Raregroove,
A couple of thoughts... AKG 414, 500 to 700 bucks...Look for a used AKG C12a same capsuels as a C12 different body and electronics ....looks sort of like a 414 If your lucky $1500. I have seen U87's go for 800 bucks before, look around. Last but not least, my favorite mic in the budget catagory, [everyone join in!!! (they've all heard it before! :D )] ATM 4033!!!. .... Fats
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It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!

I agree with Fats on the 4033, I'm a big Audio Technica fan, really killer mics for not lotsa money; my own suggestion is check out the Rode NTK, as it's a really good sounding large diaphragm tube mic for under a grand, almost incredible until you try it, or if you don't want a tube mic try the NT 1000 also from Rode.

Hope this helps.

The 4033 is out of production I think but one of the things I like so much about them is they are fairly consistent from mic to mic...with the Rode stuff, the capsules are from China and they can vary widely from mic to mic...it's possible to match up a pair but your going to go through a bunch to get two that match up. Audio Technica manufactures their own capsules in house and the consistency is better. Another thing about the Chinese capsules is they are sold to a variety of manufactures. ATM only makes capsules for themselves although they are making a mic for someone else but I can't remember who it was...."senior moments".... Fats
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It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to ……

For more info and technical reviews on the rode check this out: [[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.prorec.c…"]Prorec.com[/]="http://www.prorec.c…"]Prorec.com[/] .

The capsule may be made in china but they sure look (and sound)good...

Cheers

doesn't soundelux have something in that range? i've heard great raves about their stuff. also try BLUE's stuff, in particular the Blueberry. it has a very nice smooth shimmery high end, really something to behold. the trade-off: not much low end, which could maybe be helpful for vocals... or maybe not.

jajjguy,
Do you own any of Blues products? I am curious as to what the build quality is? I bought a shock mount from Blue a few years ago for a C24 and it was the worst piece of sh*t I have ever seen. It practically crumbled in my hands when I took it out of the box. I contacted the company by phone and spoke with Skipper about it and he told me there was nothing he wanted to do for me...Needless to say I was very unhappy. After seeing a post here at RO regarding this same subject I received an email from him (5 years hence) offering to make it right! Too late, I sold the mic with the shock mount as it was and took the loss ($300+). Basically I threw in the mount for nothing seeing it was broken. Fats
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It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!

Personally, I think the Shure KSM32 is an extremely underrated microphone. I never hear anyone talking about them, but they're great mics. And you can pick one up for under $500. Anybody else using one of these? I love mine.

That's a shame. I don't own anything by them, just tried some stuff out. Can't speak to build quality. Others have spoken well of them, though.

I have 2 KSM32's and a KSM44 (in addition to TLM103, U87 etc).

I love the KSM32 especially on female vocals and guitar cabinets where you want a little extra 2k,

The KSM44 does equal work to the U87. It does a great job warming up nasily singers and is by far the quietist mic I have (quieter than the TLM103), I just finished tracking a 13 song CD with the guy I bought the U87 from and he selected the KSM44 over the U87 for all but one song for his vocals after we recorded the mic checks.

I have noticed these new Shure LD condensers being used a lot on WSM / Grand Ol' Opry for the bluegrass acts, Allison Krause, on Jerry Douglas' dobro and they have sounded very good from what I hear (but it is the teevee). It's hard to go wrong with most anything Shure makss. I have an old broadcast Shure "birdcage" from '49 and it still functions. The rubber and the silk fabric on the windscreen is rotted but it still passes a signal. Try that with an Audex mic in 60 years! I don't use it, it is more a collector thing, but I do keep toying with the idea of sending it to Evenston to be restored ........ Fats

Man, you can not be wrong with the At4050. It is even better than the 4033 which is a little sibilant and that provides you only one mic pattern. The At4050 is a monster, I myself use 3 on my daily job. It does cardioid, omni and figure of 8.

:p

That's strange about your 4060. We use ours probably 75% of the time for lead vocals, unless the singer just has a particular nuance (aka problem) to their tone requiring a different treatment. To me the 4060 has a nice crisp quality that requires very little tweaking, and sounds like a preprocessed vocal chain all in one mic. But, to each his own.

I have had good success with the 4047 for rock vocals. It has a nice presence peak and a gently rolled off high end for vocals that cut without screeching.

The Blue Mouse is good for making a vocal sound big and very up-front. It can have too much zing for some singers though. Whereas the 103 has a hyped high end, the Mouse is hyped in the upper mids and highs, really pushing the vocal forward.

The 4050 is a great mic, too, but for me a little boring. It is fairly neutral sounding, a little fluffy on the bottom if you get too close.

As you can tell, I'm kind of stuck on AT-40 series mics. I'd like to be able to give my opinion on 251's or U47's or C12's, but my locker doesn't reach quite that high......yet

Just for grins...don't forget the AT 3035...really is the right mic for many of our applications....I am also somewhat fond of the ADK A51 series II...recently finished a country project using these on vocals...we actually redid the vocals originally cut on the recently sold AT4060, as the lowball mics just sounded better for the application.

But that's just my opinion.

The mic to check out is the Soundeluxe U195. This mic sounds similar to a Neuman U47fet. It has a smooth top end and there is a fat switch if you want to thicken up a vocal or instrument. Also sounds great in front of almost everything else. I've used this mic to record almost everything on an album.In the $1k price range you can't do any better than the U195. Mercenary Audio sells them I believe.
Steve

Get on board and in line for a Stephen Paul Mic.

Nuff said.

For @1300.00 I heard and purchased a mic that makes my artists vocal sound very "appealing" to listen two.

Accentuated highs for clarity, Rich bottom. gave great body and presence for her, and the mid's were clear and defined.

The BLUE Dragonfly Deluxe.

Outperformed quite a few mics (for her voice) in a 16 mic test I performed.

Avalon 737 Mic Pre was the front end.

See yah round......

Bill,

I've been in line! Looking forward to Stephen's mic but don't know when the drop date is.

Thanks everyone for the suggestions. I may try out at AT4040 to tide me over or the Soundelux 195. My TLM 103 sounds too boxy and sibiliant for me, it's driving me crazy. Got good pres too, the Buzz MA2 and TubeTech MP1A.

raregroove

Dear Mr Cedar Flat Fats,
Could you tell me where you found out that Rode mics' capsules are made in China.
I await your generous reply,
Your humble supplicant,
Tom :roll:

Laska,

I can answer that.

RODE capsules are now and always have been sourced from China. Specifically, 797 Audio who also manufacture for Studio Projects.

Bodies are machined somewhere out around Mudgee I believe.

PCB's are assembled locally.

RODE have always been reluctant to overly advertise the origins of their components.......or for that matter their mics. The NT1 has always been rumoured to have been totally manufactured o/seas. Considering the similarities between the NT2 and a certain Behr####er LD mic, I have wondered about the local content in the NT2 as well.

RODE are currently claiming to be bringing ALL manufacturing to Australia in the near future......BUT, what I haven't seen them explain, is how they are going to manufacture in Aust., and stay competitive price-wise.

RODE's mics may be very good, but the company almost turned their form of deception into an artform.

BTW, most of this info came from phone conversations with RODE employees.

:cool:

Thanx HiString.....that really pisses me off.
As an Ozzie I finally thought, great, we finally produce something ourselves.......talk about taking deception into an artform.
So how the hell can they proclaim loudly & proudly..."Manufactured in Australia" on their boxes ?
I can answer that:
Why does a dog lick its' balls ?
Because it can !
They are sure as hell getting a phonecall from me !!! :D
Regards,
Tom

Laska,
I read that here on Forum, either Stephen Paul or Alan Hyatt. I am unabashedly a German Mic fan.. and I view all usurppers with a jaundiced eye. I know it's snobbish, but I also consider my mic purchases as an investment. I know if I spend a load on a Neumann or an AKG, in five or ten years I can sell it for at least a portion of what in spent on it originally. In some cases it even appreciates. Pehaps what Rode shoud say is "Assembled in Austrailia". It is a bit of a deception at best. Ahh, marketing executives. Lower life forms than a Lawyer or Doctor. They will say anything to move product. Just don't belive anything they say and you will be ok. As far as the Chineese capsuels go, I think everyone knows how I feel in regards to that question. Let it suffice for me to say I am glad to live in a place where it's still legal (for a while) to do what I'm doing right now. 'Nuff said. ............ Fats

Assembly is miscontrued as "Manufactured"

Because a unit has parts from all over the world does not mean in any way it changes the character of said product from the finished marketed product.

I will say this, if it was not for China, the motherboard in your computer would not exsist...as 90% of them are made there now.

It is a catch 22.

Buy with your heart.

Thanx Bill & Cedar,
I might add to your comment Bill:
"....and with your ears."

"There is no reality only perception"

Regards, Tom

Bill,
You have mentioned this to me before, several times. On the phone, and in Forum…So I decided to research this myself. In my case, as you know, I am running an ASUS motherboard in my DAW. I went to the ASUS site and I learned this;

Headquartered in Taipei, Taiwan, in the heart of the world's high-tech manufacturing center, ASUS leverages world-class R&D, highly skilled workers, and cost-effective material sourcing to design technology leading solutions. With manufacturing facilities in Taiwan: Taipei, Luchu, Nankan, and Kweishan, as well as in Suzhou, China…

(the Free Trade Zone)

Four out of five of ASUS's facilities are in Taiwan... Now all I have to figure out is, …Would I rather but my products from "Fascists" or "Commies"..? :D Some may point out there's not much difference. .......... Fats :confused:

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It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!

True...as loong as we can use it, get paid and all are happy with their Coupe Devilles and cracker jack box..it is all good

BTW.....my apologies to RareGroove for straying off his original topic a wee bit.
Regards, Tom

Tom,
IMO you have no need to apologise ... Just tell us what you think a good solution for the "Good Vocal Mic for under $1000" question is.... Fats
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It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!

My two cents.

If the artist is used to a handheld, do a 58.

If you want a condenser, look at the B&K 4004 or simply sign up for the new Stephen Paul mic.

If you want sibilance..the N word

I'm surprised that more of the "budget" priced or if you like "bang for buck" mics aren't being mentioned as viable options here.

:cool:

Does not get a better *value* than a SM58 in the hand. Many many fine productions are done this way..especially rock. It worked way back and it still does. It requires the artist knows what to do with it is all.

"It requires the artist knows what to do with it is all." -

Bill "ain't that the truth..." I just love it when I get a "new to recording" vocalist that, while promising as far as some interesting vocal quality, backs off the mic when singing quiet passages, and SWALLOWS it for the loud ones - been tempted a couple of times to duct tape their head to a wall and put the mic where I want it, wait for 'em to calm down about the duct tape and then ask 'em to "play it again, Sam"... Steve

LMFAO @ duct tape :D

There have been a couple of occasions recently where I taped a piece of string to the ceiling and let it hang in front of the mic, telling the singer "Don't let your nose touch the string".
Bill, you have heard that singer on that mp3 I posted, and believe me when he needs to he can really belt it out.

Chris O

:cool:

STEVE WROTE;

I've been tempted a couple of times to duct tape their head to a
wall and put the mic where I want it

Steve old chum... your watching entirely too much "Red Green"..... :s:

I'm a man....but I can change...if I have to......I guess....
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AKG 414....Why?
In my early years I was fortunate to work in the Audio Production Department of the ABC (Australian Broadcasting Commission") & with the infinite support of the Ozzie taxpayer we could pull any mic we wanted (including a couple of Telefunken World War II Army field mikz that I believe kicked off Mr Neumann's "career").
If we didn't have it on the shelves we just scribbled out a government order form & grabbed a dozen or so.
In the TV hangars & on location with portable mono/stereo Nagras & Uhers, OB vans & splits we recorded everything...from Frank Zappa to the New York Philharmonic & anything in between.
Believe me...when a perfectionist like Frank Zappa or Leonard Bernstein walks in & you have one hour to lay it down audiowise & videowise you better choose the right mics straight up or expect that if the result is less than perfect the wrath of the Gods will descend upon you.
After much dithering over so many choices & a very high pulse rate the mic that worked on the " what you hear (without anything switched on), is what you should get (everything on)" was the AKG414 !
"Flat as" frequency response on the scope set to a 5db range...no intrusive " tailored " response curves for vocals or various instruments.
One proviso to all that I just said is that I'm talking about 30-35 & on years ago (I'm nudging 60) & the fact that I haven't tried the "new breed" of 414s obviously means I could definately stand corrected.
The closest to emulating this in a dynamic mic is my ole' mate...the Shure SM57 as the SM58 has that "tailored for vocal etc" shaping...unfortunately the obvious diversity & range of the human voice means that not everybody fits into that particular "tailored frequency response" curve.
So the obvious choice for me has, & always will be a "Flat", "Neutral", "Uncolored" ," Transparent"...("A rose by any other name would smell as sweet") mic.
Regards, Tom

" There is no reality, only perception. "

Tom,
Thanks for the post. I love hearing those old "war stories". In reference to the early Neumann's, the first mic manufactured by them for commercial sale was in 1923, the CMV3 "bottle mic" (now being emulated by others) ..also known as the "Hitler mic" due to the fact that there are many pictures of him speaking into one. I would be interested to know more about the military field mics you mentioned as I can find nothing about these in any of the literature I have on Neumann ... Fats

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It's my opinion, I'll play with it if I want to!

Ya Tom ye old bloke. Great that you shared it with us. Bugger me that the 57 and 58 is taylored, I simply like the Bruel&Kjaer jobs meself.

Any bloody bloke that would not have his arse in a meat stew would use a 57 in a pinch but regularly right the 414 is a hip mic.

I am sitting around on the piss mate on the xmas eve with me and me doggie, that is spoiled by roo meat.

Hey, How is my aussie there???

Just messing mate. Wankers all!!!! LOL

Sorry, it is now party time in the USA

ROFLMGDFAO

Bill, I'd just love to actually hear you saying all that. :)

Regards,

ChrisO :cool:

OK Fats....these links can explain faster than I can type plus take you on a real history trip regarding the "Hitler Bottle Mic" which is much the same mic as the "German Army Field Mic" & so muuuch more, as a matter of fact maybe these links would be of some interest to all mic buffs:

http://telefunkenusa.com/history/

http://history.acusd.edu/gen/recording/microphones2.html

Regards, Tom

The AT-4047's work very well for both male and female vocal, with less "boom on the bottom" than the 4033 .. it's also very quiet and extremely open. I've also had great results as drum overheads with them, and on elec and bass guitar amps. I had a pair of 4033's and replaced them with the 4047's .. to me a change from a great mic to an even better mic.

Hi HiString,
I second the motion to use the croc hunter as croc bait & to hear Bill say all that.
Maybe Bill can record it, drop it down to an MP3 & give us a link to have a listen. :D
Regards, Tom