hi cucco...nice to hear you're liking the ff800, too...

Are you running a single 800?
If so keep it that way. I had two for a short amount of time. I had lot of trouble get both units converting in cooperation. But yes the ADC's are nice. I did a quick test before I got rid of them, so I could compare it too my new cranesong ADC. And the FF800 did pretty well. I have to say to my ear the Cranesong Hedd was a bit clearer and had slightly better low end response. But it was close.

Oh and the PCB layout on the FF800 is great!
have fun.

I'm envious, Jeremy; I've had my eye on one of these for a while now, and am getting closer to making a decision for an important recording in December. Looks like a winner, indeed. Please keep us posted on how it's going with this. (Although it looks like you're head over hells in love with this already!) 8-)

The Multiface II is also interesting, but it doesn't have the pre's and it needs a PCI card to hook it up to a computer. (I see that RME has come out with PC Express cards now, too, although that COULD be just vaporware at the moment....) The Fireface 800 still looks like the best deal overall.

I have had one since '06 (I think) and also have a FF400. Anyway, I have been very content with mine. The unit is quite good out of the box. As usual, mine is highly modified and now compares very well against much higher-end converters. I still haven't yet got the HP amp to be something special, but its still totally usable. There is another thread floating somewhere discussing this.

The driver/mixer software is mo' pro. I have found that other (not to be named) manufacturer's drivers to be poorly implemented. In fact, I have found level shifts through these drivers when their controls where supposedly set at unity.

Cucco wrote: and loving it so far!

It sure looks that way.

I've always heard good things about the way RME integrate their hardware AND software to produce a complete solution.

Now that you've got that system up and running, your next purchase ought to be a new 'exclamation mark' key - I'm sure you've worn out your existing one. :wink:

Simmosonic wrote:

Now that you've got that system up and running, your next purchase ought to be a new 'exclamation mark' key - I'm sure you've worn out your existing one. :wink:

Ha.....I think I've worn out my period key first..........
!

your next purchase ought to be a new 'exclamation
mark' key

And the next post by Cucco, I bet, will be "got a laptop, it's freaky
light !!!!!" Right, Jeremy ?
Just kidding. Anyway, it seems that Onyx 800R could be a nice
extention for this RME 800, isn't it ? Or you are going for some
better pre's ? Cheers,

The 800R would be a great option for extra channels through lightpipe. They'll occassionally get some use. I'll likely use the Graces or the ones that Zilla's making for me right now though.

I use the Fireface all the time, but not usually for recording with mics. I use it mostly with software to set midi orchestral music to indie films and to do audio editing. The drivers are good although there are some issues with the WDM drivers. In terms of recording with mics, the preamps have very low gain untill turned way up, then the gain increases very quickly at a very short ratio of turning the knob. No other complaints except that the phones jack broke inside but was fixable. I use it for recording multitracked recordings when tracks need to be layered one at a time, but prefer to use linked Sound Devices recorders for location or basic studio recording. I'm interested to hear about any mods for the Fireface. It's definately a good all around problem solving interface.

As I mentioned in another thread, I picked up one and really like it so far. Got a great deal on it locally, from 8th Street music here in Phila.

I'm using Vista & Seq. V.8.3 on my laptop, so this should be interesting, once I have it up and running. So far, so good. The ASIO drivers come right up, with no problems. The WDM drivers need some re-naming, and RME doesn't recommend using them anyway....we'll see! 8-)

I've only used ASIO thus far. I don't suppose I have a need for the WDM drivers, so I don't anticipate any issues with them. (The software that I use...Sequoia, Finale, Garritan, Reason 3.0, Fruity Loops, etc. all support ASIO.)

edit...

I definitely agree about the pres being strongest in the final throws. It makes it a pain for minor adjustments, but for a single spot mic, etc, I think it will do the trick just fine. We'll see tomorrow - I'm doing a recording of a large, collegiate marching band and will need to use the mic pres in addition to my existing ones. Should be interesting.

As a user of the FW800 for almost two years now, I can second most of whats been said above. But I have a question for those of you who use it with a PC laptop!

How do you connect?

The regular 4-pin outlet You find on 101% of laptops I find localy, seem to be a pityful excuse för a FW port.. I've been testing an "EXpressCard" with FW400 & 800 port on my latest laptop and while I'm not totaly satisfied, it works..

What sollutions are there?

/ptr

I too wonder about the FW issue, esp with Sony laptops, which have the 4 pin FW connector (which they call i-link) as standard issue, and usually nothing else, other than USB 2.0 connectors. This is a shame, since Sony was one of the first with this anyway. I've never been comfortable with it in general. At one point, on my previous laptop, the 4 pin connector just stopped working. (Probably stress & breakage on one of the tiny, unsupported pins inside the connector). For 3-4 years since then, I've been using a PCMCIA/FW card with dual connetions instead, with no problems at all.

I almost didn't buy my current laptop (PCG-5G3L)because of this very issue, until I made sure the new ExpressCard slot would support FW adapters. It does, so I did, and so far so good. HOWEVER, the springloaded mechanism seems to be VERY hair-trigger in that it could easily be bumped and pop right back out of the socket, plus it's up near the front of the machine now, instead of the middle of the unit. Pretty scary, and I might have to start gaff-taping things down again when I'm out on remotes.

Otherwise, I don't know how else to get FW into this thing, unless there's an ethernet to FW adapter option out there somewhere. I plan to stick with the 6pin to ExpressCard option for now, with a 6 to 4 pin FW cable ready as a back up, just in case....

Another VERY sweet little extra with the Fireface 800 is the inclusion of Samplitude 8 SE. I didn't know this was included, and it solved a couple of silly/stupid problems with my laptop upgrade.

For years, I had simply been upgrading my legal copy of Samplitude, through V5, 6 and 7 on my laptop. (V7 being good enough to still use in the field for live tracks, on those rare occasions when I'd forget the dongle for my copy of Sequoia V8. Arrrrggg!)

With the new laptop, I was forced to go without my old copy of Samplitude (long story short - almost impossible to load it witithout an A floppy drive, which holds the now-outdated user validation keys, etc. etc.) so I just put my legit copy of Sequoia on there and pray I won't ever forget the dongle.

I opened the FW 800 box and - surprise! - a copy of Samplitude V8.3 SE was in there. Now of course it only allows up to 8 tracks of recording at a time, but I can work with that in most cases, or I can upgrade to the next level for more tracks. Very nice surprise, indeed.

I should mention that one disadvantage of using linked Sound Devices
recorders compared to using a Fireface / laptop for location or basic studio
recording is that playing back linked Sound Devices recorders from the machines themselves, to check the mix etc., is not synchronised between the units, and therefore not usefull, unless you want to listen to an Elvis style slap back delay on a classical ensemble. Not something they go out of their way to tell you unless asked. But it looks like they are working towards it in the firmware updates. Some advantages are having built in ms decoding for monitering without having to process it, much smaller size and possibly better sound (or at least a different sound character), and easier to adjust preamp volume controls with more gain.

For people needing a similar interface to the Fireface (but without
firewire) for a studio, with twice as many preamps, check out the ESI Maxio, looks like a monster. I have used an earlier version of it and the audio quality was impressive. There's an interesting review of it online
from S.O.S.

Dumb question time....Jeremey (and other FW 800 users): What are you using to get from your pre's outputs to the inputs of the 800? Anything special?

I'm putting mine in the same rack as my m802, directly underneath it, actually. So, I'll need about 6-12" at MOST of cabling, going from XLR outs on the Grace to balanced 1/4" inputs on the RME. I might just roll my own at this point, having enough raw materials on hand, but I'm wondering all the same if it would be cheaper to just go with something off the shelf. Any suggestions?

From back in my commercial studio days, I had a bunch of 6" XLR F to TRS M cables that I had either rolled or purchased. I just used those and then banded the short slack together using a velcro tie.

The thing I am really digging is the lack of cables needed for this system.

In my old system, I'd have the snake coming into the pre, an 8 channel XLR to DB25 snake running from pre to converter (try to get one of these in lengths shorter than 6'!! and making them is a pain in the butt!), plus the DB25 to DB26 cable from the converter to the computer, the DB26 cable to the AES breakout cable for the Benchmark, a Word clock cable or two and if necessary (for more than 8 channels) another DB25 to DB26 cable. This was about 7 pounds of cable plus the whole mess of wires all over the place.

Now, I've got the snake coming into the preamp, the 8 very short leads and a firewire cable. I'm down to less than a pound of cable and hardly any cable spaghetti.

I just used the Fireface last night for the first major engagement recording a college marching band for their annual CD release. The RME worked without a hiccup or a surprise. I was thoroughly impressed. What was so friggin amazing was the routing capabilities.

I had the outputs routed this way -

Outputs 1&2 - Feeding the Adam A7s with the mix as I intended to hear it.
Outputs 3&4 - Feeding the backup recorder with the same mix as above.
Outputs 5&6 - Feeding an external headphone amp with the rough mix
Outputs 7&8 - Feeding another headphone amp with a boosted drum mix so rhythm sections could clearly be heard.

Cool...

I did have one minor horror story last night. It's a bit off topic, so I'll keep it short. No names will be used as I really enjoy working with this client, but every once in a while, someone comes along and makes things difficult, even with your good clients...

So, I set up my mics in a hostile environment (think recording a 250 piece marching band outdoors on a practice field in about 70% humidity with rain clouds looming overhead). I had a grand total of 10 minutes to place the mics since they had to get going as quickly as possible - they had to relinquish the field at a set time.

I set everything up where I was sure it would work - A pair of cardioids overhead in wide ORTF, wide omnis as flanks, omni spot on the bass cabinets, XY flanks over snares, AB Omnis over tonal bass drums (none of these were "cheap" mics either. The omnis over the tonals were Schoeps CMC62s).

During the VERY short sound check, I was pleasantly surprised to hear that I had nailed the setup right off the bat. No tweaking of placement necessary! (I love it when that happens!!!)

So, I was a bit surprised when, during the first take of the first track, I noticed that the tonal bass drums started getting weak disappearing. The band directors commented on it too..."Somethings wrong with the bass drums - we need more sound from them."

After the second take, I said "I'll go change out the mics and get a different sound."

I go out to find that the Schoeps (which I had placed on VERY heavy stands at about 8 feet up and 4 feet in front of the tonals aiming towards them) had been lowered and moved.

The drum instructor told me that he felt that the sound would be better if the mics were in different places so he moved them DURING the take!

Trying to maintain my composure, I said that they were where they needed to be. I proceeded to replace the mics however with a pair of LDC cardioids. As I was doing that, he asked if I could put the mics about 7 or 8 feet further back (in front of the cymbals and quads, etc.). I stated that this would not work. Again, he said that he felt that it would sound better this way and that I should do it anyway. He left a little bit perturbed when I wouldn't pay attention.

I wound up talking to the guy after the sessions and he turned out to be a cool guy, but that still didn't make me want to beat him any less at that moment!

Anyway - the client is great, the band is great and I love the work, so I can live with the occassional trauma of someone manhandling my mics.

J

PS -
Simmo - sorry if I used too many exclamations this time...............or too many periods... ;-)

Well, I would tell the Conductor, "I never want to see that dude on the set again!"
The mixer should be in charge during all recordings.

Totally agree about the FF800 and the built-in mixer. A lot of functionality in that box. Solidly working with my computer.

A small piece of warning. I had a set of headphones plugged into the front output. Somehow, a large pull on the cord, and the headphone output was physically broken. As it is mounted directly on the internal circuit board, it got slightly cracked as well. Seems I was half lucky, half unlucky as the repair was not that expensive.

What I will do however is to mount a separate headphone output in the rack, with a cable and a side access plug in the FF800. If the pull happens again, then only the separate headphone output will be affected.

Gunnar

Not to hijack this thread with a competitor, but has anyone experienced the new TC Electronic StudioKonnect 48 box yet?

http://www.tcelectronic.com/StudioKonnekt48.asp

DavidSpearritt wrote: Not to hijack this thread with a competitor, but has anyone experienced the new TC Electronic StudioKonnect 48 box yet?

http://www.tcelectronic.com/StudioKonnekt48.asp

That was the other device that I was seriously considering. (Of course, it wasn't shipping at the time, but I did do a lot of research).

First, I liked the flexibility of the unit and the fact that it has some hardware DSP for plug-ins plus the capability to more easily integrate external devices as hardware effects.

However, I didn't like that only 8 channels of ADAT were available at maximum. Sometimes I do hit the 20 or more track mark and need the ability to add more tracks via different converters.

Also, I listened to some of the TC devices that are currently on the market (Konnect24 and Konnect8) and while they sounded pretty good, I liked the transparency of the RME better. The TC imparted a thicker tone to everything - as if trying to be warm. It wasn't much, but it was there. Don't get me wrong, I could very easily work with the sound of the TC - it was quite nice (and will likely be getting the Konnect 24 for my in-studio work), but the RME edged it out in overall sound. (The pres were a notch better on the RME too - which are surprisingly quite good! I won't hesitate to use the RME pres when I need a few extra channels.)

The final thing that I liked was the fact that RME designed their own Firewire solution versus relying on a 3rd party manufacturer. This makes me feel like I'm going to get better support. It might just be in my head.

Cucco wrote:
I did have one minor horror story last night. It's a bit off topic, so I'll keep it short. No names will be used as I really enjoy working with this client, but every once in a while, someone comes along and makes things difficult, even with your good clients...

So, I set up my mics in a hostile environment (think recording a 250 piece marching band outdoors on a practice field in about 70% humidity with rain clouds looming overhead). I had a grand total of 10 minutes to place the mics since they had to get going as quickly as possible - they had to relinquish the field at a set time.

I set everything up where I was sure it would work - A pair of cardioids overhead in wide ORTF, wide omnis as flanks, omni spot on the bass cabinets, XY flanks over snares, AB Omnis over tonal bass drums (none of these were "cheap" mics either. The omnis over the tonals were Schoeps CMC62s).

During the VERY short sound check, I was pleasantly surprised to hear that I had nailed the setup right off the bat. No tweaking of placement necessary! (I love it when that happens!!!)

So, I was a bit surprised when, during the first take of the first track, I noticed that the tonal bass drums started getting weak disappearing. The band directors commented on it too..."Somethings wrong with the bass drums - we need more sound from them."

After the second take, I said "I'll go change out the mics and get a different sound."

I go out to find that the Schoeps (which I had placed on VERY heavy stands at about 8 feet up and 4 feet in front of the tonals aiming towards them) had been lowered and moved.

The drum instructor told me that he felt that the sound would be better if the mics were in different places so he moved them DURING the take!

Trying to maintain my composure, I said that they were where they needed to be. I proceeded to replace the mics however with a pair of LDC cardioids. As I was doing that, he asked if I could put the mics about 7 or 8 feet further back (in front of the cymbals and quads, etc.). I stated that this would not work. Again, he said that he felt that it would sound better this way and that I should do it anyway. He left a little bit perturbed when I wouldn't pay attention.

I wound up talking to the guy after the sessions and he turned out to be a cool guy, but that still didn't make me want to beat him any less at that moment!

Anyway - the client is great, the band is great and I love the work, so I can live with the occassional trauma of someone manhandling my mics.

GGGGRRRRRRRR!!!!!!!!!!

I was on location again last night - same group - same drum guy and again, the guy picks my CMC 62s up and drags them across the field without my permission in the middle of a take!

I told the main conductor last night - this is the last time. I don't even let my wife touch those mics without her telling me how she's going to handle them in advance of touching them. (She's become a very well trained studio assistant!)

Hey, I told you to kick the mofo out of there!! During a take- Touch the Schoeps? Them's fighten' words.

JoeH, post: 234162 wrote: Another VERY sweet little extra with the Fireface 800 is the inclusion of Samplitude 8 SE. I didn't know this was included, and it solved a couple of silly/stupid problems with my laptop upgrade.

For years, I had simply been upgrading my legal copy of Samplitude, through V5, 6 and 7 on my laptop. (V7 being good enough to still use in the field for live tracks, on those rare occasions when I'd forget the dongle for my copy of Sequoia V8. Arrrrggg!)

With the new laptop, I was forced to go without my old copy of Samplitude (long story short - almost impossible to load it witithout an A floppy drive, which holds the now-outdated user validation keys, etc. etc.) so I just put my legit copy of Sequoia on there and pray I won't ever forget the dongle.

I opened the FW 800 box and - surprise! - a copy of Samplitude V8.3 SE was in there. Now of course it only allows up to 8 tracks of recording at a time, but I can work with that in most cases, or I can upgrade to the next level for more tracks. Very nice surprise, indeed.

Older thread but hoping you guys are able to answer a few related question here rather than reinventing to thread.

I use Sequoia 11 now ( time has passed and new version :) ) I'm doing remote recordings this winter with a new remote system so its new to me. From what I'm getting here, I am able to download a limited version of Samplitude for these projects? Saves any risk of loosing my Sequoia codemeter yes?

Link555, post: 233833 wrote: Are you running a single 800?
If so keep it that way. I had two for a short amount of time. I had lot of trouble get both units converting in cooperation. But yes the ADC's are nice. I did a quick test before I got rid of them, so I could compare it too my new cranesong ADC. And the FF800 did pretty well. I have to say to my ear the Cranesong Hedd was a bit clearer and had slightly better low end response. But it was close.

Oh and the PCB layout on the FF800 is great!
have fun.

JackAttack,

as a referrence, Like you, I have two FF 800 as you know but haven't tried using them both in a live setting. You've done this correct?

audiokid, post: 355426 wrote: JackAttack,
as a referrence, Like you, I have two FF 800 as you know but haven't tried using them both in a live setting. You've done this correct?

Yes I have. It works great. I don't normally have them racked together but when I need both for remote that is what I do. I loop the firewire cable under the hook and then plug it in (on both units). Also, I have my units marked 1 & 2 so that I don't get confused when traversing the TotalMix gui. Your smallest serial number will be #1, then the next smallest #2 etc.

Now, it's pretty rare for me to need more inputs than one FF800 will provide even at 88.2k. Usually I double up if I need more than 8 mic preamps. The second set of 8 preamps then comes into FF#1 via ADAT. Then the 2nd FF800 provides my link to the HD24XR via ADAT and also a 2-bus mix to my PMD671 via S/PDif. This season I have taken to tracking everything into the Glyph via Reaper. Reaper has not glitched once for me and even if it did, that's why the HD24XR is there. One catch with the Glyph. For it to work flawlessly, the FF800's are chained via 9 pin cable and then the Glyph is connected to the 2nd FF800 via a 6 pin firewire cable.

FYI: RME just released the newest driver for the Fireface units. It streamlines the gui a bit.

Chris -
I also do a similar thing.
When I bought my FF800, it came with a copy of Samplitude. It's a limited track count version, but IIRC, it's limited to something like 99 tracks. I'll use that version while on location from time to time when I either:
Forget my dongle
Don't want to risk losing/damaging the dongle
Have multiple recordings at the same time in different locations.

Cheers-
J.

Reaper is unreal... and so stable and so fast to load and takes almost no CPU compared to the other DAWs. It blows my mind.
Reaper seems like a really good choice for location laptop DAW solutions so I'm watching you John! Samplitude is my choice DAW for sure and I'm getting more and more comfortable with it. Its stellar IMO. I should look but does Magix offer a free Samplitude that would be great for just tracking on location? I'm afraid I could loose my Sequoia codemeter stick too. Plus, I don't need all that for simple tracking on location, do I? Location recording is a new business opening up for me.

I've never imported audio into Samplitude (sequoia) yet. Can we import reaper tracks and what are the pro's con's to having to do this?

Good to see you here Cucco!

admin doing backend stuff for aka

I've gotta try Reaper!
I'd really like to, ideally, grab my FF800, a 4 channel snake, 4 thin canare cables, mics/clips/stands and my MacBook Pro and do a recording. Right now, I'm lugging 500lbs of gear on location. Ugh... I could run Sequoia/Samplitude on Bootcamp and save having to bring out the PC too.

Anyway - yes, you should easily be able to import files from Reaper into Sequoia/Samplitude. I'm certain that Reaper saves the files as .wav files. Just find out how they're organized and labeled. Click the "w" key on your keyboard when you've selected your destination track in Sequoia and then select the file. Couldn't be easier.

J

Reaper will save them with whatever label you give them whether that is track1 or SteinwayD. I skinned Reaper to match the coloring of Audition but there are Logic skins as well as (I thought) Samplitude skins. It took a bit of digging to find the spot to deposit them other than doing a search within the preferences but for you Win7/Vista peoples the proper place is:

LocalDisk->Users->whatever user name->AppData->Roaming->Reaper->ColorThemes

Dump your bitmap folder here and make sure the *.ReaperTheme file is outside the bitmap folder. It should be apparent from the default setup of the latest version which includes a couple of themes.

Cucco-Reaper is fast. And it takes no resources really to speak of. For fun I did some mixdown stuff with the wifi card on and surfing the web at the same time. No issues. I wouldn't do that on a gig mind you but Audition would stutter with that kind of interference.

I can have 5 stereo submixes! 1 for me (digital out to my monitor controller), 1 for the vocalist ("MORE ME!"), 1 for the guitar ("WAY more me"), one for the bass ("DUH....I like me...") and 1 for the drums ("I hit things...YAY")

Hahahahaha very nice cucco!! This is going to be my second interface after my Presonus FireStudio Tube, how do those two compare?

The Firestudio isn't in the same class as the Fireface. That doesn't make it bad but it isn't equal.