I WANNA SOUND BETTER NOW!!! :frown:

I'm all for progress and bigger and badder and better but sometimes Avid's methods and tactics are a little, uh, questionable, IMO.

RTAS users are basically being dropped off the wagon. Sorry boys, if you wanna ride with us you gotta spend more moolah.
And more than one RTAS plugin at a time? Huh? What did I miss?
Clip based volume control..woo hoo. Been doin' that for years.
More power? Jesus, just how much more power does one need these days, exactly? MUST HAVE MORE PLUGINS ALWAYS!! MORE! MORE! MORE!

If you had to convert each and every plugin, mixer channel and track of what even a core2duo native system is capable of into real life you'd need an aircraft hanger to accommodate the studio. There would just not be enough racks in your town to hold the gear that would fill them.

A couple of UAD cards are just fine, thanks.

And now a NEW plugin format to spring on the poor developers of plugins that people ACTUALLY USE AND LOVE. Sorry guys, I feel for you.

What else? OH, EQ on every channel...nice. Another feature everyone else has been enjoying natively for years. 32-bit float? Also been standard natively for years.

Yeah, I get the power thing but come on, computers are so powerful these days I'd wager that if you're a normal working stiff you seldom beg for it if your machine is less than 4 years old.

It is clear [least from the fact that they demonstrated PT10 with a post session] that AVID is moving toward where the money is: Post-prodution and film. They don't really care about their music users any more because all their support seems to be going out the window. That's just my opinion, so shoot me if you disagree.

I dunno. Almost everyone I know that owns pro tools, HD or otherwise, is disgruntled if they have been a loyal supporter for an extended period of time because they get hit in the pocket all too often and all too very hard.

Cheers :)

Well MoFacta, it's difficult to dissagree with you. They certainly love to toot their horn over things that have been available in other DAWs for a long time now. Then, I was tubing and this caught my eye:

Some stinging points in there.

I think, maybe I should invest in one more decent mic an preamp combination. I can upgrade to XI for $99.

Sounds like a good move! Build your front end.

hueseph, post: 381716 wrote: ...Some stinging points in there...

So the point of the ad seems to be that if I find a time machine that will take me back to 2009 I should buy Sonar...in 2009. Some day they might want to make an ad about why you should buy Sonar in 2012. Not saying that you shouldn't. Just saying that I don't find the "we've had these features for years" (with the unsaid "but now that advantage is gone") argument compelling.

I feel for Hue, its a tough decision. I think upgrading Sonar X1 is advancing opposed to going backwards with the HD system but if you buy a complete used system it will be the best results for the least amount of money. But it is a dead end road. But maybe that doesn't matter.

If you stick with Sonar X1,you need pretty good gear to get as good a sound as the HD system unless you are planning to buy a few goodies.

What ADDA do you have right now?

Sonar X1 and a used Orpheus (they are selling for $2900) would blow an HD system out the door. That give you 4 pre's and wonderful converters.

How many ins do you need?

Do you need 2 or 4 sterling IO or 8 okay IO?

Are you doing this just to record yourself or others 2 or 4 tracks at a time or do you need multiple IO? I think these are the questions you need to ask yourself.

I don't think it's a "we've had these features for years" (with the unsaid "but now that advantage is gone") argument. It's more of a "we've had these for years and surpassed those standards long ago and it's time to move on" argument. I'm not saying that there's no good reason to buy ProTools or an HD system but seriously, Sonar has a 64 bit float engine now. Some of the included plugins with Sonar are very nice, though you'd never know that from their video demonstrations.

After the PT10 demonstration I happened to catch some conversation going on between Brian and one of the attendees. A lot of questions were asked about stability and one of the things brought out was that it was necessary to disable video playback in order to get the functionality that he was demonstrating during the post session. Really it's not a big deal but why didn't he mention it during the presentation? Little things like that make my stomach hurt. Don't hide things. Just lay it on the line and if the product is good, we'll buy it.

The other thing was plug in support. He was adamant that we know that RTAS is supported in ProTools 10. He didn't mention that they would drop that support when 64 bit goes live. Not until, I asked him. That struck a nerve. He would not even acknowledge me after that question. I wasn't being vindictive or spiteful. I just wanted to know because I have some money invested in RTAS plugins.

Like I said, I'm not saying Pro Tools isn't a smart move for many people. I just wish they would lay it on the line instead of hiding behind features that really aren't that new.

If you are going with PT HD, you could conatact Bryon Low at Annex and ask him what he thinks you could get a used HD system for. (complete with cabling, plugins and computer). Keep you on his Radar. Guys upgrading are always looking for easy ways to dump their old systems. If he can connect the dots for clients, he will. He's done this for me over the years. He knows A LOT of people in the PT world.
You could also put up an AD over the the slutz , "looking for a complete HD system in Lower Mainland". You will get bites if you are patient.

audiokid, post: 381739 wrote: If you are going with PT HD, you could conatact Bryon Low at Annex and ask him what he thinks you could get a used HD system for. (complete with cabling, plugins and computer). Keep you on his Radar. Guys upgrading are always looking for easy ways to dump their old systems. If he can connect the dots for clients, he will. He's done this for me over the years. He knows A LOT of people in the PT world.
You could also put up an AD over the the slutz , "looking for a complete HD system in Lower Mainland". You will get bites if you are patient.

Yeah. That's a great idea. I don't know Byron but I'm acquainted with Kerry, though just barely. I never even considered talking to him about it. I'd hate to think that he feels any sort of disdain toward these posts. Yes, he knows I post regarding these presentations. At least I think he knows.

more fun to ponder.
Sonar will run like hot Damn on a good PC, no hickups, just blazing. What converters are you using?

Curious, Have you looked at this?
[[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.rolandus…"]Roland U.S. - V-STUDIO 700: Digital Audio Workstation[/]="http://www.rolandus…"]Roland U.S. - V-STUDIO 700: Digital Audio Workstation[/]

hueseph, post: 381740 wrote: Yeah. That's a great idea. I don't know Byron but I'm acquainted with Kerry, though just barely. I never even considered talking to him about it. I'd hate to think that he feels any sort of disdain toward these posts. Yes, he knows I post regarding these presentations. At least I think he knows.

Don't worry about that. They are salesman ( good ones but in sales). I've experienced this as well. You are saying things very clearly and have noted a very spot on point. And they aren't chiming in here. They are too busy.

http://duc.avid.com/showthread.php?t=313621

This whole thread is describing flipping used HD rigs into cheaper upgrades to HD Native etc. Don't know if this helps or not.

Sent from my DROIDX using Tapatalk

I also PM'd Hue and suggested the StudioLive 24.4.2. I have one that I'm selling (hate to but need more money for front end). I just got asked to hold it until next week. But there is no money down yet. Just saying.... and IMO its the best deal going in that price range for 24 tracks with decent pre's and 24 IO plus software. All you need is a firewire input and a good PC or Mac and you are rocking. It would be 4 times the system he has now but it is what it is.

These are exciting times. Lots of system are aligning themselve up with pro tools.

The way I look at it, spend a whack of doe or be smart and stick with the best project studio system you need until you are ready to fork over 10 to 20 grand for the modular pro system.

How many tracks do you need at once?
Do you need 16 okay or 2 stellar IO?

Samplitude 12 is killer.The best Acoustic music system on the planet IHO. But you need a decent converter/interface to make it what it is.
Sonar X1 is killer for electronic and acoustic. But you need a decent converter/interface too.

You can sure sense the animosity towards Avid. That thread is one of so many spiraling. AES is coming. More buzz coming soon.

hueseph, post: 381655 wrote: Yeah. I get that. What I don't get is why use an expansion chassis for a card that is only PCI.

If you already have just PCI, the expansion chassis is kind of a mute point. The whole idea is that you can get PCI HD cards for cheap so you can max out the 7 slots of the chassis for pretty cheap and get a super powerful system. So for the same price (or even cheaper) of a PCIe HD3 you can have a PCI HD7.