I take it you bought stock?

Sadly no.... I'd been watching it for the last few months thinking about buying some.... but I missed this 20% jump.

However, more than the stock news... It's good the see some profit kick in after a 4-year gap. THAT is what is good for all of us. Companies need to be profitable to advance the technologies that we all use.

You should have caught them when their stock dropped to just above $6 earlier this year. By now you'd be laughing. Have you been following PT 10 and HDX? I'm not so sure this crest will last long.

I've already bought two PT 10 HD Native systems.... they are running excellent on Lion.

There is a new generation of musicians that don't need PT anymore. They don't even need to play an instrument and hardly sing well. The new musicians are DJ's that play beats and take great honour in looping tracks on the fly. Its too much work learning an instrument. It bores me to death, but its how it going and its growing. The plug-in boomers are creating a new economy of the music industry. Avid is way behind on this. Many of us feel Avid/ Pro Tools best years are behind them. The whole HD thing is so over rated and being replaced by new systems. UA Apollo is going to eat Native alive. Just watch. Invest in that company, not Avid.

Just thought I'd toss that in for some fun!

There are lots of fun tools used to create different genres of music. However, I think the Pro Tools workflow has a pretty secure position in most situations. And when the full benefit of the Euphonix acquisition is realized.... It's gonna get even better. We have yet to see what the Eucon protocol will bring to a C24 type device.

It sounds good but who is going to keep paying high prices for products in this new economy that become dated so fast you can only trade it in with Avid. People are catching on to the Avid scam which is, they charge outrages prices for their hardware and then give it back to you on a trade in to keep you hooked. Mean while, the rest of the industry is passing them by with modular products that can be integrated with the rest of the world. I just don't see it anymore. We also know that Pro Tools does not sound better than the least expensive DAW out there.

I wonder what age group uses Pro Tools HD. I would predict its between 30 and 50 and they are all wise to the business now. Its a new generation coming and it isn't the Pro Tools crowd.

Pro Tools is not going to lose it's post production users. That is where they have laid their foundation. That is where HDX excels. Other DAWs are easily as good but none of them currently have the DSP power that an HDX system has. Small market though.

The problem is that the big time Music recording studio has become a thing of the past. All of the production has gone to the project studio and the home studio. Sure, for the most part there is something largely lacking in the home studio but the internet is closing the gap. The average joe is learning. People know about room nodes and absorption. They are coming to understand how to construct a good mix.

For better or worse this is the case. And, though there are many millions of bad artists and poor recording engineers out there, there are still others who have got a knack for it. Home production is getting better and better. That is where the Pro Tools market is losing foot hold. Not every project studio can afford an HDX system and for the price, they can get a smokin' rig with an A/D, D/A converter of their choice and probably some change left over for at least one really nice preamp.

Emulations of high end gear are getting progressively better. Mics are getting better and cheaper. As much as I don't want to see the boutique gear fading, it's happening. It's a blessing and a curse.

Avid is clearly moving away from music support and more into the game of post production. It's obvious. That's where all the budgets are these days.

Cheers :)

Oh, and one more thing I wanted to say was that because of what hueseph pointed out, those who make a living off of audio are finding it more and more difficult.

What is the solution? Is pro audio going to be a dead industry, bypassed by the internet and vintage emulations?

I'm scared.

Cheers :(

hueseph, post: 384177 wrote: Pro Tools is not going to lose it's post production users. That is where they have laid their foundation. That is where HDX excels. Other DAWs are easily as good but none of them currently have the DSP power that an HDX system has. Small market though.

After watching Fab's video on the Apollo at NAMM 2012, this is not a problem anymore. You can process audio using plug-ins on the way in and during mixing. The Apollo has a UAD QUAD built in so who cares about what Avid has now. UA just took over. And more are coming...

The Apollo appears to be a fantastic interface for music production for sure.... BUT...

hueseph was referencing the importance of HDX to the post industry... And in that realm, an HDX rig will be the better tool for high end users.

Yes, but that market (pro audio) is diminishing fast. Only to make a point, my system is every bit as pristine as an Avid system already. But I am no longer interested in running so many plug-ins anymore. The hybrid crowd is growing. The pro audio industry is realizing they are a trap. The more you use, the more it seems you need another plug-in to fix something.

The wanker world is more into plug-ins for their looping software so why would they invest in a high end Avid system. Follow? The great divide is happening.

I'm simply tossing in the devils advocate to keep us grounded here.

audiokid, post: 384203 wrote: Yes, but that market (pro audio) is diminishing fast. Only to make a point, my system is every bit as pristine as an Avid system already. But I am no longer interested in running so many plug-ins anymore. The hybrid crowd is growing. The pro audio industry is realizing they are a trap. The more you use, the more it seems you need another plug-in to fix something.

The wanker world is more into plug-ins for their looping software so why would they invest in a high end Avid system. Follow? The great divide is happening.

I'm simply tossing in the devils advocate to keep us grounded here.

I believe with the shift to the AAX format, many in "pro-audio" will thin out their messy collections of mediocre plug-ins, and stay focused on a smaller selection of well-crafted, "new" plug-ins.

And as for the growth in hybrid systems???? I think that approach may have already peaked.

The growing trend will be even MORE in-the-box, albeit with smaller selection of high-quality plug-ins.

Jim Rosebrook, post: 384209 wrote: I believe with the shift to the AAX format, many in "pro-audio" will thin out their messy collections of mediocre plug-ins, and stay focused on a smaller selection of well-crafted, "new" plug-ins.

The growing trend will be even MORE in-the-box, albeit with smaller selection of high-quality plug-ins.

I totally agree there and why AVID will not survive as a hardware based company.

Jim Rosebrook, post: 384209 wrote:

And as for the growth in hybrid systems???? I think that approach may have already peaked.

Oh my, big topic so boiled to death but it is fun.

What's peaked is the information about hybrid. Its now humming along. I call this the great divide. Well designed modular summing systems with sophisticated routeing capabilities including some consoles that integrate well with DAW's, is whats happening.
Over time DAW's and analog hardware are going to integrate better with each other, and then there is the vintage gear that will just stay the way it is :) This is where Pro Audio lives.

This sonic awareness is streaming into all area's of this industry right down to young musicians ( real musicians) not wanting their music so digital and boring sounding. 100% ITB is not unique sounding and that alone is enough sign of change.

Absolutely plug-ins will continue to improved along side with computers. The more people use plug-ins, the more the wanker industry will develop a generic sound print to a point it eats itself and be impossable to make money as a commercial studio. (Plug-in Studios) The pro audio industry as we once knew it will have no meaning to this generation. This is happening now and what I refer to as the Great Divide. Analog is alive and well in the high end world.

As long as Avid is trying to compete in the plug-in world, they will be fighting a loosing battle because the plug-in world is open game and not loyal . Anyone on the block with a fast computer can play this cheap game. Avid is trying to control the pro audio industry rather than work with its neighbor. Its all about greedy share holders and their vision of profiting off the wankers and video game crowd. All empires who want control like this, and who alienate half the population, fall.

High end analog integration will always be part of real pro audio. There are only so many plug-ins you need in the pro audio world, and less is more when it comes to rich sounding acoustic music. Plug-ins are for the electronic world more than they are for the acoustic world. The acoustic world is pro audio. The electronic world is stepping further and further away from pro audio. How is AVID going to convince me to buy into that BS anymore. Its the curse. No thanks, I see it much different now that I am back into analog. Its a solid and open sound that doesn't have conflicts and need software upgrades all the time, just to keep working. What a money sucking racket.

Pro Tools is a terrible DAW for electronic music. Ableton Live and Fruity Loops are a few that excel. Samplitude and Sequoia are all you need for a high end tracking and composing DAW. I just don't see Avids vision anymore. They died in 2005.

After 30 years in the profssional electronic world, and 30 years experience as an acoustic musician, I see it much different than the people following the tail end of this has been company.

Back to you :) smoke

Jim Rosebrook, post: 384139 wrote: Chartering a path for product development is a tough game... LOTS of back-seat drivers waiting to criticize.

Today, AVID can feel pretty good about some of it's decisions... excellent quarterly report released last night, first quarterly profit in 4 years, BIG stock jump....

[[url=http://[/URL]="http://www.reuters…"]Avid shares surge on first profit in 4 years | Reuters[/]="http://www.reuters…"]Avid shares surge on first profit in 4 years | Reuters[/]

What a joke, troll, shill what duh... Are you working for Avid or trying to increase the stocks for a week.

http://www.gearslutz.com/board/so-much-gear-so-little-time/697751-congrats-avid.html

The Byre, post: 0 wrote: Just remember that this jump in share price comes as a direct result of a tiny profit that came from Apple changing Final Cut to no longer do EDLs.

Avid shares have in fact lost 45% of their value in the past year. The company has been in full turnaround mode since last summer, when management started issuing downright depressing guidance numbers. At the start of this fiscal year, Avid thought it could reach about $710 million in revenue in 2011. That quickly shrunk to $700 million, then $670 million. The final full-year tally landed at $678 million, still far short of the original, happy outlook.

Avid's Media Composer and the Adobe Systems Premiere Pro still see Final Cut defectors making the switch, including some high-profile users like reality TV producers Bunim/Murray. Avid CEO Gary Greenfield made a point of landing the Bunim/Murray account and talked about stealing customers from Final Cut. But he wanted to make it look like an Avid achievement, not Apple's mistake.

Greenfield doesn't see any growth opportunity in 2012. "We're taking a focus on how we can improve our profitability with no growth," he told analysts on the earnings call. So he'll take any revenue growth that falls in his lap, particularly in the high profit professional market at the expense of low-margin enthusiast sales. But he's essentially admitting that sales growth is dead in Avid's core markets.

So there's little or no sales growth ahead, and Avid has become a margin story from head to toe and there's that Apple-made opportunity that seems to be slipping through management's fingers. Adobe, on the other hand, is accelerating.

The market analysts absolutely hate Avid, but if Greenfield can turn the company around and make it into an old-fashioned engineering company that churns out steady profits, then this might be one of those cases where they are going to have to eat their words.

We shall see . . .

AVID's critical next step for music production is control surfaces. We have not yet seen the full benefit of their acquisition of Euphonix. All of their current control surface products are carry-overs.

Spreading the Eucon protocol, along with a major re-think of the relationship between control lay-out and plug-in GUI.... this has great potential.

High-end, midrange, low-end.

It's all about smooth, transparent workflow.

The gear will get out of the way, and the music will be focus.... any and all genres.

audiokid, post: 384220 wrote: What a joke, troll, shill what? Are you working for Avid or trying to increase the stocks for a week?

None of the above.

Our industry has had a tough stretch over the last 5 years and it is encouraging to see signs of success.

I want audio manufactures to be successful so they can continue to evolve the cool stuff we want to use.

We're spending tons of cash on something we already had right, putting so much energy into creating a controller for what, so were can turn plug-ins on and off like hardware. And again, how many plug-ins do you need? Really, I would like to know how many plug-ins do you and others really need?

this really seems like a trap more than anything.

Think about it. You buy their software that needs plug-ins. But you can only use a few before you need more DSP, so you invest in more DSP and then buy more plug-ins to fix more of the zzzzz and squish. And then you need more DSP again. But then your CP starts to bog and you are forced to upgrade. But then you have conflicts and you need to upgrade your software, and then your plug-ins start to have conflicts all over again. Eventaully your entire investment is obsolete, Apple bails on making this particular CP and then you need to what? Avid is waiting for you and announces a deal. They give you way more for your trade than street, and in good will, toss in some free plug-ins like a crack dealer. But then you are going to need more DSP to run this new generation of plug-ins! so.... it goes on and on.
But wait, now there is a controller on the horizon to help you control all these plug-ins, but only this version of software will work with Avid.

I see the marvel, and love technology, especially MIDI , sequencing and basic automation but its starting to become idiotic to me. Its a money sucking racket that is derailing us from recording. People are getting it. Its turning recording into a computer game which doesn't have to be this automated and plastic sounding. What is pro audio?

Storage and editing is where this all really shines. The rest of it is all about quantiy, not quality. Its about selling software and how to make it just affordable enough for the mass to do damage, while restricting competition that is good for our industry. Its smart business and worked for a good stretch but we shall see how long Avid can continue this game. Mass homes studios aren't doing us any sonic favours. Shareholders don't care about quality.
How many plug-ins do you really need?

I think we have just been "suffering" the 30-year "start" of the digital revolution.... complete with twists, turns, steep climbs and plateaus..

These issues will seem "quaint" in due time...

The technology will evolve to point of functional transparency and the music will remain ... in all it's many forms.

Jim Rosebrook, post: 384223 wrote: None of the above.

Our industry has had a tough stretch over the last 5 years and it is encouraging to see signs of success.

I want audio manufactures to be successful so they can continue to evolve the cool stuff we want to use.

You say audio manufacturers, what audio manufacturers are these?

audiokid, post: 384226 wrote: You say audio manufacturers, what audio manufacturers are these?

I use stuff from lots of different manufacturers... So I'd like them all to thrive in a healthy marketplace.

But as I imagine a "dream system" that is operationally "transparent" as it might exist 3-5 years from now..... such a system is more likely to emerge from a company like AVID or PreSonus, or UAD, or ????....

I don't really care who makes it.... I am just looking forward to using it.

And if these companies are profitable... that day will come sooner.

Jim Rosebrook, post: 384227 wrote: I use stuff from lots of different manufacturers... So I'd like them all to thrive in a healthy marketplace.

But as I imagine a "dream system" that is operationally "transparent" as it might exist 3-5 years from now..... such a system is more likely to emerge from a company like AVID or PreSonus, or UAD, or ????....

I don't really care who makes it.... I am just looking forward to using it.

And if these companies are profitable... that day will come sooner.

I see PreSonus and UA in this picture but I don't see Avid looking too stable. Avid has deep pocket but they have lost the new generation and many older. UA is doing it right. They are the one to watch for now.

Well, I am passionate about this business and very much care who makes it ( as in survives). I'm 100% in support for the boutique companies that make the real stuff.

An 1176LN just arrived today, I can't wait to insert it into my hybrid rig :) thumb Fun chatting with you. Please stick around.

Cheers!

(y)

Have fun with the 1176....

I don't want to bash but it's so darn easy.

If you're a Pro Tools user and are subscribed to any of the newsletters you must get these but I just thought I'd post some highlights. I do appreciate that idea scale is how PT9 came about and that Avid are reading these for ideas. I know they also sometimes listen but here are just a few. There are literally pages of this stuff.

Bring back DV Toolkit to CPTK upgrade path for limited time
01/07/2012 (Active)

Clip Gain Breaks Nudge Functionality
02/09/2012 (Active)

Parallel Compression Bug
02/08/2012 (Active)

Sluggish operation in playlist view with multiple takes
01/23/2012 (Active)

Fix -9129 bugs with HD Native cards
01/27/2012 (Active)

I would like to caution people here who may be equating Avid's financial prospects to the future success or failure of Pro Tools. I do some work at TV stations in the Washington, DC area and all of the places that I work have massive Avid installations of Media Composer, Isis, Interplay, & Capture managers. The smallest of these is in the multi-$ hundred thousand range. A $25,000 HDX system is pocket change when compared to these systems.

The situation now is that there isn't any substantial competitor. Final Cut Pro shot itself in the foot last summer when they cut back on networked support. I understand that most of the functionality was restored since then after severe screaming by users but the message persists, Apple is more interested in the highly lucrative home market than the relatively limited commercial market.

Now please don't take my comments as an incentive to purchase Avid stock. I don't own any myself. But also please don't assume that a bleak future for Pro Tools means a bleak future for Avid.

btw, running PT 10.1.2 here on Win 7/64 bit with no problems.

you guys are so wrong about avid loosing market share, persons is still looked at as non pro gear, and so is just about everything else, every "pro" studio has access to a avid rig of some kind, this can't be said for anything else. People who shy away from avid are just not accepting things at this point. It isn't about a 30K hd rig anymore, Avid has played to the consumer and yet most of you still can't realize it because you have invested so heavily in other technology. I think the real joke is on non avid users

running pt 10 with fire face on 10.7.3 NO ISSUES, NEVER HAD AN AVID ISSUE...EVER

Steve@Russo, post: 388879 wrote: you guys are so wrong about avid loosing market share, persons is still looked at as non pro gear, and so is just about everything else, every "pro" studio has access to a avid rig of some kind, this can't be said for anything else. People who shy away from avid are just not accepting things at this point. It isn't about a 30K hd rig anymore, Avid has played to the consumer and yet most of you still can't realize it because you have invested so heavily in other technology. I think the real joke is on non avid users

running pt 10 with fire face on 10.7.3 NO ISSUES, NEVER HAD AN AVID ISSUE...EVER

Wow, that was a left hook from a guy working OTB! howdy But I liked it.
hehe, I disagree 100% so take that. Avid's best years are behind them. The new gen doesn't have the coin to play that game anymore. We have computers now. At least for a while. Your country needs to get your economy in order and the music business back together again before Avid does it to us all over again. smoke

But that doesn't mean I think they are done by any long shot. They can milk the industry for another decade before anyone catches on, even if they do loose market share.
I'm waiting for the s m o k e to clear with them before I drop a dime on them though. Right now its pretty smokey standing on the outside looking in.

I hope I'm wrong and they do better than ever this next 18 months.

Well, I don't know how it is in any other town but in this one, if you don't have Pro Tools stems when you go to a get your mix done, you won't get too far. They expect it and if you don't have that you get two things:

1. They look at you like you're a loser.
2. They ask you to export every track to individual files front to back.
   class="xf-ul">
   That is not to say they couldn't work with BWAV files but it can be unreliable. Even then there's potential issues with any file that is not exported from a Pro Tools session.

   Like it or not, Pro Tools is the professional standard. As poor a standard as that is. VHS won over BETA remember? Then only some post production suites used Betamax. Beta was a better format. The picture quality is better but VHS beat out the Beta. The best option doesn't always make the standard. It's usually the guy with the most push.

   The coding in Pro Tools is just starting to get better. They're finally cleaning up the mess but they are making their customers pay for it every step of the way. As if it's our fault that Pro Tools is buggy. It IS buggy. I'm NOT the only one who feels this way. And, let's face it, they're playing catch up still. Other DAWs have grown leaps and bounds beyond Pro Tools.

   They have the market. Should that change? Probably. Will it? Probably not. There's way too many people invested into it to take the damage. And there are far too many egos unwilling to admit it was a lame investment.

   Now I stand by what I said regarding the post production crowd. That is Avid's market and they are pretty unbeatable in that department. The size of their projects requires a lot of power. The DSP power isn't just for plugins. It's for file management and routing. They have the movie industry by the cahones.

   Where the movie industry is headed is another thing altogether. Technology has a way of maming the media arts.

just responding to this thread because i casually read an article in mix about technicolor's new rooms, and they enjoyed the, isolation & system compatibilty throughout the new facilty.

I love this saying,

Once you go HD, you are digi's bitch smoke

I thought it might be a good time to look at this again. Four months after the peak here is Avid's stock profile: [[url=http://[/URL]="http://ir.avid.com/…"]Avid Technology, Inc. - Stock Information[/]="http://ir.avid.com/…"]Avid Technology, Inc. - Stock Information[/]

At the time this was posted, they are at $6.77. I'm not a gambling man but it's either a good time to buy Avid stock or a good time to dump it. Pro Tools 11 is on the horizon. I'm thinking a very new super interface is on the Horizon. Depending on how they market at NAMM, they are either setting themselves up for a major boon or a final collapse.

Thoughts?

I expect to see something like the Apollo.

What might kill them is their pricing policy. If they demand a premium from their very recent Pro Tools 10 users to upgrade to Pro Tools 11, there will be outrage. Conversely, if they give Pro Tools 10 users a break and give that same break to Pro Tools 8/9 users, there will be outrage. If they don't pull a monkey out of their sphincter this year, things will look awful gloomy.

Imagine I'm John McLaughlin.

Issue 1!!! AAX!: Avid MUST do something to get 3rd party plug in manufacturers to do AAX before PT11. I'm native so I'm ok now but the HDX users are being left high & dry already. That will be the case for everyone including the natives when PT11 arrives. I can't believe that any major studio can exist without Waves & Antares plug-ins. Fortunately PT 10 seems to work well as I expect to be using it for a long time so I can continue to use RTAS plug-ins.

Issue 2!!! Hardware!: UAD is 'eating their lunch' on the hardware front. It is going to take a really spectacular product to beat this. Too bad Avid doesn't have much cash. The best strategy would be to purchase UAD and let the experts there do hardware. The Omni is pitiful....the m-audio interfaces have more capability.

Issue 3!!! Pricing!: There was outrage at the pricing last fall. As Huseph so accurately pointed out in his post above, they have backed themselves into a corner.

Prediction!!!: PT11 will be delayed until 2013 at least. Those few big Hollywood studios that really need 64 bit memory addressing will be given beta copies for evaluation with non-disclosure agreements to keep them happy and shut them up.

Bye, Bye!!!

I bet AVID has thought about acquiring UA more than once. This reminds me of Yahoo turning down the option to buy Google before Google become what it is now. Yahoo thought they were bigger than they were and bye bye Yahoo.

I could be wrong but I'm guessing that a large percentage of music ( 20 years and younger crowd) today is not created on Pro Tools anymore. The new generation is using Ableton Live, Fruity Loops and other loop creation DAWs that kick Pro Tools right out the arena.

I just finished chatting with a group of future engineers who have ZERO interest in AVID. And this is streaming throughout the pop culture like fashion does in the clothing industry. Pro Tools is no longer cool. AVID has priced themselves out of the market and created a hole for so many other DAW's to fit in. And they missed the generation that is the future engineers.

If its this far already ( the shift in DAW choices for pop music), I'd be really Leary in investing in this company. Glad I dumped them 10 years ago is all I can say and chose to go modular. If they do however, get out of the hardware business, I will most likely buy the software. All I see right now is a really top heavy company chasing concepts based around Apple and I don't have a lot of faith in Apple as a high end recording platform anymore either.

We really need a dedicated OS just for music. Its why I was drawn to the MPC 60, Emulator 11 and other dedicated workstations like they used to make before the PC came on board. IMHO, once computer recording set in, it has been a downward spiral of compatibility and chasing the tail. Its no wonder all the new music sounds like its being composed by a bunch of kids trying to deal with latency and timing issues. No wonder we have so much loop based music.

Thanks for bringing this topic up again Hue, I always need a good AVID bashing as part of my monthly diet lol!

My pleasure really.

I want AVID to wake up. I want them to figure this out. I like the workflow in Pro Tools but I hate the software. It has been glitchy for me. No. I haven't gone to PT10 yet and I won't buy the upgrade until I see what happens with PT11(which[rumour has it] is in beta as we speak). When they go full on 64 bit and it has been road tested, I will either buy PT 10 or go straight for PT11 depending on reviews.

I don't buy into the hype of Pro Tools 10 right now. Sure, "it's the most stable Pro Tools to date" but that's just catch up. They should have been shooting for stable at version 1 and should have reached it by 6 and then some. PT 8 should not have been the dog that it was. PT 9 has so many glaring issues it's pathetic.

I know there are people out there calling me a "hater" or a pessimist. I'm neither. I'm a realist. Anybody who has dealt with any other DAW knows how poorly coded Pro Tools has been in the past. After more than 12 years, you think they would have gotten it right? Nope. Get over yourselves Avid. The world does not revolve around you and though I want to believe that a "boutique" DAW has a place in modern music, I want to be treated like a "boutique" customer. That is, with respect and as an intelligent individual. Not like an idiot drone who will buy anything because it has their name on it.

Pardon me. Am I ranting?

Sorry bout that.

The problem is, its software dependent and as soon as anything is software dependent, its an ongoing nightmare of compatibility.

Personally, all I need is something that works, that is simple but very good at what it does. How hard can this be.
I then invest in hardware that I can use for years on end and select a la carte to build the system best suited for me. But the problem we are all faced in this digital quagmire, these DAW's keep forcing us to upgrade, chasing the never ending battle of making sure we are compatible and finally right working and sounding. Its really ridiculous and so obvious. How many times have you thought the last plug-in was accurate to what it was advertised as, but to only learn a year later that it has been improved. If we all looked at it the other way around, that it is shit and we will need to keep replacing it with more shit, I think hybrid starts looking pretty right. But ya, its expensive if we want it all now. But if we could get one piece at a time, the right pieces and do it that way, I personally think music wild be a lot better than it sounds right now. I think we would sound more real and not so friken plastic and recycled.

Hybrid and a stable DAW is IMO, the only way to go. All this plug-in BS is doing is wasting our time and forcing us to keep fixing shit and sounding more and more automated and artificial. We are so not happy just being human.
Look at forums now ( not just here but everywhere), almost no one is talking about gear anymore.

Keep the ranting, its a hot topic and a good one.

After a career move away from pro audio, and a lot of time away from recording.org, it's very entertaining to see that the PT debate remains almost completely unchanged.

The more things change, the more they stay the same!

Carry on.

Good to see you back Jamie!