it to California... what is it... Paul Morte's service...)
Interesting...
Man, if I had more outboard gear I would take you up on the Mackie... How long before the UAD card (or something similar) goes in one of their units?

anonymous Mon, 09/09/2002 - 08:40

Brock:
Yes it did appear on first units. Unfortunately it will continue... there are no plans and it is official that Yamaha will not correct it (its basically impossible due to the internal layout) although those individuals who are famous for high profile audio mods could possibly resolve the matter completely. The -10 dB RCA unbal.outs are very pure and noise free and are still capable of overdriving a mixer channel, so they have plenty of output and in general will not suffer any problems associated with unbal lines.
Phil

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