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bossa 27 December 2004

First let me say that this is a great forum. I've been reading it all day and have heard many opinions on many things.

Regarding the computer recording choices available, I see that some folks out there don't like one or the other. I have about $2000 to invest for a computer and/or software & interface. I want to be able to record bands live in my studio as well as multi-tracking. I currently have 2 ADATs and a little outboard gear and I would like to make a good match-up with the new equipment, although once i get things in the computer realm, I would probably put the ADATs out to pasture.
My problem is I feel so ignorant of computer recording. I prefer analog but want to record clients in my small studio (http://www.houseofbossa.com) and this means modernizing. I don't invisage "upgrading" my computer/ plugins/software on a constant basis because I don't go for that. I hope I can find something that works and stick with it without getting into the techno race. I don't want to try and stay compatible with the big studios. I just want the advantage of having a user-friendly editing/mixing machine that I may also be able to sequence on at some point. I will probably be buying a stand-alone computer for music-only use. The mbox seems to have only 2 inputs..no good. So the choice seems to be between the 002R or a MOTU unit such as the 828mkII. I don't know what I don't know, so let me ask a few questions.
It seems that when mixing in the computer, I would be using predominantly software effects/compressors etc. Whose are best, Digidesign or motu? Is it possible to still use my outboard gear on individual tracks during mixdown?
Which maufacturer makes it easiest to actually get your analog audio (whether from a mike or other sound source) into the computer?
Whose screen layout is easiest to follow and the most user friendly.
Does anyone prefer one MOTU unit over another? (within the $700-$1200 range)
All help and advice is greatly appreciated.

Shaun,
House of Bossa

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Comments

ghellquist Mon, 12/27/2004 - 15:04

Hi Shaun,
some humble opinions.

I started out using an MBox a few years ago. Upgraded this year to Motu 828mkII and Samplitude.

The MBox came at a really good price when starting up. I think there are a few contenders around at the same kind of price/feature level, but I´ll stick to what I know.

The upgrade came about since I needed / wanted more channel. One viable option was the 002R. It would work with ProTools LE which is both capable and stable. But I always felt sort of "locked in", as it requires a DigiDesign interface connected to even start the software.

So I started at the other end, finding the best software for my usage. What I do is almost exclusively is on location recording, for later mixing and burning to CD. I very rarely use any midi stuff.

My choice ended up beeing Samplitude from many reasons. Foremost, things mixed in Sam seems to sound better than in PT to my ears. And given the amount and quality of the built-in effects, I´ve stopped longing for buying a lot of plugins, something I believe all PT LE users will never stop dreaming of.

After selecting software, I checked out hardware, and decided on the Motu 828mkII plus an external 8 channel mic preamp. This gives me 10 channels of mic inputs.

In total this was more expensive than the 002R bundle, but it has served me really well and I would not change anything in the selection right now.

Good luck in your search

Gunnar

bossa Mon, 12/27/2004 - 17:54

Well, I did a little search and spent 2 hours reading stuff. It's all very interesting but I come up with this... I will be spending about the same amount whether I get Protools LE 002R, or motu plus some software. People don't like Pro tools...arrgh...protools bad.... Ok. I get it. The converters in both are about the same. The price is about the same. I was hoping this would be simple.....damn!

I guess I'm really asking about ease of use. ie; how easy is it to make the darn thing work. If 002R has hardware that matches up with the software, great. And if the screen is easy to follow, even better.
With a Motu 828mkII, does anyone know the preferred software? I want to record instruments AND sequence. And will it work with a PC? I suppose I would have a wider choice of software with Motu, but seeing as I don't know one from the other..... Is it easier to track multiple channels with Motu in a live situation?

Freedom of choice is what we've got, freedom from choice is what we want....Devo(I think)

LittleDogAudio Tue, 12/28/2004 - 08:58

I have both Protools Le w/002R and a Nuendo system w/Apogee A/D's.
For ease-of-use, I'd pick the 002R. I personally like the way Protools looks and feels. It was the fastest to learn and very easy to start working with.

I have to say the Nuendo system sounds better. But at a price point, the 002R is a great value, especially with the bundles that Digi offers.

I pay no alliegance to either system, they are merely tools of the trade and if you are a good engineer, you will get good results.
Never blame your tools.

My .02
Chris

iznogood Tue, 12/28/2004 - 17:05

"people don't like protools"

:? :? :? :?

is that why digidesign can't keep up with the demands of thounsands of eager customers just waiting to buy a digi002r????

for tracking and mixing nothing beats PT....period!!!

for midi sequencing it is not perfect... but in contrast to what some say.... very usable

oh and by the way run it on a mac or get in trouble!!!

if you're on pc go for a combination of cubase sx3 and rme !

anonymous Wed, 12/29/2004 - 11:12

I have an 828MkII with DP4 and an Mbox with PTle. As far as ease, PTle. But for capabilities, track/voice count, effects, MIDI, overall "in-depthness", DP4.5 smokes PTle 6.4. But it's not PC. The only problem I have with the 828MkII and DP4, is... everybody knows the name and wants it in ProTools. It's like, if you don't run PT you don't know anything. IMHO it's the name, not the program. The program seems like a toy compared to DP. But because more of my associates run PT, the studios run PT if I ever need to track somewhere else (say drums in a nice room), or remix/master from another studio, I have been considering upgrading the MBox to a 002r for $800, and dumping the 828. But, I do a lot of MIDI that aint PTs bag.

My only other option is DigiTranslator @ $500. I tried the DigiTranslator last night, converting PT to DP4 and back and it worked GREAT! But, that's another topic.

bossa Wed, 12/29/2004 - 14:26

Thanks sevenone,
More good info. Sounds like you have the perfect set-up to answer my question too. The PTle is starting to sound a bit lame in some respects. I wonder if the 002R will improve people's opinion on the PTle set-up?
Latency also seems to be an issue. Can you tell me if the problem of latency with the 002R is a headache and/or is it as big of a problem with Motu?

All help much appreciated,

shaun
http://www.houseofbossa.com

anonymous Wed, 12/29/2004 - 15:25

Well, as far as latency on the 002r, I only have the MBox. I've used the 002r in a studio about 6 months ago laying guitar, and there was a definate latency there. I think they were running on a G4 877, and he said they couldn't lower the buffer without dropouts. Wasn't horrible, but took a few takes to get used to. It could be just how they had set it all up, or their Mac, Ram, firewire, etc. I don't have a problem with the 002 in general, just the "le" software with it. I do think the 828 is better. but, that's just me, alot of other people think Digi is better.

Latency for my Mbox is noticable, but it only allows for 512 buffer I think. So, really nothing I can do about it. Plus, I hear the USB doesn't help.

I don't have any problem with latency on the 828MkII. Super fast. But, I'm running a Dual 2Ghz G5 with 2.5Gb RAM. Before the G5, I could get about 32-36 trx with a couple plugs throughout on my g4 1Ghz. It didn't like it though, but when tracking - still no latency. Especially if I use the CueMix.

I like Protools, everybody I know likes ProTools. It's easy, everybody has it. PTle is just so limiting. I just wish I could run the full version PT on an 002 or better yet an 828MkII.

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